Help with cables

[TrevC]

TrevC, one thing puzzles me. Seeing that you're such a technical guru that knows better than audio professionals, music professionals, hi-fi manufacturers and hi-fi reviewers (at least in your own eyes) in numerous areas such as speakers, cables, footers, power supplies, etc, why are you still a nobody pontificating in a forum rather than the chief designer/owner of a company manufacturing the best measuring, best sounding, non-snake oiled, placebo-resistant hi-fi equipment in the world? :?

It's basic electronics really. One really doesn't need to be famous to understand it, it's all rather obvious once you do.

 

[Native_bon]

lol...... I need more pop corn.

The cable skeptics are getting a pretty good kicking in here.

Good job Hifikrazy...... :cheers:

They are?

Blind tested?

Honestly The Record Spot, I'm reading through this thread ( responded in the other "Help with cables" thread, thought this was a duplicate, only looked in when it grew passed 60replies or so ) the 'debate took its usuual route, the two sides standing firm then came the ' pros' don't use them 'bomb' countered with oh yes they do 'bomb' with quotes from reputable pro's.

Then watched with great amusment while the skeptics tried to debunk the quotes ...oh how I laughed last night, and you don't see that as a kicking (purely in an internet forum debate context).... really?

Well I dunno - hifikrazy imo gained great credability, while those opposing him looked really stupid/ignorant - others may have a different opinions, you may have all read me stating my speakers clearly distinguishes the differences cables can make - I honestly did'nt get involved in this thread till now simply because they always end this way.

But a thumbs up from me to hifikrazy.

 

[Native_bon]

lol...... I need more pop corn.

The cable skeptics are getting a pretty good kicking in here.

Good job Hifikrazy...... :cheers:

They are?

Honestly The Record Spot, I'm reading through this thread ( responded in the other "Help with cables" thread, thought this was a duplicate, only looked in when it grew passed 60replies or so ) the 'debate took its usuual route, the two sides standing firm then came the ' pros' don't use them 'bomb' countered with oh yes they do 'bomb' with quotes from reputable pro's.

Then watched with great amusment while the skeptics tried to debunk the quotes ...oh how I laughed last night, and you don't see that as a kicking (purely in an internet forum debate context).... really?

Well I dunno - hifikrazy imo gained great credability, while those opposing him looked really stupid/ignorant - others may have a different opinions, you may have all read me stating my speakers clearly distinguishes the differences cables can make - I honestly did'nt get involved in this thread till now simply because they always end this way.

But a thumbs up from me to hifikrazy.

Blind tested?.. Or your bias mind?

 

[Native_bon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3s7w1Rp9AlQ

Something I came across that might interest. I won't pretend to know if this video is just of four ******** artists spewing garbage, but if they are, then they seem quite convincing in delivering the BS. As far as the moderator is concerned, I wouldn't defend any negative remarks against him.

Is it only me... But they is something about their body language which does not seat well with me.. Does not give me any reason to believe in the video or cables.

 

[Native_bon]

I said it on here.. Multi million dollar sue with mis selling of cables will happen some time soon. Its happened in so many other fields of sales. Humans do anything to make money & I know cables is one of them... Most of the prices or not justifiable in anyway what so ever.

I have been to so many recording studios & also have a home setup my self, but would not justfy any expensive cable. The recording industry use standard cables in studios.. XLR cables are advised when using long run of cables.

Ok for arugment sake lets say it doers make a difference, if most people can not hear this difference it cannot really be much of a difference.

Even if you remove the very same cable from an input & plug it back it will seem to sound diffrent even when its the same cable.. Presentation & marketing is key here not sound.

This is really a big money making sector.. CABLES!!

 

[Thompsonuxb]

Lol.... Native_bon.

Honestly sometimes I wonder why all this passion over cables.

In my view the differences in hifi are subtle, fine details, nuances - its the diminishing return thing.

