Dali

[radiorog]

I came across this YouTube video of the rubicon 6s playing guitar and they sound well good here’s a link to the video https://youtu.be/bXJTEX9Q0U0

i am sure I had a bad demo

that piece of music sounds that good on most mid range (sub £3000) set up. It sounds that good on mine and my speakers are fairly timid compared to a £2k+ pair. That piece of music should be banned from hi fi auditions Tongue in cheek there as I am sure if you know the piece of music really well you can pick out differences, but it really does make any system to come alive.

 

[insider9]

I came across this YouTube video of the rubicon 6s playing guitar and they sound well good here’s a link to the video https://youtu.be/bXJTEX9Q0U0

i am sure I had a bad demo

that piece of music sounds that good on most mid range (sub £3000) set up. It sounds that good on mine and my speakers are fairly timid compared to a £2k+ pair. That piece of music should be banned from hi fi auditions Tongue in cheek there as I am sure if you know the piece of music really well you can pick out differences, but it really does make any system to come alive.

Yes, it's similar to all these aspiring guitarists that go to buy a guitar and murder "Stairway to Heaven"

 

[Blacksabbath25]

A good Led zeppelin song ....baby I can’t stop loving you .... I absolutely love that song

 

[insider9]

Not quite. DALI measurements usually look like this in the treble as they're designed to be listened off axis. Bass you're right that was picked up by WHF review and I've seen Stereophile measurements. Sadly they don't have any for Epicon.

As to bass like I said I think it was down to a number of things amp included. I don't have much positive to say about many dealer demos. They often place the speakers incorrectly, pair it with not best sounding components and then you wonder what it could sound like if all was done properly. Worth pointing out talking big chains here not independent ones.

 

[Vladimir]

fig.5 also suggests that the Rubicon 8's low frequencies are balanced to sound rich, perhaps to balance the excess of top-octave energy seen in this graph.

Stereophile review

Looks like you heard what Dali wants you to hear in their Rubicon range. Why people never think of the speaker design and room first, it's always the amp first blame.

 

[Vladimir]

Not quite. DALI measurements usually look like this in the treble as they're designed to be listened off axis. Bass you're right that was picked up by WHF review and I've seen Stereophile measurements. Sadly they don't have any for Epicon.

As to bass like I said I think it was down to a number of things amp included. I don't have much positive to say about many dealer demos. They often place the speakers incorrectly, pair it with not best sounding components and then you wonder what it could sound like if all was done properly. Worth pointing out talking big chains here not independent ones.

In an ideal setup, amp, room, positioning, you believe these speakers will sound neutral?

 

[insider9]

Not quite. DALI measurements usually look like this in the treble as they're designed to be listened off axis. Bass you're right that was picked up by WHF review and I've seen Stereophile measurements. Sadly they don't have any for Epicon.

As to bass like I said I think it was down to a number of things amp included. I don't have much positive to say about many dealer demos. They often place the speakers incorrectly, pair it with not best sounding components and then you wonder what it could sound like if all was done properly. Worth pointing out talking big chains here not independent ones.

In an ideal setup, amp, room, positioning, you believe these speakers will sound neutral?

No, I don't. They will sound heavy handed in most rooms and with incorrect amp driving probably wooly and boomy too.

Unless either the room is very big or the volume on the low side.

But that doesn't necessarily rule out other from Rubicon range. I've looked for measurements of others and could not find any unfortunately. Would be good to speak to an experienced Dali dealer.

 

[Vladimir]

The Yamaha A-S2100 has tone controls so FR balance shouldn't be a deal breaker.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Right I’ve booked for a proper demo at Analogue Seduction hifi shop where they have good amplifier choice and better demo room as the one at richer sounds was small but even so I think the Cambridge amplifier they used was not the best match but the place I am going to tomorrow will have the rubicon 6s which has 1 more bass driver then the rubicon 5s

the dealer said that the rubicon 5s shouldn’t of sounded like they did and he thought it may of been the amplifier not controlling the bass properly I also thought maybe the chap in richer sounds mobile was adding bass as some mobiles have a sound optimise the sound as it was streaming or the Cambridge amplifier bass controls were used .

so will try again tomorrow with a proper demo with speakers setup proper and a better amplifier but I can’t take my Yamaha because it’s to heavy to carry around .

 

[insider9]

Also good point about tone controls. I had a demo of amps a while ago at RS. Remember listening to a few that day and the one in question was either Marantz or Cambridge and it sounded absolutely awful. Was left alone by a cheerful chap who did the amp swap and I could not believe how bad it was. Took me all of 2 minutes to realise bass was turned all the way up.

 

[Vladimir]

I'm calling cow poo on the amplifier excuse. The Cambridge Audio AZUR 851A is a ballsy powerful amp, more powerful than the Yamaha A-S2100 and A-S3000.

