Choosent Between Celestion Ditton 44,442,66,662 Speakers

[Krorghar]

Greetings Friends

As you may know, I finally decided to have one of these models as my main Speakers. After listening to many brands and models of moderns Speakers, none of them satisfied my likings. I was used to listen to a pair of Ditton 33's from my brother in my childhood, and want that sound back. So I finally decided to have one of the Celestion Ditton brand as my main Speakers.

I have the possibility to buy 44, 66 ,442 and 662 models, as they are still easily found in the second hand market, but I don't know the characteristics of each model, what one was good, what one was better, which were their strong points and their weak spots, as the info is very rare to find due to the age of the Speakers. Would be very gratefull if any of the veteran users, who still remebers these speakers, would ilustrate me a little.

For a room of 26 m2, and listening genres of Pop/rock/metal of the 80's. Should i go fr the 44 brand or the 66 brand? In each brand, I Should get the original two digit, or the posterior 3 digit revision?. Apart, from the extra cones, what are the differences between 66 and 44 brands? I understand the 66 gives a more punchy Bass?

Note: The speakers will be pluged to a Devialet 200 amplifier, and a Rega RP10 TT

Many thanks.

 

[hifikrazy]

While I try not to disregard old speakers that are no longer in production purely because of their age, I cannot in good conscience support going for any of these speakers to pair with your Devialet 200 and Rega turntable, even if your recent auditioning seems to indicate otherwise. IMHO, that would be an absolute waste of the quality of the rest of your system.

 

[Krorghar]

I really appreciate your concern my friend. But what can I say ... as you know I have heard lots of speaker models, and none satisfied me. Heard the Ditton 33's of my brother and BAM!!! the sound was there. I'm really commited to get one of these. I know their price, age, and look, are not in consonance with the rest of my equipment, but as stated before, what I want is a sound that I like, all other considerations are secondary for me *good*

 

[CnoEvil]

Did you ever get to hear the Devialet with Kef R500/700?

 

[hifikrazy]

Or the SAM-able B&W CM10 that your dealer also appears to sell?

Searching for the right speaker is quite an adventure and I don't think you have explored nearly enough what's out there. I'm quite sure there are many BAM!!!-worthy new speakers out there that your Devialet wouldn't regret waking up next to the next morning.

 

[DocG]

I never heard any of these speakers, so can't help you choose...

But I agree that if that's the sound you like, you should go for them!

Are these rare speakers on the second-hand market? Are they expensive? You could consider hunting all four models down, doing a shoot-out, keeping what you like best and selling the others on for not too much of a loss. I don't know if that would be practically feasible, but it looks like the best way forward to me...

EDIT: just googled these models, and boy are they big! So if there's a significant other in your house, my plan might not work...*pardon*

 

[matt49]

EDIT: just googled these models, and boy are they big! So if there's a significant other in your house, my plan might not work...*pardon*

I think this is the key point: the 44s and 66s (as well as the Mk II models of each) have 10" (250mm) or 12" (300mm) woofers. My feeling is that this is exactly what Krorghar likes about the Ditton sound: deep, rich, all-enveloping bass.

So my question to Krorghar: have you tried any modern speakers with similar-sized woofers? This is difficult, of course. The tendency in modern speaker design is to try to get decent bass out of a narrrow cabinet. Even a large box like the Harbeth SHL5 "only" has an 8" woofer. The KEF R700 has a 6.5" woofer.

So I think if you can find a well priced pair of Dittons in good condition, this is the right way to go. It may be that in a year or two you feel like exploring this again. Maybe a set-up with a good subwoofer would work.

Matt

 

[davedotco]

The Ditton 44 would be closest to the 33 in sound terms, very similar in fact

Though why you would want to use such speakers is beyond me.

If you like them get them, your choice as always.

 

[DocG]

I think this is the key point: the 44s and 66s (as well as the Mk II models of each) have 10" (250mm) or 12" (300mm) woofers. My feeling is that this is exactly what Krorghar likes about the Ditton sound: deep, rich, all-enveloping bass.