Generally speakinga £100 70watt amp sounds the same as a £10.000 70watt amp - if anyone here with golden ears or not was just walking by these two amps none would stop and say " hey, now thats a £10.000 amp playing right there ( speakers & source being fixed.)". How many have gone to countless auditions and struggled to hear real differences with the kit they're auditioning.

Subtle differences.

Cables are the same in this aspect - there are no night and day differences between them, its only when we sit and listen that we can appreciate the differences.

Fuller more harmonic bass, cleaner tops more defined midrange, nuances small differences that you can appreciate. The amount of contributers in this thread who have said this, some could care less & will be unable to justify the spend, some will appreciate the diffrences and see no problem spending.

But ...hey, these threads wake things up a bit and are a bit of fun, ultimately its up to the individuals, what they hear and what they'll spend.

Thats me done.

 

[Native_bon]

Lol.... Native_bon.

Honestly sometimes I wonder why all this passion over cables.

In my view the differences in hifi are subtle, fine details, nuances - its the diminishing return thing.

Generally speakinga £100 70watt amp sounds the same as a £10.000 70watt amp - if anyone here with golden ears or not was just walking by these two amps none would stop and say " hey, now thats a £10.000 amp playing right there ( speakers & source being fixed.)". How many have gone to countless auditions and struggled to hear real differences with the kit they're auditioning.

Subtle differences.

Cables are the same in this aspect - there are no night and day differences between them, its only when we sit and listen that we can appreciate the differences.

Fuller more harmonic bass, cleaner tops more defined midrange, nuances small differences that you can appreciate. The amount of contributers in this thread who have said this, some could care less & will be unable to justify the spend, some will appreciate the diffrences and see no problem spending.

But ...hey, these threads wake things up a bit and are a bit of fun, ultimately its up to the individuals, what they hear and what they'll spend.

Thats me done.

lol Truth has nothing to do with passion.. If anything your the one with the passion defending cables..Go into a shop selling studio recording equipment & tell them about cables & you will laughed at.. You basically saying the cables used in the studio to record your music you listen to is not good enough.. Am talking really expensive recording equipment here. Yet the cables in these studios may average £50 to £100 at most. I may be wrong but I very much thought it. If you want to waste your money on cables go on... After all its just a hobby. Or is it?

 

[Thompsonuxb]

What!!?....lol.....Native_bon, this was already covered refer to the bit by Hifikrazy,

That made me chuckle, honestly.... some of you guys are crazy.......

 

[Native_bon]

What!!?....lol.....Native_bon, this was already covered refer to the bit by Hifikrazy,

That made me chuckle, honestly.... some of you guys are crazy.......

Or really.. A mad man does not know he is mad cause he is mad... :rofl:

 

[TrevC]

Lol.... Native_bon.

Honestly sometimes I wonder why all this passion over cables.

In my view the differences in hifi are subtle, fine details, nuances - its the diminishing return thing.

Generally speakinga £100 70watt amp sounds the same as a £10.000 70watt amp - if anyone here with golden ears or not was just walking by these two amps none would stop and say " hey, now thats a £10.000 amp playing right there ( speakers & source being fixed.)". How many have gone to countless auditions and struggled to hear real differences with the kit they're auditioning.

Subtle differences.

Cables are the same in this aspect - there are no night and day differences between them, its only when we sit and listen that we can appreciate the differences.

Fuller more harmonic bass, cleaner tops more defined midrange, nuances small differences that you can appreciate. The amount of contributers in this thread who have said this, some could care less & will be unable to justify the spend, some will appreciate the diffrences and see no problem spending.

But ...hey, these threads wake things up a bit and are a bit of fun, ultimately its up to the individuals, what they hear and what they'll spend.

Thats me done.

http://matrixhifi.com/ENG_contenedor_ppec.htm

The differences between two amplifiers of the same power is more about how they look than how they perform.

 

[Native_bon]

Lol.... Native_bon.

Honestly sometimes I wonder why all this passion over cables.

In my view the differences in hifi are subtle, fine details, nuances - its the diminishing return thing.

