Marantz m-cr603 with kef ls50.... Stupid idea?

[womble72]

So, I've been running my 603 with some monitor audio bx2's and it sounds ok. With an £800 budget and my local hifi shop doing a deal on ls50 with £160 off with a trade in for old kef speakers (which I have in the studio), would this be a good idea or should I be spending my money elsewhere/on some other speakers?

 

[BigH]

I think Kef LS50s need a better amp than the one in the 603, someone else upgraded from BX2s to Kef R100s and was very pleased.

 

[womble72]

Yes, I had read that someone upgraded from bx2 to the r100. It was this £160 off the ls50 with a trade in that got me thinking of an upgrade to the ls50's.

 

[plastic penguin]

Andrew Everard reviewed the 603 with PMC GB1is and said the sound was very good. http://www.gramophone.co.uk/editorial/marantz-m-cr603-a-compact-solution-packed-with-performance

Given the GB1is are £1600 speaker, the Kefs are certainly worth trying.

 

[womble72]

Thanks PP. I had read the same review and I'm curious to find out just how far I can go with this little wonder machine. I'll see if the dealer will let me demo the ls50's with the marantz

 

[BigH]

Only way is to hear them preferably at home but try the R100 as well, Im sure you can get a deal on them.

 

[BigH]

Just came across this review: "So i have spent some time in a demo room today! But sadly not with any of the main contenders for my proposed mid life crisis system. However as well as building a proper system for life i do also want to extract more sound from my little Marantz MCR603 so stop reading if your not interested in the following comments on wallet friendly non serious hifi components which dont relate to the original topic but stay with me if youre bored enough and it may help you to understand my preferences for my main system! So anyway i am currently running the Marantz 603 with MA Bx2's which arent doing the business on the bass which is very boomy and boxy sounding instead of smooth and rich although i am running them flush to sidewalls and 5 inches from rear so they havent much room to play in. The what hifi review said positioning wasnt an issue with these speakers but i speak from extensive experience that that statement is utter rubbish.

I have played the BX in the middle of my 6x6m room on the carpet on the floor and layed down in front of them they actually sound really quite good for £250! But i cant be lying down on my worn out 30 year old back all the time and tripping over my speakers so i spent a bit of time listening to the following at the dealer and put them all in a similar position to how my BX2s are set up in my home which was essential to get an idea of their tonal balance under such circumstances. They are listed in order of how i played them....

1st up MA Silver RX2 - First off the Bass from the 8inch woofer is fantastic much deeper than the 6.5 on the BX2 and the highs are better sounding slightly brighter but more natural which is more important.

2nd up Kef R100 - Again astonished how such a small speaker (considerably smaller than BX2 let alone the comparatively massive RX2) can produce almost the same bass extension as the Rx2. Tonally it sounded almost the same as the MA not over bright at all. I did notice abit of bass bloom but less than my BX2 but not as smooth as the RX2's. The biggest negative of these was It actually made me think the Marantz unit is actually much better than what you would expect of a £350 all in one system and spending more on speakers is not a diminishing return.

3rd and finally KEF LS50, a speaker so highly regarded and talked about i could resist hearing them and seeing what the big deal was about. Certainly it had the most detail and again bright tonally but seemingly not fatiguing. Its certainly created a very 3d soundstage compared to the others which i liked and hearing individual notes was easiest too. One problem though, lack of bass extension and a deal breaker for me! In every respect but for bass i thought this was the best speaker. Just to be sure it wasnt the marantz driving them we attached them to a Roksan K2 kandy amp which offers alot more power and current the the M603 and although the sound was better still the bass was reticent

I guess i cant fully understand the fuss with the LS50 really? I would much rather listen to speakers that do Bass, Mid and Treble all good than one which does Mid and Treble excellently but is Bass shy!?"

 

[camcroft]

Have you tried the RX1`s

 

[BigH]

The B&W CM1s have quite a few fans who use the Marantz 603. I wuld say they are worth trying but I would not put them near to walls/corners.

 

[megatombomb]

As per above 'review' i have tried 4 speakers on the MCR603. The LS50 does sound good but you should consider a better amp than what is within the MCR603 as the speakers arent very sensitive and i found them to be lacking in bass-fulness. I think this is also the speakers tonal balance though as i have also heard them connected to Audiolab 8200cd and Roksan Kandy K2 amp and although the LS50's had some very fine points the bass again was immediately dissappointing.

I would not recommend Monitor Audio BX2 (my own speakers) again on their own due to lack of bass but i do run a sub from my MCR603 sub out to make up for some of the BX2 failings.

The Kef R100 has seriously impressive bass for its size much better than my somewhat bigger BX2 (i dont know quite how it does that!) but i still found the MA RX2 to be the best speaker ive heard with the MCR its only flaw being its a big ****** to accomodate.

 

[BigH]

That is true about the LS50s they are no very sensitive and certainly did not come alive until about 10-11 o'clock, one reason I won't be buying as at low levels they just sounded so distant, I did not mind the lack of deep bass, infact some others like CM1s seemed to have too much bass and the balance/integration was not right to me.

