Again, a question for them, but my impression would be: maybe not as intensively as they did with the new line-up.
southdownswolf
Well-known member
Thing is, What Hifi panel might like one sound, but who is to say that all the other magazines around the UK/Europe/World will like the same sound?
Yamaha might have new engineers that prefer a different sound to the previous engineers.
Componants that were used in previous models may be discontinued so the sound has to change.
So many variables.
Yamaha might have new engineers that prefer a different sound to the previous engineers.
Componants that were used in previous models may be discontinued so the sound has to change.
So many variables.
chebby
Well-known member
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're all absolutely right, of course - the Yamaha engineers should be dragged before the court, preferably in chains, and made to account for their thinking and actions.
Sheesh, guys - get a life...
Sheesh, guys - get a life...
Reviewing other manufacturers equipment makes sensse if you are not getting good reviews, big sales etc. If your products are widely recognised as the best and sell well then perhaps you should concentrate on improving your own products without losing the company sound.
John Duncan
Well-known member
Andrew Everard:You're all absolutely right, of course - the Yamaha engineers should be dragged before the court, preferably in chains, and made to account for their thinking and actions
NOW you're talking.
NOW you're talking.
I bet all the poor sods who've spent hundreds on interconnects are kicking themselves. Needn't have spent more than £40!
John Duncan
Well-known member
Andrew Everard:
JohnDuncan:NOW you're talking.
A little overdressed for this office this morning, JD?
It's my day off, I always wear hats on my day off.
JohnDuncan:NOW you're talking.
A little overdressed for this office this morning, JD?
It's my day off, I always wear hats on my day off.
chebby:
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
chebby
Well-known member
giuliop:chebby:
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
chebby:giuliop:chebby:
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
TBH it still looks like a joke to me. So the "does well in reviews" sound is not necessarily a good sound; it's one that simply does well. Pardon me, but that makes me think of the most improbable situations, like Yamaha's engineers going, "How should we design our next amplifier?" "Well, we should give it the 'does well in reviews' sound". Or the journalist asking, "So how is this amplifier?" and his colleague, "Rubbish, but it has the 'does well in reviews' sound, so I'll give it 5 stars". Heck, they could even add it to the spec sheet, "Does well in reviews - Check", so the reviewer wouldn't even have to bother listening to it; after all, it does 'does well on reviews', doesn't it.
Jokes apart, I think that - if we want to believe the reviewers - an
amplifier that does well on reviews is a good amplifier, and not one
that has some impalpable quality that makes it do well no matter what.
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
TBH it still looks like a joke to me. So the "does well in reviews" sound is not necessarily a good sound; it's one that simply does well. Pardon me, but that makes me think of the most improbable situations, like Yamaha's engineers going, "How should we design our next amplifier?" "Well, we should give it the 'does well in reviews' sound". Or the journalist asking, "So how is this amplifier?" and his colleague, "Rubbish, but it has the 'does well in reviews' sound, so I'll give it 5 stars". Heck, they could even add it to the spec sheet, "Does well in reviews - Check", so the reviewer wouldn't even have to bother listening to it; after all, it does 'does well on reviews', doesn't it.
Jokes apart, I think that - if we want to believe the reviewers - an
amplifier that does well on reviews is a good amplifier, and not one
that has some impalpable quality that makes it do well no matter what.
grdunn123
Well-known member
giuliop:chebby:giuliop:chebby:
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
TBH it still looks like a joke to me. So the "does well in reviews" sound is not necessarily a good sound; it's one that simply does well. Pardon me, but that makes me think of the most improbable situations, like Yamaha's engineers going, "How should we design our next amplifier?" "Well, we should give it the 'does well in reviews' sound". Or the journalist asking, "So how is this amplifier?" and his colleague, "Rubbish, but it has the 'does well in reviews' sound, so I'll give it 5 stars". Heck, they could even add it to the spec sheet, "Does well in reviews - Check", so the reviewer wouldn't even have to bother listening to it; after all, it does 'does well on reviews', doesn't it.
Jokes apart, I think that - if we want to believe the reviewers - an amplifier that does well on reviews is a good amplifier, and not one that has some impalpable quality that makes it do well no matter what.
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
TBH it still looks like a joke to me. So the "does well in reviews" sound is not necessarily a good sound; it's one that simply does well. Pardon me, but that makes me think of the most improbable situations, like Yamaha's engineers going, "How should we design our next amplifier?" "Well, we should give it the 'does well in reviews' sound". Or the journalist asking, "So how is this amplifier?" and his colleague, "Rubbish, but it has the 'does well in reviews' sound, so I'll give it 5 stars". Heck, they could even add it to the spec sheet, "Does well in reviews - Check", so the reviewer wouldn't even have to bother listening to it; after all, it does 'does well on reviews', doesn't it.
