JonAlacrityA said:
Surely David the above, new Physics & scientific measurements are sufficient?? Maybe they will send you & WHF a pair for evaluation.
Surely David the above, new Physics & scientific measurements are sufficient?? Maybe they will send you & WHF a pair for evaluation.
steve_1979 said:
Of course I will. Cuz, u kno what? I dont go to dentists anymore. I know how to use a drill and a tub of pollyfil. And Farmers? Bollox. Anyone can put seed in the ground and, like, wait a bit.
Ask a politician how do they do what they do and actually SLEEP at night.
How do you do what you do?
RobinKidderminster said:
Ah, here comes the abuse.
You know, for a small island state with no economy, you've got a bloody impressive view of yourselves.
Someone likened this thread to Monty PyThon. Well, I'm not the Messiah, I'm just a very naughty boy.
Internet Drama-queen...
JonAlacrityA said:
Sorry u find this abusive. I have no idea what u r trying to say above. Kinda trying to make sense of some fairly huge claims and to try to understand some contradictory information. I think when someone claims 'new physics' and suddenly after '20 years' small speakers are producing 'subsonic' frequencies then most here will be a little sceptical. I would ask if any forumites have heard yr speakers. Maybe we need a new thread? Send me a pair please! David - don't u fancy an audition? Cheers
Frank Harvey
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JonAlacrityA said:
Thanks 🙂
Ignoring the full frequency range for now, the average standmount will have a frequency response of roughly 60Hz-20kHz at -3dB/+3dB. Yours looks like it is -5dB/+12.4dB for the same range - that doesn't sound very flat to me? Any explanation so I can understand that?
steve_1979 said:JonAlacrityA said:We're a company that publishes it's test results.
This one is for our 'typical' 2-way speaker, the Caterthuns.
Hello and welcome to the forum Jon. 🙂
I have a question about your speakers. How exactly are you making those measurements?
We used an XTZ Pro II Analyzer system
Why not? It's a simple flat graph.
That's right. See, you can read a simple graph.
(SIGH!)
Really? Is that what you BELIEVE? Received wisdom is no wisdom at all. Be a bit more objective.
Yes, they are effectively FLAT TO 16 Hertz!
When did you hear my loudspeakers fail to live-up to my claims?
J+AAt
Frank Harvey
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Craig M. said:
Maybe. But how many manufacturers give an in room measurement? I know it is a more meaningful measurement, but to compare to other manufacturers, an anechoic measure to is needed so that we can see what the speaker itself is capable of.
Covenanter
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JonAlacrityA said:
Do you really think being abusive will convince anybody that what you say about your equipment is valid? Personally your posts have convinced me that I wouldn't go near anything made by you even if it came with free pots of frankincense and myrrh.
Chris
Frank Harvey
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JonAlacrityA said:
Yes, they are effectively FLAT TO 16 Hertz!
When did you hear my loudspeakers fail to live-up to my claims?
J+AAt
+4dB at 25Hz, +4.8dB at 20Hz, and -1.7dB at 16Hz. That's not flat. That's a serious roll off (6.5dB roll off over 4Hz - that's a drop of half in output, then half again). Even most subwoofers using large 12" drivers will be -3dB at 20Hz, so I doubt very much that a 6.5" can reach flat to 16. To get flat to 16Hz you'll need a minimum of two 12" drivers, a bigger box, and some decent amplification to go it too. If what I am saying is pointless because that's an in room measurement, then give up us an anechoic measurement to prove your point.
BigH said:
Then go to your nearest independent hi-fi dealer, tell them that you want to test our loudspeakers. They will then contact me for a demo pair (which we will dispatch for free), and arrange an audition for you, hopefully, within a week of your initial enquiry.
Alternatively, we are based in Brighton, for a pure demonstration (we are not a hifi dealer, but we can arrange a demo).
We hope this is convenient enough.
J+AAteam
Frank Harvey
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I agree the proof is in the listening, but there are some technical specs that will give you an idea of how a product is performing, or if it is doing something seriously wrong. I also know that a frequency curve won't tell you if a product sounds good or not.
