Fanciful design choices...

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

Hi insider..just wondering if your amp has the switch at the back of the amp reading....."Chassis " or floating"....this switch is to do with the earthing issues that can occur which jjbomber was referring to...select ."Floating " if you have another naim box connected to the amp and "Chassis" if the amp is the only naim unit within the system.

My nait xs and superuniti has this switch.

 

[insider9]

Thanks guys!

Will have to check all the possibilities today.

 

[insider9]

Bl**dy h*ll!

It is a ground loop. Would've know this if I had a turntable I'm sure. I just unplugged everything one by one without any change... Last item being my streamer. And it's dead silent.

Now listening to old NAD CD player and it's crystal clear.

Now, how do I tackle this problem?

 

[davedotco]

Bl**dy h*ll!

It is a ground loop. Would've know this if I had a turntable I'm sure. I just unplugged everything one by one without any change... Last item being my streamer. And it's dead silent.

Now listening to old NAD CD player and it's crystal clear.

Now, how do I tackle this problem?

What streamer do you have?

Does it have a 3 core mains lead?

What cables are used to connect to the Nait?

 

[insider9]

Bl**dy h*ll!

It is a ground loop. Would've know this if I had a turntable I'm sure. I just unplugged everything one by one without any change... Last item being my streamer. And it's dead silent.

Now listening to old NAD CD player and it's crystal clear.

Now, how do I tackle this problem?

What streamer do you have?

Does it have a 3 core mains lead?

What cables are used to connect to the Nait?

It's a Yamaha WXC-50. It's not grounded by the look of the plug... Never had any issue like this before.

Oh and it's RCA to Nait.

 

[insider9]

Here's a picture of the back of the unit

http://exceptional-av.co.uk/media/catalog/product/y/a/yamaha-wxc-50-rear.jpg

 

[insider9]

Here's a picture of the back of the unit

http://exceptional-av.co.uk/media/catalog/product/y/a/yamaha-wxc-50-rear...

 

[ellisdj]

How many wall sockets are you plugging into.

Could you be plugging into different ring mains? That can be a cause different ground impedance

 

[insider9]

How many wall sockets are  you plugging into.

Could you be plugging into different ring mains?  That can be a cause different ground impedance 

One ring mains.

The issue is between Yamaha WXC-50 (not grounded) and Nait. At least I know what it is now. I'm guessing I need to ground the Yamaha myself.

Well now I'm cheesed off with Yamaha but happy I know what's happening.

Edit
Or replace it with Bluesound Node 2.

 

[ellisdj]

Ground loop is probably creating common mode noise in your system.

Likely sound even better when you sort it

 

[insider9]

Ground loop is probably creating common mode noise in your system.

Likely sound even better when you sort it 

Yes, indeed. Unplugged Yamaha and listening to old NAD CD player and with this budget source it sounds really good. Now need to sort Yamaha and I'll be able to enjoy the Naim with a better source.

 

[davedotco]

How many wall sockets are you plugging into.

Could you be plugging into different ring mains? That can be a cause different ground impedance

One ring mains.

The issue is between Yamaha WXC-50 (not grounded) and Nait. At least I know what it is now. I'm guessing I need to ground the Yamaha myself.

Well now I'm cheesed off with Yamaha but happy I know what's happening.

Edit Or replace it with Bluesound Node 2.

Most likely. Naim amps have complex earthing arrangements that do not always 'play nice' with other non Naim components.

If the Nait has a ground terminal, try earthing that.

If not, get a regular 13 amp plug with a single wire connected to the earth only. Plug it in and touch the other, bare end, to suitable metal parts of the amp and streamer, see what is the quieter.

 

[insider9]

How many wall sockets are  you plugging into.

Could you be plugging into different ring mains?  That can be a cause different ground impedance 

One ring mains.

The issue is between Yamaha WXC-50 (not grounded) and Nait. At least I know what it is now. I'm guessing I need to ground the Yamaha myself.

Well now I'm cheesed off with Yamaha but happy I know what's happening.

Edit Or replace it with Bluesound Node 2.

Most likely. Naim amps have complex earthing arrangements that do not always 'play nice' with other non Naim components.

If the Nait has a ground terminal, try earthing that.

If not, get a regular 13 amp plug with a single wire connected to the earth only. Plug it in and touch the other, bare end, to suitable metal parts of the amp and streamer, see what is the quieter.

 

Ok, thanks Davedotco!

 

[ellisdj]

This video might be overkill but I found it very interesting

Watch me

 

[insider9]

Ok, so I've just tried it. Had a sale 3 pin plug with some wire. Stripped the earth. When touching the Yamaha on just about any metal part (not tried all) fixes the issue completely, so does touching the amp. Need to make it into a more permanent solution, now. Since the amp is ok with a different source I guess grounding the Yamaha makes more sense.