So my question to Krorghar: have you tried any modern speakers with similar-sized woofers? This is difficult, of course. The tendency in modern speaker design is to try to get decent bass out of a narrrow cabinet. Even a large box like the Harbeth SHL5 "only" has an 8" woofer. The KEF R700 has a 6.5" woofer.

Yes, oldskool models like Harbeth's M40.1 or Spendor's SP100R2 both have that 12" woofer too. I don't know how deep your pockets are, of course...

 

[CnoEvil]

So my question to Krorghar: have you tried any modern speakers with similar-sized woofers? This is difficult, of course. The tendency in modern speaker design is to try to get decent bass out of a narrrow cabinet. Even a large box like the Harbeth SHL5 "only" has an 8" woofer. The KEF R700 has a 6.5" woofer.

I think I'm right in saying that 2 x 8" woofers are equal to slightly less than 1 x 12".

 

[davedotco]

So my question to Krorghar: have you tried any modern speakers with similar-sized woofers? This is difficult, of course. The tendency in modern speaker design is to try to get decent bass out of a narrrow cabinet. Even a large box like the Harbeth SHL5 "only" has an 8" woofer. The KEF R700 has a 6.5" woofer.

I think I'm right in saying that 2 x 8" woofers are equal to slightly less than 1 x 12".

I do not think that the quality of bass is at issue here, modern speakers, the better ones anyway, are faster, tighter and more articulate then any of these old Celestions. This is probably even more applicable to those models that are are SAMed.

If the OP wants something that sounds like an old pair of Celestions then he should buy the 44s that he says he can get.

Waste of a very nice amplifier but, what the hell.

 

[hifikrazy]

Totally agree with Davedotco. Could have just matched the Celestions with a nice old amp at 10% the price of the Devialet.

 

[Overdose]

Totally agree with Davedotco. Could have just matched the Celestions with a nice old amp at 10% the price of the Devialet.

A little bit arrogant to criticise someones stated preference I feel, particularly as the components chosen give the exact sound that the OP wants.

More than enough 'audiophiles' lead themselves on a fools errand trying to chase their elusive 'sound' with all manner of nonsense audio bling in this vain hope, yet never achieve it.

Total respect to the person who has gained contentment, as alien as it may be to some. It's a rare thing in the hifi equipment hobby.

 

[davedotco]

Totally agree with Davedotco. Could have just matched the Celestions with a nice old amp at 10% the price of the Devialet.

A little bit arrogant to criticise someones stated preference I feel, particularly as the components chosen give the exact sound that the OP wants.

More than enough 'audiophiles' lead themselves on a fools errand trying to chase their elusive 'sound' with all manner of nonsense audio bling in this vain hope, yet never achieve it.

Total respect to the person who has gained contentment, as alien as it may be to some. It's a rare thing in the hifi equipment hobby.

I did not criticise, just stated a rather obvious point. I love the Devialet, integrated amplifier of choice for me, however it's contribution to the sound signature through a vintage pair of Ditton 44s will, in all probability, be negligeable.

Money wasted in my view, but if you take the view that anything goes so long as the OP likes the result then there is no argument from me.

 

[Overdose]

Totally agree with Davedotco. Could have just matched the Celestions with a nice old amp at 10% the price of the Devialet.

A little bit arrogant to criticise someones stated preference I feel, particularly as the components chosen give the exact sound that the OP wants.

More than enough 'audiophiles' lead themselves on a fools errand trying to chase their elusive 'sound' with all manner of nonsense audio bling in this vain hope, yet never achieve it.

Total respect to the person who has gained contentment, as alien as it may be to some. It's a rare thing in the hifi equipment hobby.

I did not criticise, just stated a rather obvious point. I love the Devialet, integrated amplifier of choice for me, however it's contribution to the sound signature through a vintage pair of Ditton 44s will, in all probability, be negligeable.

Money wasted in my view, but if you take the view that anything goes so long as the OP likes the result then there is no argument from me.

It wasn't really aimed at you Dave.

Firstly, an amplifier as expensive as the Devialet shouldn't be contributing anything, save a transparently amplified signal. I'm sure it does this and so it should given its price. If it didn't, I'd be rather annoyed having forked out so much for something that can be bettered at a much lower price point. With this in mind, yes, you could argue a waste of money, but that's choice for you.