Jokes apart, I think that - if we want to believe the reviewers - an amplifier that does well on reviews is a good amplifier, and not one that has some impalpable quality that makes it do well no matter what.
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
grdunn123:
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
Maybe. But then reviews wouldn't make any sense, and honestly I couldn't fathom why people that believe so would bother reading those reviews.
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
Maybe. But then reviews wouldn't make any sense, and honestly I couldn't fathom why people that believe so would bother reading those reviews.
grdunn123
Well-known member
giuliop:grdunn123:
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
Maybe. But then reviews wouldn't make any sense, and honestly I couldn't fathom why people that believe so would bother reading those reviews.
A review is usually nothing more than an extended 'snapshot' conducted by experts. Like art or music there is a certain amount of subjectivity in their opinions. There is absolutely no reaso wy anyone should read or heed the reviews in WHF magazine, go to the hifi shops and do your own factfinding.
This would obviously be the same for any sort of review publication be it for cars, music,fridge freezers or sex toys
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
Maybe. But then reviews wouldn't make any sense, and honestly I couldn't fathom why people that believe so would bother reading those reviews.
A review is usually nothing more than an extended 'snapshot' conducted by experts. Like art or music there is a certain amount of subjectivity in their opinions. There is absolutely no reaso wy anyone should read or heed the reviews in WHF magazine, go to the hifi shops and do your own factfinding.
This would obviously be the same for any sort of review publication be it for cars, music,fridge freezers or sex toys
Reality is more likely that Rotel, Nad etc., spend as much as, or more time, benchmarking Yamaha amps as Yamaha do theirs. Especially considering that benchmarking is only partially about functional performance, a lot of it is to find out how to reduce component and manufacturing costs, and replacing components with integrated circuits.
If I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development process, wouldn't do any harm.
If I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development process, wouldn't do any harm.
grdunn123:There is absolutely no reaso wy anyone should read or heed the reviews in WHF magazine, go to the hifi shops and do your own factfinding.
Thank you for your kind words of support.
Thank you for your kind words of support.
Veri:
If I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development process, wouldn't do any harm.
It wasn't mere PR - we saw the rival kit in the engineering department when visiting Yamaha Japan earlier this year. And it wasn't just kit we'd rated - it was every key product on the market around that price--point. Just core competitor analysis in action.
If I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development process, wouldn't do any harm.
It wasn't mere PR - we saw the rival kit in the engineering department when visiting Yamaha Japan earlier this year. And it wasn't just kit we'd rated - it was every key product on the market around that price--point. Just core competitor analysis in action.
Clare Newsome:Just core competitor analysis in action.
...As I'm sure every manufacturer does, not with an eye to Awards, but as part of the regular development process.
...As I'm sure every manufacturer does, not with an eye to Awards, but as part of the regular development process.
Dougal1331
Well-known member
I've been out of the loop for a few months, but just bought the latest mag and can't disagree with any of the team's choices.
Most of all, I'm chuffed to bits to see Mission taking a gong. Some of you may know I'm a chronic Mission fanatic, and it fills me with warm glowing glowing warmness that they're getting their act together again. Well done to the Huntingdon massive!
Most of all, I'm chuffed to bits to see Mission taking a gong. Some of you may know I'm a chronic Mission fanatic, and it fills me with warm glowing glowing warmness that they're getting their act together again. Well done to the Huntingdon massive!
Clare Newsome:Veri:
If I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development process, wouldn't do any harm.
It wasn't mere PR - we saw the rival kit in the engineering department when visiting Yamaha Japan earlier this year. And it wasn't just kit we'd rated - it was every key product on the market around that price--point. Just core competitor analysis in action.
I incorrectly used the term name dropping when referring to PR, allowing the media to visit your engineering department is also considered as PR in my opinion.
And yes I fully agree this is quite normal, both the PR and the benchmarking of competitor's products.
If I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development process, wouldn't do any harm.
It wasn't mere PR - we saw the rival kit in the engineering department when visiting Yamaha Japan earlier this year. And it wasn't just kit we'd rated - it was every key product on the market around that price--point. Just core competitor analysis in action.
I incorrectly used the term name dropping when referring to PR, allowing the media to visit your engineering department is also considered as PR in my opinion.