Generally speakinga £100 70watt amp sounds the same as a £10.000 70watt amp - if anyone here with golden ears or not was just walking by these two amps none would stop and say " hey, now thats a £10.000 amp playing right there ( speakers & source being fixed.)". How many have gone to countless auditions and struggled to hear real differences with the kit they're auditioning.

Subtle differences.

Cables are the same in this aspect - there are no night and day differences between them, its only when we sit and listen that we can appreciate the differences.

Fuller more harmonic bass, cleaner tops more defined midrange, nuances small differences that you can appreciate. The amount of contributers in this thread who have said this, some could care less & will be unable to justify the spend, some will appreciate the diffrences and see no problem spending.

But ...hey, these threads wake things up a bit and are a bit of fun, ultimately its up to the individuals, what they hear and what they'll spend.

Thats me done.

http://matrixhifi.com/ENG_contenedor_ppec.htm

The differences between two amplifiers of the same power is more about how they look than how they perform.

I have know this fact for long time. Some poeple can see through marketing & good sales some cannot.

 

[the record spot]

He posted this, a quote from a clueless person.
"Cables are a source of noise and other very audible distortions. They can limit resolution, dynamic range and distort the tonal balance". Nope, nonsense. If you use a thin speaker cable the response will track the impedance curve of the speaker to a certain extent, but that's about it.

Yup, this is clearly the profile of a "clueless person" :

BOB LUDWIG

Bob's Gateway Studios facility is cabled throughout with Transparent Cable -- even the control boards! Gateway has won 9 TEC Awards, the industry's top award, for mastering studio and mastering engineer. Gateway recently remastered all 22 Rolling Stones albums . . . on Transparent!

You can try to sound intelligent by talking about response tracking the impedance curve (which I am confident enough to admit that I don't have any understanding of), but based on Bob's credentials above, he clearly has more credibility in his little finger than the whole of an insecure person like you who must always get the last word in like a kindergarden student.

Sorry to go back to this from the other day, as the thread was languishing somewhat, however, the point about Bob Ludwig's credentials: yes, certainly his track record is good, however, the work on some of the Stones' remasters on Polydor was pretty woeful. Excessively bright and really not good. The remaster of Some Girls was about the only disc I ever thought was unlistenable. The originals by MoFi for Decca were excellent.

 

[DylanFan]

Going back to the Chord Ethernet, having spend many days & nights in (years!) server rooms if you download music from Linn or elsewhere you need to know I haven't yet seen any esoteric cables anywhere, so the music than ends in in your computer will be seriously degraded by the CAT5 (or less) bundles of 100 or more I’ve tie wrapped together (best not use Virgin Media for downloading music) - If you use homeplugs I wouldn't even think about the degradation that (don’t) occur(s) when the music goes though the house wiring.

There is no reason on earth expensive Ethernet will or can make any difference, a packet is either right or wrong - As to other cables I’m not commenting on but Ethernet I do know.

 

[hammill]

Going back to the Chord Ethernet, having spend many days & nights in (years!) server rooms if you download music from Linn or elsewhere you need to know I haven't yet seen any esoteric cables anywhere, so the music than ends in in your computer will be seriously degraded by the CAT5 (or less) bundles of 100 or more I’ve tie wrapped together (best not use Virgin Media for downloading music) - If you use homeplugs I wouldn't even think about the degradation that (don’t) occur(s) when the music goes though the house wiring.

There is no reason on earth expensive Ethernet will or can make any difference, a packet is either right or wrong - As to other cables I’m not commenting on but Ethernet I do know.

Indeed so

I mentioned the Chord ethernet cables for this very reason. The internet doesn't need fancy cables, why do you? Any company that claims that their fancy ethernet cables are necessary is clearly lying and not to be trusted when other sorts of cables are under discussion.

 

[namefail]

He posted this, a quote from a clueless person.
"Cables are a source of noise and other very audible distortions. They can limit resolution, dynamic range and distort the tonal balance". Nope, nonsense. If you use a thin speaker cable the response will track the impedance curve of the speaker to a certain extent, but that's about it.