 

[insider9]

Measurements show high bass output so if there was any EQ it would only exacerbate the results. My point was more general, poor demo. And I know BS wasn't sure but I wouldn't be surprised if they used CXA60 for that demo.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

ok i do not no much about the cambrige amps i will soon find out tomorrow if it was the speakers but also read around that they use the word a lot saying bass rich a lot

 

[Blacksabbath25]

I wish it was the case I am pretty sure it wasn’t the Cambridge CX60 or CX80 I am sure they where using Cambridge Audio Azur 851D or Auzur 851A and the streamer was a Azur 851N which all 3 separates are in the £1699 price bracket .

i think why I do not get boom from the opticon 8s is because the Yamaha is on the natural side so my amplifier doesn’t add to the bass as I use no tone controls as I bypass them but I am unsure how the Cambridge was setup in the demo as it all seemed last minute setting up when I got there as I did phone before I was coming but when I got there nothing was setup and the room was small roughly 3 meters by 3 meters with 2 sofas in that room and lot of bits of separates and speakers .

but going by all the reviews I’ve read about the Dali rubicon speakers the reviewer has said that they are rich in bass and that includes what hifi review on the rubicon 5s but the rubicon speaker needs more space from the back wall which is meant to be 30-35cm which is more then the opticon speakers which I have mine at 20cm from back wall and around 2 meters apart but when I went yesterday the rubicon 5s where around a 1 meter and a half apart and one speaker was 30cm from back wall and the other was about 21cm .

basically tomorrow if I find the same problem with bloated bass I will forget it and keep what I’ve got but at least I’ve tried and lost nothing but it’s extremely important to demo speakers before buying as I can’t see how people buy them without a demo it’s pure crazy .

 

[CnoEvil]

Gary at Analogue Seduction is a good guy (IME).

While you are in the "Sweety Shop", you should take the opportunity to listen to some different stuff (like Luxman) and any other speakers that Gary thinks are worth a listen....could be hazardous to your wallet though (but could set up a plan for the future).

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Yes definitely I’ve all ready looked at the luxman amplifiers on his website and to see what other speakers he does but I didn’t no there was a shop like that near me and he said why haven’t you seen us before

anyway he also sales the Dali epicon o boy the wife’s coming too *blum3*

 

[CnoEvil]

Yes definitely I’ve all ready looked at the luxman amplifiers on his website and to see what other speakers he does but I didn’t no there was a shop like that near me and he said why haven’t you seen us before

anyway he also sales the Dali epicon o boy the wife’s coming too *blum3*

If you are spending substantial money, it's quite possible that spending it on something like a Luxman to drive your existing speakers, could be the way to go.

 

[CnoEvil]

Sorry, double post.

 

[CnoEvil]

Sorry. Double post.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Yes definitely I’ve all ready looked at the luxman amplifiers on his website and to see what other speakers he does but I didn’t no there was a shop like that near me and he said why haven’t you seen us before

anyway he also sales the Dali epicon o boy the wife’s coming too *blum3*

If you are spending substantial money, it's quite possible that spending it on something like a Luxman to drive your existing speakers, could be the way to go.

I like the luxman L-507ux integrated £5000 and I like the luxman power amplifier M-700u £6.500 but can’t see a good pre- amplifier on his website from luxman but my wife will have a breakdown if I spend that kind of money but if I went for a luxman I would buy the integrated amplifier because I couldn’t afford a pre & power from luxman .

 

[BigH]

I came across this YouTube video of the rubicon 6s playing guitar and they sound well good here’s a link to the video https://youtu.be/bXJTEX9Q0U0

i am sure I had a bad demo

Not sure what you can tell from a youtube video, they all sound dreadful to me. With that sort of money I would be looking at many other altenatives. Different amp? active speakers? Different speaker brands.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Yep I agree about YouTube I no it’s not the best to hear music or the equipment being used but you get a rough idea anyway I think I will have to pay more then one visit because there so much I’ve never heard yet

 

[insider9]

Yes definitely I’ve all ready looked at the luxman amplifiers on his website and to see what other speakers he does but I didn’t no there was a shop like that near me and he said why haven’t you seen us before

anyway he also sales the Dali epicon o boy the wife’s coming too *blum3*

If you are spending substantial money, it's quite possible that spending it on something like a Luxman to drive your existing speakers, could be the way to go.

You've got to love how a thread called Dali may end up with a purchase of Accuphase amp

With that sort of money I would be looking at many other altenatives. Different amp? active speakers? Different speaker brands.

Or a pair of actives *good*

 

[BigH]

Yep I agree about YouTube I no it’s not the best to hear music or the equipment being used but you get a rough idea anyway I think I will have to pay more then one visit because there so much I’ve never heard yet

It's not so much youtube but the way it's been recorded that's the problem. Some videos are fine but most recordings of speakers are not. My advise is don't rush into anything. Yes I think try some other brands and amps.

 

[Oldskool1976]

I came across this YouTube video of the rubicon 6s playing guitar and they sound well good here’s a link to the video https://youtu.be/bXJTEX9Q0U0

i am sure I had a bad demo

Not sure what you can tell from a youtube video, they all sound dreadful to me. With that sort of money I would be looking at many other altenatives. Different amp? active speakers? Different speaker brands.

I thought the same until I stumbled across Zreview's sound demos.
Give it a whirl because I think you'll be pleasantly surprised!