And yes I fully agree this is quite normal, both the PR and the benchmarking of competitor's products.
grdunn123:giuliop:chebby:giuliop:chebby:
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
TBH it still looks like a joke to me. So the "does well in reviews" sound is not necessarily a good sound; it's one that simply does well. Pardon me, but that makes me think of the most improbable situations, like Yamaha's engineers going, "How should we design our next amplifier?" "Well, we should give it the 'does well in reviews' sound". Or the journalist asking, "So how is this amplifier?" and his colleague, "Rubbish, but it has the 'does well in reviews' sound, so I'll give it 5 stars". Heck, they could even add it to the spec sheet, "Does well in reviews - Check", so the reviewer wouldn't even have to bother listening to it; after all, it does 'does well on reviews', doesn't it.
Jokes apart, I think that - if we want to believe the reviewers - an amplifier that does well on reviews is a good amplifier, and not one that has some impalpable quality that makes it do well no matter what.
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
Continuining this piont, is it not also true that certain manufacturers, mainly the Japanese ones, taylor some of their products specifically for the UK market, because we have certain preferences over the type of sound we like to hear, in comparison say, to the North American market ?? Surely this is also with a view to doing well in critical reviews which manufactureres have recognised are very influentuial on sales figures and popularity....
I hope Yamaha are not trying to produce equipment skewed towards doing well in reviews by making them sound like other manufacturer's amps that do well in reviews.
You're joking, right?
No.
Taken to it's logical conclusion, all amps in a price sector would end up sounding much the same rather than offering the consumer some diversity.
I doubt this will ever happen, industry wide, so the point is moot.
TBH it still looks like a joke to me. So the "does well in reviews" sound is not necessarily a good sound; it's one that simply does well. Pardon me, but that makes me think of the most improbable situations, like Yamaha's engineers going, "How should we design our next amplifier?" "Well, we should give it the 'does well in reviews' sound". Or the journalist asking, "So how is this amplifier?" and his colleague, "Rubbish, but it has the 'does well in reviews' sound, so I'll give it 5 stars". Heck, they could even add it to the spec sheet, "Does well in reviews - Check", so the reviewer wouldn't even have to bother listening to it; after all, it does 'does well on reviews', doesn't it.
Jokes apart, I think that - if we want to believe the reviewers - an amplifier that does well on reviews is a good amplifier, and not one that has some impalpable quality that makes it do well no matter what.
This is not unusual....don't most driving instructors prepare their pupils to pass a test rather than to drive safely in the 'real world'?
Continuining this piont, is it not also true that certain manufacturers, mainly the Japanese ones, taylor some of their products specifically for the UK market, because we have certain preferences over the type of sound we like to hear, in comparison say, to the North American market ?? Surely this is also with a view to doing well in critical reviews which manufactureres have recognised are very influentuial on sales figures and popularity....
Veri:Clare Newsome:Veri:
If
I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named
dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development
process, wouldn't do any harm.
It wasn't mere PR -
we saw the rival kit in the engineering department when visiting Yamaha
Japan earlier this year. And it wasn't just kit we'd rated - it was
every key product on the market around that price--point. Just core
competitor analysis in action.
I incorrectly
used the term name dropping when referring to PR, allowing the media to
visit your engineering department is also considered as PR in my
opinion.
And yes I fully agree this is quite normal, both the PR and the benchmarking of competitor's products.
Hence my use of the word 'mere' in my reply. I'm fully aware there was PR involved
If
I was part of Yamaha's PR team I would certainly make sure we named
dropped as many of WHF favorite amps when talking about the development
process, wouldn't do any harm.
It wasn't mere PR -
we saw the rival kit in the engineering department when visiting Yamaha
Japan earlier this year. And it wasn't just kit we'd rated - it was
every key product on the market around that price--point. Just core
competitor analysis in action.
I incorrectly
used the term name dropping when referring to PR, allowing the media to
visit your engineering department is also considered as PR in my
opinion.
And yes I fully agree this is quite normal, both the PR and the benchmarking of competitor's products.
Hence my use of the word 'mere' in my reply. I'm fully aware there was PR involved
ricardo65:
Continuining this piont, is it not also true that certain manufacturers, mainly the Japanese ones, taylor some of their products specifically for the UK market, because we have certain preferences over the type of sound we like to hear, in comparison say, to the North American market ?? Surely this is also with a view to doing well in critical reviews which manufactureres have recognised are very influentuial on sales figures and popularity....
Or you could also say it's down to wanting to tailor a product to suit the typical rooms and tastes of a nation.
Continuining this piont, is it not also true that certain manufacturers, mainly the Japanese ones, taylor some of their products specifically for the UK market, because we have certain preferences over the type of sound we like to hear, in comparison say, to the North American market ?? Surely this is also with a view to doing well in critical reviews which manufactureres have recognised are very influentuial on sales figures and popularity....
Or you could also say it's down to wanting to tailor a product to suit the typical rooms and tastes of a nation.
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