Yup, this is clearly the profile of a "clueless person" :

BOB LUDWIG

Bob's Gateway Studios facility is cabled throughout with Transparent Cable -- even the control boards! Gateway has won 9 TEC Awards, the industry's top award, for mastering studio and mastering engineer. Gateway recently remastered all 22 Rolling Stones albums . . . on Transparent!

You can try to sound intelligent by talking about response tracking the impedance curve (which I am confident enough to admit that I don't have any understanding of), but based on Bob's credentials above, he clearly has more credibility in his little finger than the whole of an insecure person like you who must always get the last word in like a kindergarden student.

Sorry to go back to this from the other day, as the thread was languishing somewhat, however, the point about Bob Ludwig's credentials: yes, certainly his track record is good, however, the work on some of the Stones' remasters on Polydor was pretty woeful. Excessively bright and really not good. The remaster of Some Girls was about the only disc I ever thought was unlistenable. The originals by MoFi for Decca were excellent.

I wonder if his choice of cables were to blame?

 

[DylanFan]

Another issue is that often chunky gold binding posts on speakers then end up with thin strips of metal usually bolted onto the binding posts inside with tiny machine bolts then on to a PCB crossover with thin of copper tracks - Also I assume for speed of assembly often connected to the drivers with crimped spade connectors that have a very small contact area.

Years ago What Hi-Fi among other magazines used to dismantle speakers & that who used push on crimps were slated as I remember the Castle Durhams I owned I soldered the cables onto the drivers because of this, speakers that used wood screws instead of t-bolts were also marked down as drivers were tightened by reviewers before testing, often now wood screws are still used.

Still now even quite expensive speakers still use crimped spades onto the drivers which may or may not be OK but users then often spend large amounts on super expensive banana plugs (AKA Russ Andrews/QED among others) or highly expensive jumpers to enable single wiring on a bi-wire binding post arrangement tightened up with mole grips not realising what’s inside the speaker cabinet .

Even quite expensive amps use bog standard (Roksan for one) RS crimps for mains connections internally (from the IEC socket to the toroid) thereby circumventing any advantages I would have thought that expensive mains cables & super lock plugs (Russ again & others) give - I do believe in the weakest link idea & I do make efforts to use decent cable & interconnects to a degree but t if this isn’t carried through along the whole chain surely the differences must be little?

 

[andyjm]

Another issue is that often chunky gold binding posts on speakers then end up with thin strips of metal usually bolted onto the binding posts inside with tiny machine bolts then on to a PCB crossover with thin of copper tracks - Also I assume for speed of assembly often connected to the drivers with crimped spade connectors that have a very small contact area.

Years ago What Hi-Fi among other magazines used to dismantle speakers & that who used push on crimps were slated as I remember the Castle Durhams I owned I soldered the cables onto the drivers because of this, speakers that used wood screws instead of t-bolts were also marked down as drivers were tightened by reviewers before testing, often now wood screws are still used.

Still now even quite expensive speakers still use crimped spades onto the drivers which may or may not be OK but users then often spend large amounts on super expensive banana plugs (AKA Russ Andrews/QED among others) or highly expensive jumpers to enable single wiring on a bi-wire binding post arrangement tightened up with mole grips not realising what’s inside the speaker cabinet .

Even quite expensive amps use bog standard (Roksan for one) RS crimps for mains connections internally (from the IEC socket to the toroid) thereby circumventing any advantages I would have thought that expensive mains cables & super lock plugs (Russ again & others) give - I do believe in the weakest link idea & I do make efforts to use decent cable & interconnects to a degree but t if this isn’t carried through along the whole chain surely the differences must be little?

A properly made crimp produces a gas tight 'cold weld'. Those planes flying overhead have their internal wiring connected with crimp connectors - if its good enough for Boeing....