 

[ellisdj]

Unsrew a screw on one of them - wrap the wire around tighten back up.

sorted

 

[insider9]

Unsrew a screw on one of them - wrap the wire around tighten back up.

sorted 

Sounds like a plan. Anything else I need to be aware of? Thickness of the wire not sure what else could it be...

 

[davedotco]

Ok, so I've just tried it. Had a sale 3 pin plug with some wire. Stripped the earth. When touching the Yamaha on just about any metal part (not tried all) fixes the issue completely, so does touching the amp. Need to make it into a more permanent solution, now. Since the amp is ok with a different source I guess grounding the Yamaha makes more sense.

No. Best to ground the Nait. The Yamaha will ground to it via the phono cables.

Most probably the noise is getting into the Nait as it's case is not grounded, the Yamaha will be 'double insulated'.

Takes me back to the 80s. When using an LP12 setup with a non Naim amplifier, the separate earth on the arm cable was not normally needed. People would ask what was it for, the answer being that it was to earth the case of a Naim amp or preamp, as 'chassis' ground was separate from 'signal' ground, by design.

 

[insider9]

Ok, so I've just tried it. Had a sale 3 pin plug with some wire. Stripped the earth. When touching the Yamaha on just about any metal part (not tried all) fixes the issue completely, so does touching the amp. Need to make it into a more permanent solution, now. Since the amp is ok with a different source I guess grounding the Yamaha makes more sense.

No. Best to ground the Nait. The Yamaha will ground to it via the phono cables.

Most probably the noise is getting into the Nait as it's case is not grounded, the Yamaha will be 'double insulated'.

Takes me back to the 80s. When using an LP12 setup with a non Naim amplifier, the separate earth on the arm cable was not normally needed. People would ask what was it for, the answer being that it was to earth the case of a Naim amp or preamp, as 'chassis' ground was separate from 'signal' ground, by design.

Ok, in which case would it be ok to take a mono rca and connect to one of the connectors on the amps on one end and a central pin on the other?

Edit
Not sure that would ground the chassis... But it worked when testing.

 

[insider9]

Just tried grounding the chassis on Naim doesn't do anything. It's either grounding the Yamaha or connectors on Naim. I'm not using all of them AV etc.

With that in mind which one to go for?

 

[davedotco]

Ok, so I've just tried it. Had a sale 3 pin plug with some wire. Stripped the earth. When touching the Yamaha on just about any metal part (not tried all) fixes the issue completely, so does touching the amp. Need to make it into a more permanent solution, now. Since the amp is ok with a different source I guess grounding the Yamaha makes more sense.

No. Best to ground the Nait. The Yamaha will ground to it via the phono cables.

Most probably the noise is getting into the Nait as it's case is not grounded, the Yamaha will be 'double insulated'.

Takes me back to the 80s. When using an LP12 setup with a non Naim amplifier, the separate earth on the arm cable was not normally needed. People would ask what was it for, the answer being that it was to earth the case of a Naim amp or preamp, as 'chassis' ground was separate from 'signal' ground, by design.

Ok, in which case would it be ok to take a mono rca and connect to one of the connectors on the amps on one end and a central pin on the other?

Edit Not sure that would ground the chassis... But it worked when testing.

I do not think that Naim's grounding arrangements are quite what they were but they remain somewhat unpredictable. I would be more comfortable using a screw on the chassis if one is available, using the phono plug adds complexity that I would rather do without.

 

[davedotco]

Just tried grounding the chassis on Naim doesn't do anything. It's either grounding the Yamaha or connectors on Naim. I'm not using all of them AV etc.

With that in mind which one to go for?

That suggests that it is the signal path that is not grounded, not the case. In this case I think I would ground the Yamaha and let the Naim find signal ground that way.

I would not have expected this but it does show that Naim still like to keep their grounds separate.

 

[insider9]

Just tried grounding the chassis on Naim doesn't do anything. It's either grounding the Yamaha or connectors on Naim. I'm not using all of them AV etc.

With that in mind which one to go for?

That suggests that it is the signal path that is not grounded, not the case. In this case I think I would ground the Yamaha and let the Naim find signal ground that way.

I would not have expected this but it does show that Naim still like to keep their grounds separate.

Thanks very much Davedotco! Will have it sorted shortly. Remind me when I see you next round is on me

 

[insider9]

Sorted

*DANCE*

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

Good news insider..now you can enjoy the nait without such worries and a better feel for the amp when working as it should.