Ultimately, if the OP is happy, that's all that counts. He hasn't stated that he has any ambition for true fidelity or goal to achieve best accuracy, nor has he said that his system provides this, just honestly admits that that is what he likes the sound of and that is what he has or is very soon to get.

If only many others were as honest with themselves as this chap, there would probably be far less misunderstanding on the subject of hifi in general and far less faffage involved 'upgrading'.

 

[chebby]

Even Germans.

 

[CnoEvil]

IMO. Generally people on here try to give well meaning advice and are concerned that the person asking the question is helped as much as possible....even if we don't all agree on how that should be.

If the person looking for help is relatively new to this game, they may not have considered all the alternatives and so it is not unreasonable to voice concerns...which the OP has every right to reject.

In this case, I too have concerns, but as yet we have not come up with a satisfactory solution that meets the OP's needs better than the Dittons.

I would like to think that some big second hand Harbeths or Spendor Classics (eg.S100/S100P/SP100) that are younger, are the way to go.

 

[Krorghar]

Many thanks for all the comments guys, really appreciated.

Honestly, I'm tired of searching *blush* . I understand all your concerns about wasting the capacity of the Devialet (thus I don't see it as a waste, if I like the sound), I still have to check it paired with some KEF and floorstanders B&W, may do it in the future, but for now, months pass, and I still haven't got my Mainspeakers.

The 33's sound is what I was looking for, so I will go for some 44's (or 66's) that are relatively inexpensive (200-300€) And in the future, when I have "rested" will give the KEF and B&W a go for sure. Celestion Ditton's and many Speakers from the 70's and 80's aren't "resolutive" Speakers, they aren't aimed at hearing every minimum detail of the music, I don't need that. They are aimed at listening music for hours without fatige. Strong bass, and great mediums, warm filling sound, you should listen to them if you can, I guarantee a surprise.

They were the BBC reference studio monitors in the 70's and 80's, best you could buy at that time, and costed the equivalent of modern 2000-3000€. Not bad speakers for sure *biggrin*.

 

[chebby]

The 33's sound is what I was looking for, so I will go for some 44's (or 66's) ...

Eh?

A particular speaker gives you the sound you are looking for, so you decide to buy something different.

I don't get it.

 

[Krorghar]

44's are basically the same speakers as 33's, Mid range and bass cones are the same, the tweeter is different, is of better quality, acording with the reviews. 44's can deal deal with more amp power, 33's were a bit limited on this area, thats why I want them *biggrin*

 

[davedotco]

Spot on, they have very similar characteristics.

The Devialet is a superb amplifier, I would love one. It is way more than you need to drive Ditton 44s, but as the man says, it is your money and your choice.

 

[michaelg]

Hi

I've heard losts of speakers old and modern and love the old ditton sound, something about large drivers makes real bass , not overbloated when i heard them and set up right.

The last modern speakers i demoed were the new atc model standmounts and oh dear, is that sound supposed to be enjoyable ? IMHO they were boxy, constrained and almost too detailed with poor separation of instruments, no thanks.

 

[hifikrazy]

The new B&W CM10 S2 may well be a suitable speaker

 

[nopiano]

It is many years since I heard these old Celestions. I did own some very different sounding SL600s, by which time my recollection is that the 44, 66 etc had disappeared from production. From roughly that era, I'd be curious to hear again the Leak 2075' which had a Dalek-like swivelling head unit and a whopping 15" bass driver. Would probably be very disappointing now, but I have fond memories!

I have to observe that I too cannot quite imagine today's outstanding amplifier paired with wooly old chuffers like the 44s, but it's not my money, so I hope it works out!

 

[swissSteve]

What did you go for in the end? From my point of view a pair of 66's will not dissapoint if you can get hold of a pair in decent condition. If room is scarce then 44's are close without the extra bass from the auxilary bass radiator. We also had a pair of 662's but they were disappointing compared to the original 66's... Consider re-capping the crossovers if you get a pair which don't sound 'right'. Unfortunately the HF2000 treble units in these speakers tend to be a weakness and stop working with age but they can easily be replaced with a modern unit (seas or coles, I can't remember which).

--

Steve