Having said all that, you correctly point out that there is much contradiction (misinformation?) in the sale of aftermarket cables and connectors, much of which is either nonsense, or correct information deliberately taken out of context.

 

[unknown]

lol...... I need more pop corn.

The cable skeptics are getting a pretty good kicking in here.

Good job Hifikrazy...... :cheers:

They are?

Honestly The Record Spot, I'm reading through this thread ( responded in the other "Help with cables" thread, thought this was a duplicate, only looked in when it grew passed 60replies or so ) the 'debate took its usuual route, the two sides standing firm then came the ' pros' don't use them 'bomb' countered with oh yes they do 'bomb' with quotes from reputable pro's.

Then watched with great amusment while the skeptics tried to debunk the quotes ...oh how I laughed last night, and you don't see that as a kicking (purely in an internet forum debate context).... really?

Well I dunno - hifikrazy imo gained great credability, while those opposing him looked really stupid/ignorant - others may have a different opinions, you may have all read me stating my speakers clearly distinguishes the differences cables can make - I honestly did'nt get involved in this thread till now simply because they always end this way.

But a thumbs up from me to hifikrazy.

He posted this, a quote from a clueless person."Cables are a source of noise and other very audible distortions. They can limit resolution, dynamic range and distort the tonal balance". Nope, nonsense. If you use a thin speaker cable the response will track the impedance curve of the speaker to a certain extent, but that's about it.

What are you talking about?

the things discribed in that quote are the very things that cables affect in a half decent system - resolution, dynamic range, tonal balance I don't get the point you are trying to make - ref the quotes in this thread what aspects of the sound do you believe the new cables affected?

I mean c'mon.... read them again.

OK, explain how a cable could possibly affect dynamic range.

what?..... lol.... google it...... :rofl:

Chord claim this:

"No cable can increase the dynamic range of a system, but a poor quality cable can significantly reduce it. This can be caused by poor quality shielding which significantly raises the noise floor of the system, meaning that very quiet sounds are masked by unwanted noise."

If this were true, it would imply that I would be able to hear something when there is no music being played on my system - I can't. So my bog standard 79 strand cable seems to be up to the job and I don't think anyone on this thread suggests anything less expensive than this for a reasonable system.

Laughable, isn't it? Noise isn't any sort of issue on a speaker cable so shielding them is entirely pointless.

wait Chord say a cable cannot increase the dynamic range but a poor one can reduce it!

well surely if you swap from a poor cable to a quality one thats exactly what you do or get as close to the truth as you can with better cabling or am I missing some thing?

Your argument just got blown out of the water.

If that had read a poor cable is as good as a quality cable then you would have found something to justify your stance or am I reading this wrong?

and when did shielding have anything to do with anything in this thread?

I would have another read if I were you. Then reply.

Trevc - Me thinks you need to read & understand.

'This can be caused by ....'

He gives an example, he could have said '.... poor materials(copper/silver) used or poor termination, the point is poor quality cables can affect what you hear.

The source material has a fixed quality/range that can be affected by the cabling used in the transfer from source to amp and from amp to speaker. The point of hifi is to get as close to the original signal as possible which can be reduced/corrupted by cabling... seriously, whats the point you're trying to make.

if your argument is cabling/interconnects make no difference then a single 0.2mm strand of copper would make no difference to a larger gauge multi strand cable, they should sound the same. I don't get your argument.

If you are talking about interconnects then yes, any old cable, or even any old conductor will do. It's an entirely non-critical application for a piece of wire.

http://consumerist.com/2008/03/03/do-coat-hangers-sound-as-good-monster-cables/

so are you saying all interconnects sound the same ?

 

[techboy]

IMO although there can be very slight differences between cables:

1. Compared to the rest of the chain they are minimal and not necessarily going to get significantly better with price. Different, perhaps.

2. Your setup is fairly entry level and it doesn't make sense to invest more than 5-15 quids per cable in a setup of this price.

 

[BenLaw]

lol...... I need more pop corn.