 

[womble72]

Thanks for the replies, gang, you have been really helpful. One of the things I hate about the BX2's is that at low volumes they sound very thin, to my ears, and I have to crank them up to wake them up and then they just sound ok and nothing special. I shall look into the Rx1 and the kef r100. I still like the size of the Neat Iota but unable to demo them.

 

[BigH]

That is true about the LS50s they are no very sensitive and certainly did not come alive until about 10-11 o'clock, one reason I won't be buying as at low levels they just sounded so distant, I did not mind the lack of deep bass, infact some others like CM1s seemed to have too much bass and the balance/integration was not right to me.

The CM1s are not so sensitive either. I thought the Rega RS1s would be a good choice for me but did not like them at all, closed in, veiled the Cm1s were much more open.

 

[BigH]

The new AE 301s maybe worth hearing, best not to rush into it. Or Epos Epic 2s but they are a bit larger.

 

[plastic penguin]

Or even PMC DB1is are fabulous at low volumes.

 

[BigH]

Or even PMC DB1is are fabulous at low volumes.

Are they, I did not think so and I much preferred the Kef LS50s.

 

[plastic penguin]

Or even PMC DB1is are fabulous at low volumes.

Are they, I did not think so and I much preferred the Kef LS50s.

TBH, can't comment on the IS50s, but one of my main privisos is to have a system proficient at low-levels, due to little'un and my late night listenings, and the DB1s came very close to the RS6s.

 

[chebby]

Thanks for the replies, gang, you have been really helpful. One of the things I hate about the BX2's is that at low volumes they sound very thin, to my ears, and I have to crank them up to wake them up and then they just sound ok and nothing special. I shall look into the Rx1 and the kef r100. I still like the size of the Neat Iota but unable to demo them.

It takes a couple of seconds to toggle DBB* (Dynamic Bass Boost) on the M-CR603 if you just need to add a little 'body' at low volumes. (Just remember to switch it out again when you turn it up.)

This tends to be a function of our hearing at very low volume levels, rather than particular loudspeaker traits.

So I would advise getting the best loudspeaker you like - that you can afford - and just use the DBB on those occasions when very low volume is required.

*Press 'DBB/Tone' button on the remote once, then use the left and right arrows to switch DBB on or OFF. The display will confirm with 'DBB/ON' or 'DBB/OFF'.

 

[antskip]

Only answer to the question is to try the KEF LS50's out with your system or similar. For my modest amp power, I find them wonderful all across the range, always with amazing transparency and detail. From its specs the Marantz CR603 should have sufficient oomph - but the LS50's will let you know within a few seconds if they like its other qualities. Honesty works both ways.

 

[nopiano]

Just a comment on the price. I was amazed to see the LS50s were being sold at 15% off at the Bristol Show last month, so that's £680, and you get to sell your own speakers!

As to the key question, if you have a smallish room and/or don't play too loud they should sound good. But clearly will be better with a grander amp, so home trial is vital (more vital than the px!).

 

[BigH]

Just a comment on the price. I was amazed to see the LS50s were being sold at 15% off at the Bristol Show last month, so that's £680, and you get to sell your own speakers!

As to the key question, if you have a smallish room and/or don't play too loud they should sound good. But clearly will be better with a grander amp, so home trial is vital (more vital than the px!).

Really if they sold direct at £680 they were making a mint as I'm sure they would not get nearly that much from a dealer.

As said before I did not find them at all good for low volumes, felt they needed a bit of wellie to get going that is why I not buying them. Will look at Epos Epics next if I can find any.

 

[Thompsonuxb]

I'm always amazed at the size of some standmount speakers on stands, the Epic 2 are huge and have a bigger footprint than many floorstanding designs......

 

[plastic penguin]

I'm always amazed at the size of some standmount speakers on stands, the Epic 2 are huge and have a bigger footprint than many floorstanding designs......

Surely that's good. Almost a throwback to the old days when most bookshelf speakers used to pull down walls. Agree though if going for one of these you're better off with a compact floorstander.

 

[Thompsonuxb]

I'm always amazed at the size of some standmount speakers on stands, the Epic 2 are huge and have a bigger footprint than many floorstanding designs......

Surely that's good. Almost a throwback to the old days when most bookshelf speakers used to pull down walls. Agree though if going for one of these you're better off with a compact floorstander.

lol...many a buckled wall bracket and its why most of them end up on the floor anyway.

But reading this my thoughts were of the BX5, a perfect room friendly size or try the Dali zensor 5's with it.

 

[BigH]

I'm always amazed at the size of some standmount speakers on stands, the Epic 2 are huge and have a bigger footprint than many floorstanding designs......

Did not think they were that large: 415 x 210 x 280, taller than most yes.

As for getting floorstanders instead there is one difference the Epic 2s need to be Not less than 10 cm (4”) from rear wall, don't think many floorstanders recomend that, also lots of other reasons not to buy floorstanders esp. at that price.