1980's HiFi v 2020's HiFi

[Oxfordian]

Back in the late 1980's when I picked up my first serious piece of HiFi kit there were a number of 'high end kit makers' whose products were the aspirational aims of many, for example; the list could include the like of Exposure, Naim, Linn, Musical Fidelity, although I am sure people could name a few more.

I well remember browsing the shelves of local hifi stores dreaming of having the dosh to buy some of these exotic pieces of kit but sadly the opportunity never arose, instead I accepted my lot and enjoyed my music fix with less exotic but nevertheless excellent products that I could afford.

So my question is how does the perceived high end kit maker of the 1980's fair in the 2020's are they as good today as they were yesterday, does the brand still hold that special place in the HiFi world or has time moved on and now there is a new breed of aspirational brands.

I appreciate that this is quite a subjective subject as what works for one doesn't mean that it works for another, but I am curious as to what people think on how the brands of yesteryear are received today.

 

[podknocker]

I bought a Philips CD473 in 1988 with the famous TDA1541 DAC and it sounded great and lasted about 12 years with no noise or fuss. I've had many CD players since then and few have sounded as good, or been as reliable. I did have a Rotel CD player and matching amp and they were exquisite. I don't think new CD players can sound better than ones from decades ago. It's still 16 bits at 44.1kHz, using an infra red laser, chucking out 1411kbps. CD players do sound different, but I don't think new ones have anything new to offer. It's 40 year old technology.

 

[davidf]

Some modern players can sound as good as older ones, it’s just that there’s very few really exceptional players around nowadays unless you spend a fortune, not that that’s a 100% guarantee.

 

[Deleted member 201267]

Some modern players can sound as good as older ones, it’s just that there’s very few really exceptional players around nowadays unless you spend a fortune, not that that’s a 100% guarantee.

Can you recommend any ?

 

[podknocker]

I paid £500 for a gold Denon DVD2900 in a SuperFi sale many years ago and I can honestly say it sounded incredible within seconds of playing a CD. Sadly, the transport or firmware was really iffy and it refused to read CDs after a few weeks. SACDs and DVDs were fine! My NAD T585 sounded better though and yes, again, the transport failed. I would not know where to start, if I was on the lookout for a CD player these days. I owned a Sony 4k Blu Ray player until 3 years ago and that was amazing value at £249 and it was quiet and built like a tank. It played every codec on every disc and I think I might buy the Mk2 version and keep it safe, just in case I need to spin discs again.

 

[davidf]

Can you recommend any ?

I can only go by what I’ve heard, but the Norma Audio and Hegel models are excellent, YBA sound really nice, as do Rotel and Exposure.

 

[Dom]

While I was in Audio T the rep spoke about the amplifier being quite old. So good sound will always be good sound. IMO

It was a beautiful amp.

 

[Al ears]

While I was in Audio T the rep spoke about the amplifier being quite old. I listened to it and it blew my socks off, so good sound will always be good sound. IMO

It was a beautiful amp.

Age shall not weary them, as the saying goes. However, regarding amplifiers this is probably not so.
An amp from the 80's and an identical circuit amp of today will not be performing in the same way. Components do decline over time, capacitors certainly do as do valves.

 

[Dom]

Age shall not weary them, as the saying goes. However, regarding amplifiers this is probably not so.
An amp from the 80's and an identical circuit amp of today will not be performing in the same way. Components do decline over time, capacitors certainly do as do valves.

Ah, I should clarify the amp was probably less than 10 years old.

 

[Oxfordian]

I'm more interested in how the brand stacks up 80's v 20's, I understand that components may decline over time and repairs or replacement parts could be required over the years but my real question is are the aspirational brands of yesteryear still at or near the top of the pile today?

Or have the new boys come along and kicked sand in their faces and pushed them off the top?

 

[Al ears]

I'm more interested in how the brand stacks up 80's v 20's, I understand that components may decline over time and repairs or replacement parts could be required over the years but my real question is are the aspirational brands of yesteryear still at or near the top of the pile today?

Or have the new boys come along and kicked sand in their faces and pushed them off the top?

Many of the brands of reknown of yesterday no longer exist unfortunately so it's a difficult question to answer.
Having said that many that are still around live on using reputation alone and may not have, in reality, a product of significant quality.
Today it's a case of quality versus cost.
The cheaper amplifiers of yesterday still have a place as they shipped in large numbers so cost could be kept down. Limited sales of equivalent equipment these days mean prices have been hiked to a point that comparisons are pointless.

 

[Oxfordian]

Many of the brands of reknown of yesterday no longer exist unfortunately so it's a difficult question to answer.
Having said that many that are still around live on using reputation alone and may not have, in reality, a product of significant quality.
Today it's a case of quality versus cost.
The cheaper amplifiers of yesterday still have a place as they shipped in large numbers so cost could be kept down. Limited sales of equivalent equipment these days mean prices have been hiked to a point that comparisons are pointless.

I understand what you are saying but its not really what I am after, maybe I'm not explaining myself very well.

My local Hifi store had a mix of Naim/Rega/Linn/plus some Japanese gear on the shelves and stores in the nearby town had Exposure/Pink Triangle/Musical Fidelity/Nad and a selection of the aforementioned Japanese products - it was a great store over 3 floor and included a vinyl section.

It wasn't the Japanese gear that we revered it was the UK makers gear, that is what we were hankering to own, so for me listening to a demo of a top line turntable running off a Naim or Exposure amp set up was a real privilege something that I hoped one day to own.