The cable skeptics are getting a pretty good kicking in here.

Good job Hifikrazy...... :cheers:

They are?

Honestly The Record Spot, I'm reading through this thread ( responded in the other "Help with cables" thread, thought this was a duplicate, only looked in when it grew passed 60replies or so ) the 'debate took its usuual route, the two sides standing firm then came the ' pros' don't use them 'bomb' countered with oh yes they do 'bomb' with quotes from reputable pro's.

Then watched with great amusment while the skeptics tried to debunk the quotes ...oh how I laughed last night, and you don't see that as a kicking (purely in an internet forum debate context).... really?

Well I dunno - hifikrazy imo gained great credability, while those opposing him looked really stupid/ignorant - others may have a different opinions, you may have all read me stating my speakers clearly distinguishes the differences cables can make - I honestly did'nt get involved in this thread till now simply because they always end this way.

But a thumbs up from me to hifikrazy.

He posted this, a quote from a clueless person."Cables are a source of noise and other very audible distortions. They can limit resolution, dynamic range and distort the tonal balance". Nope, nonsense. If you use a thin speaker cable the response will track the impedance curve of the speaker to a certain extent, but that's about it.

What are you talking about?

the things discribed in that quote are the very things that cables affect in a half decent system - resolution, dynamic range, tonal balance I don't get the point you are trying to make - ref the quotes in this thread what aspects of the sound do you believe the new cables affected?

I mean c'mon.... read them again.

OK, explain how a cable could possibly affect dynamic range.

what?..... lol.... google it...... :rofl:

Chord claim this:

"No cable can increase the dynamic range of a system, but a poor quality cable can significantly reduce it. This can be caused by poor quality shielding which significantly raises the noise floor of the system, meaning that very quiet sounds are masked by unwanted noise."

If this were true, it would imply that I would be able to hear something when there is no music being played on my system - I can't. So my bog standard 79 strand cable seems to be up to the job and I don't think anyone on this thread suggests anything less expensive than this for a reasonable system.

Laughable, isn't it? Noise isn't any sort of issue on a speaker cable so shielding them is entirely pointless.

wait Chord say a cable cannot increase the dynamic range but a poor one can reduce it!

well surely if you swap from a poor cable to a quality one thats exactly what you do or get as close to the truth as you can with better cabling or am I missing some thing?

Your argument just got blown out of the water.

If that had read a poor cable is as good as a quality cable then you would have found something to justify your stance or am I reading this wrong?

and when did shielding have anything to do with anything in this thread?

I would have another read if I were you. Then reply.

Trevc - Me thinks you need to read & understand.

'This can be caused by ....'

He gives an example, he could have said '.... poor materials(copper/silver) used or poor termination, the point is poor quality cables can affect what you hear.

The source material has a fixed quality/range that can be affected by the cabling used in the transfer from source to amp and from amp to speaker. The point of hifi is to get as close to the original signal as possible which can be reduced/corrupted by cabling... seriously, whats the point you're trying to make.

if your argument is cabling/interconnects make no difference then a single 0.2mm strand of copper would make no difference to a larger gauge multi strand cable, they should sound the same. I don't get your argument.

If you are talking about interconnects then yes, any old cable, or even any old conductor will do. It's an entirely non-critical application for a piece of wire.

http://consumerist.com/2008/03/03/do-coat-hangers-sound-as-good-monster-cables/

so are you saying all interconnects sound the same ?

You've already done the same wind up post in this very thread:

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/help-with-cables-0?page=page=8#comment-2935669

(Not sure what's going on with that link but p8, post 14.)

 

[the record spot]

Not so much help with cables as a need to edit nested quotes. Especially when putting down a two line answer....!!

 

[unknown]

lol...... I need more pop corn.

The cable skeptics are getting a pretty good kicking in here.

Good job Hifikrazy...... :cheers:

They are?