If he wants to send them in to us we'll have a listen and see how they perform against what we feel is the best we have at a similar price. I'd be sceptical though, as he is claiming bass performance equivalent in depth to a specially designed £2,000 DXD12012 subwoofer. Even the Blades (eight 9" drivers) aren't flat to 16hz - KEF tell me they could've made them flat to 20Hz but they sounded too bassy. I still want to see an anechoic reading.
If he wants to send them in to us we'll have a listen and see how they perform against what we feel is the best we have at a similar price. I'd be sceptical though, as he is claiming bass performance equivalent in depth to a specially designed £2,000 DXD12012 subwoofer. Even the Blades (eight 9" drivers) aren't flat to 16hz - KEF tell me they could've made them flat to 20Hz but they sounded too bassy. I still want to see an anechoic reading.
FrankHarveyHiFi said:JonAlacrityA said:
Yes, they are effectively FLAT TO 16 Hertz!
When did you hear my loudspeakers fail to live-up to my claims?
J+AAt
+4dB at 25Hz, +4.8dB at 20Hz, and -1.7dB at 16Hz. That's not flat. That's a serious roll off (6.5dB roll off over 4Hz - that's a drop of half in output, then half again). Even most subwoofers using large 12" drivers will be -3dB at 20Hz, so I doubt very much that a 6.5" can reach flat to 16. To get flat to 16Hz you'll need a minimum of two 12" drivers, a bigger box, and some decent amplification to go it too. If what I am saying is pointless because that's an in room measurement, then give up us an anechoic measurement to prove your point.
We're trying to build one, since the loss of Warfedale's, but it's not that easy (we've destroyed everything that was good in this country. Is it me next?.
Maybe if people just listened to the Caterthuns, or listened to the people that HAVE listened to them, before they arbitrarily make-up their minds that I, all my friends, all my customers, all my retailers, all my reviewers (including PAUL MESSENGER), and informed impartial observers, are liars.
But the graphs are accurate. They cannot be faked. Show me your graphs. Do they look like mine? Let's test them on your systems.
My newly developed physics really does allow 170mm drive units to hit 16 Hertz in-room, in a 15 litre cabinet, at the same loudness as every other frequency that they are driven with, up to their crossover frequency.
J+AAt
FrankHarveyHiFi said:
Single 170mm bake-off. U wanna put Naseem up against Ali? "Yeah, my nuke beats ur sling-shot"
Very clever.
Ur corporate closed-mindedness was obvious when you first refused a demo a few years ago. Well, you were wrong then and you're wrong now. We're progressing without you.
If Trade People don't support UK Hi-Fi manufacturers, they're all doomed to AIG China Inc.
Is that what you want? Because, without your support, that's what's comming!
😛oke:
J+AAt
Frank Harvey
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JonAlacrityA said:
Welcome to AVI's world....
Going by what you have said, this is a game changer of such immense proportions that every manufacturer is going to have to go back to the drawing board. If it is correct that the patent for this was filed in 1920, why hasn't it come to fruition in the past 80 years?
I appreciate that room boundaries can add 3-6dB to the output of a sub or speakers, but even so, "flat" to 16Hz requires engineering that relies on the laws of physics which you can bend, but you can't break. KEF's engineers were given free license to create a no holds barred speaker, the best the could create. They had a blank canvas. They could get flat to 20Hz (even though they decided against it) from eight 9" bass drivers in 100 litre cabinets - you're claiming to have bettered that with two 6.5" drivers in 15 litre cabinets - do you have a link to Paul Messenger's review? I believe he reviewed the Blades which he measured to reach under 20Hz in room (flat to 28Hz, anechoic).
Frank Harvey
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I haven't been approached about listening to them. There are a few reps who ask me to try a product because they respect my opinion, but I haven't even heard of your company until yesterday 🙂
My oh would love another visit to my old Uni ground David. Tho' she cost me more than you I recon on our first visit. I studied old Physics back in the 70's but when u have them in I'd love to experience the new physics. I am sure u will let me know :roll:
Frank Harvey
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RobinKidderminster said:
If Jon would like to send a pair along I'll happily give them a try (I asked AVI that too - I got no direct answer), and you'll be quite welcome to come along and have a listen too 🙂
Things are mega busy at the moment though (day off today, which is the only reason I've managed to get online this much), so March would be better.
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