It is this last bit that I am trying to understand, of those companies that were top of the tree back then do they remain at or near the top of the tree today (assuming that they are still around) or have the new boys usurped them?

 

[Al ears]

I understand what you are saying but its not really what I am after, maybe I'm not explaining myself very well.

My local Hifi store had a mix of Naim/Rega/Linn/plus some Japanese gear on the shelves and stores in the nearby town had Exposure/Pink Triangle/Musical Fidelity/Nad and a selection of the aforementioned Japanese products - it was a great store over 3 floor and included a vinyl section.

It wasn't the Japanese gear that we revered it was the UK makers gear, that is what we were hankering to own, so for me listening to a demo of a top line turntable running off a Naim or Exposure amp set up was a real privilege something that I hoped one day to own.

It is this last bit that I am trying to understand, of those companies that were top of the tree back then do they remain at or near the top of the tree today (assuming that they are still around) or have the new boys usurped them?

I see, I think top of the tree is debatable. Certain brands have their own obsesive adherents but whether that's just people willing to pay thousands for a brand name or whether their products still carry some class.
Personally, I would say it's the former.
That said there are some British products that still have that bit of class but you're going to have to pay dearly to own said products these days.

 

[nopiano]

There are several notable anniversaries this year, Naim, Rega, QED and Linn amongst them, all celebrating 50th years.

Coincidentally, I bought my first system fifty years ago too, so I remember these famous British brands as well as ‘iconic’ products like LS3/5a speakers. Some of these products are ten times the price now, but then so are the homes I lived in!

I saw SME’s restoration of Garrard designs at the Ascot Hifi Show a couple of months ago, which shows the longevity of some products. They definitely hold their own today.

Am I correct in recalling some Rega designs are based on Wireless World circuits published in the 1950s?

 

[plastic penguin]

Don't think there's any real definitive answer, as I own old and modern stuff. The likes of Marantz tuner, which I've owned since circa 1979 still sees off modern equivalent FM tuners. Even Arcams much newer and more expensive DT91 can't achieve that.

My Exposure CD2010 is another one hard one to knock off its perch, unless you go much further up the money tree. That first came out in 2003/4.

Exactly the same with the Leema, you need to go way over 2k to make a noticeable difference.

 

[matthewpianist]

I think the sector that has improved beyond doubt is that of compact systems, really spearheaded by the first Denon DM-series units and the likes of the Arcam Solo, and which has now developed into a much more mature market with units that can equal comparably priced separates.

 

[podknocker]

I think the sector that has improved beyond doubt is that of compact systems, really spearheaded by the first Denon DM-series units and the likes of the Arcam Solo, and which has now developed into a much more mature market with units that can equal comparably priced separates.

The build quality, sound quality and functionality of my Audiolab Omnia would be unheard of, even 20 years ago.

 

[matthewpianist]

The build quality, sound quality and functionality of my Audiolab Omnia would be unheard of, even 20 years ago.

Likewise with my Denon CEOL or pretty much any similar product.

 

[podknocker]

The Denon RCD-N12 DAB will be my next purchase, if I ever need one. I think it's amazing for £649 and looks great in white.

 

[Revolutions]

I’ve said it before & will continue to tell everyone: my 1980 Sony cd player cannot be bettered and never will.

 

[Oxfordian]

The build quality, sound quality and functionality of my Audiolab Omnia would be unheard of, even 20 years ago.

Your Omnia wasn't even a designer's pipe dream back then, so although your statement maybe true this is not what I was asking about, I am interested in whether people perceive the big names of yesteryear as good now as they were alleged to be then.

 

[Oxfordian]

I’ve said it before & will continue to tell everyone: my 1980 Sony cd player cannot be bettered and never will.

But what of Sony as a brand, are they as good now as they were then?

 

[podknocker]

I’ve said it before & will continue to tell everyone: my 1980 Sony cd player cannot be bettered and never will.

I always wanted a Sony CDP-X777ES. They still exist, on ebay, but finding a new one that's been left in a shop cupboard, is one of my dreams.

 

[podknocker]

But what of Sony as a brand, are they as good now as they were then?

They make fantastic 4k Blu Ray players and are more than capable of giving proper CD players a good run for their money. They don't make normal CD players anymore.

 

[podknocker]

Your Omnia wasn't even a designer's pipe dream back then, so although your statement maybe true this is not what I was asking about, I am interested in whether people perceive the big names of yesteryear as good now as they were alleged to be then.

Your Omnia wasn't even a designer's pipe dream back then, so although your statement maybe true this is not what I was asking about, I am interested in whether people perceive the big names of yesteryear as good now as they were alleged to be then.

I've bought plenty of kit, from big names, over the last 35 years and I've had a mixed bag really. In my opinion, with the stuff I've used, I would say many brands are not as good as several years ago, even decades. I think it boils down to part availability and a lot of brands are lazy, expecting to throw their new kit off the production lines, without proper testing, or reading the market correctly. I'm into HIFI even more these days, with the new tech, but it's a minefield knowing what to look for and compare very similar models. There are brands I won't buy again, for really quirky things nobody would think of, until struggling with the damn thing after purchase.

I had a Toshiba TV many years ago and the Toslink connector was vertical, so the weight and twist of the cable would make it fall out. The Toslink connection is a poor design anyway, in my opinion. I had to glue the cable in, shortly before I got rid of the TV. The next model had a horizontal fitting, so would have been OK. Who would have been able to spot this as a potential issue, when seeing the TV for the first time? There are so many things I look out for now, when considering a tech purchase. Caveat Emptor.