Honestly The Record Spot, I'm reading through this thread ( responded in the other "Help with cables" thread, thought this was a duplicate, only looked in when it grew passed 60replies or so ) the 'debate took its usuual route, the two sides standing firm then came the ' pros' don't use them 'bomb' countered with oh yes they do 'bomb' with quotes from reputable pro's.

Then watched with great amusment while the skeptics tried to debunk the quotes ...oh how I laughed last night, and you don't see that as a kicking (purely in an internet forum debate context).... really?

Well I dunno - hifikrazy imo gained great credability, while those opposing him looked really stupid/ignorant - others may have a different opinions, you may have all read me stating my speakers clearly distinguishes the differences cables can make - I honestly did'nt get involved in this thread till now simply because they always end this way.

But a thumbs up from me to hifikrazy.

He posted this, a quote from a clueless person."Cables are a source of noise and other very audible distortions. They can limit resolution, dynamic range and distort the tonal balance". Nope, nonsense. If you use a thin speaker cable the response will track the impedance curve of the speaker to a certain extent, but that's about it.

What are you talking about?

the things discribed in that quote are the very things that cables affect in a half decent system - resolution, dynamic range, tonal balance I don't get the point you are trying to make - ref the quotes in this thread what aspects of the sound do you believe the new cables affected?

I mean c'mon.... read them again.

OK, explain how a cable could possibly affect dynamic range.

what?..... lol.... google it...... :rofl:

Chord claim this:

"No cable can increase the dynamic range of a system, but a poor quality cable can significantly reduce it. This can be caused by poor quality shielding which significantly raises the noise floor of the system, meaning that very quiet sounds are masked by unwanted noise."

If this were true, it would imply that I would be able to hear something when there is no music being played on my system - I can't. So my bog standard 79 strand cable seems to be up to the job and I don't think anyone on this thread suggests anything less expensive than this for a reasonable system.

Laughable, isn't it? Noise isn't any sort of issue on a speaker cable so shielding them is entirely pointless.

wait Chord say a cable cannot increase the dynamic range but a poor one can reduce it!

well surely if you swap from a poor cable to a quality one thats exactly what you do or get as close to the truth as you can with better cabling or am I missing some thing?

Your argument just got blown out of the water.

If that had read a poor cable is as good as a quality cable then you would have found something to justify your stance or am I reading this wrong?

and when did shielding have anything to do with anything in this thread?

I would have another read if I were you. Then reply.

Trevc - Me thinks you need to read & understand.

'This can be caused by ....'

He gives an example, he could have said '.... poor materials(copper/silver) used or poor termination, the point is poor quality cables can affect what you hear.

The source material has a fixed quality/range that can be affected by the cabling used in the transfer from source to amp and from amp to speaker. The point of hifi is to get as close to the original signal as possible which can be reduced/corrupted by cabling... seriously, whats the point you're trying to make.

if your argument is cabling/interconnects make no difference then a single 0.2mm strand of copper would make no difference to a larger gauge multi strand cable, they should sound the same. I don't get your argument.

If you are talking about interconnects then yes, any old cable, or even any old conductor will do. It's an entirely non-critical application for a piece of wire.

http://consumerist.com/2008/03/03/do-coat-hangers-sound-as-good-monster-cables/

so are you saying all interconnects sound the same ?

You've already done the same wind up post in this very thread:

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/help-with-cables-0?page=page=8#comment-2935669

(Not sure what's going on with that link but p8, post 14.)

not a wind up post, just interested to hear trevc answer...........

(just like i was interested in your answer when i saked what cables you use and have tested)

 

[BenLaw]

You already have his answer from the post you quoted, and given that you've followed Trev's posts for a while I don't see any other conclusion than this is an attempt to wind him up.

 

[the record spot]

@mikefarrow - Simple concept really, edit the nested thread down to the most recent comment and quote that. The respondent will work it out readily enough.

 

[unknown]

@mikefarrow - Simple concept really, edit the nested thread down to the most recent comment and quote that. The respondent will work it out readily enough.

hello, having lots of trouble with spam filter, will not post my replies