3 amplifiers

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RCduck7

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Aug 18, 2007
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@RCduck7
I would rarely recommend any sub £1,000 amplifier for hard to drive speakers, except for maybe the Cyrus One, which had a decent amount of grunt behind it. Most amplifiers just don’t have the power supply for it.
I understand, mostly amplifiers that are up to 2 ohm stable will drive many speakers. But how do you know what amp has a big power supply? It isn't always shown in the specification is it? I had a cambridge cxa81 in my system, how big is that power supply? I don't know. I have a Audia Flight FL Three S coming my way this week and it has a 576VA supply for 100 watt 8ohms and 160 at 4 ohms. The pre amp section has it's owm small power supply. They call it dual mono but is it really? i thought dual mono was a power supply for each channel?
 
I understand, mostly amplifiers that are up to 2 ohm stable will drive many speakers. But how do you know what amp has a big power supply? It isn't always shown in the specification is it? I had a cambridge cxa81 in my system, how big is that power supply? I don't know. I have a Audia Flight FL Three S coming my way this week and it has a 576VA supply for 100 watt 8ohms and 160 at 4 ohms. The pre amp section has it's owm small power supply. They call it dual mono but is it really? i thought dual mono was a power supply for each channel?
As an example, in the Hegel range, you’d be looking at the H390 at £5000 to be stable at 2ohms. nothing under £1k would be stable at that impedance, especially at any decent volume. The H390 is kicking out 1kWpc into 2ohms. Wpc is part of the story - dynamic capability measured in amperes is another.

Dual-mono is a power supply for each channel, but there can still be limitations on its capabilities depending on its design and components used.
 

Gray

Well-known member
Dual-mono is a power supply for each channel, but there can still be limitations on its capabilities depending on its design and components used.
Do some get away with describing them as dual mono, just with separate power regulation for each channel or must they have a separate transformer and smoothing on each channel to officially qualify as dual mono?
 

RoA

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Feb 11, 2021
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As an example, in the Hegel range, you’d be looking at the H390 at £5000 to be stable at 2ohms. nothing under £1k would be stable at that impedance, especially at any decent volume. The H390 is kicking out 1kWpc into 2ohms. Wpc is part of the story - dynamic capability measured in amperes is another.

Dual-mono is a power supply for each channel, but there can still be limitations on its capabilities depending on its design and components used.
Paper specs ... .

In the real world you pair amplifiers with suitable speakers or vice versa.

'Unconditionally' stable amplifiers are simply not necessary nor are they a guarantee for good sound.

I have heard some systems which wouldn't make sense on paper but sounded nice. Some of those included valves, others low powered solid state.

Build your system according to your preferences and match them carefully.

If you really want an arc welder they are of course about.
 

RCduck7

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2007
75
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18,545
As an example, in the Hegel range, you’d be looking at the H390 at £5000 to be stable at 2ohms. nothing under £1k would be stable at that impedance, especially at any decent volume. The H390 is kicking out 1kWpc into 2ohms. Wpc is part of the story - dynamic capability measured in amperes is another.

Dual-mono is a power supply for each channel, but there can still be limitations on its capabilities depending on its design and components used.
I you go class D it doesn't have to be 5000£ to be stable at 2 ohms even Class a/b is possible you look hard with lesser known brands. But as said before in this thread good on paper is not always a good match. I agree a bigger power supply is better with harder to drive speakers.
 

MUSICRAFT

Well-known member
it doesn't have to be 5000£ to be stable at 2 ohms even Class a/b is possible you look hard with lesser known brands.

a bigger power supply is better with harder to drive speakers.
Indeed (y) @ a UK RRP of £2850 enter Kinki Studio Audio's EX-M7. The EX-M7 amongst it's other qualities is a high speed, ultra wide bandwidth (0 - 2.5MHz), ultra high current amplifier enabling sustained power into practically any load. The EX-M7's ability to grip, drive and energise loudspeakers, combined with it's overall musicality is such that I've found the results to be preferable than some active loudspeakers I've heard over the years! The EX-M7 is one very serious amplifier and one which I'll be getting. Just need to decide between Silver or Black finish.

Btw, the quality of the EX-M7's build, fit, finishing and vault like solidity is exquisite
:)
:)

kinki studio ex-m7 top panel pic..jpg

kinki studio ex-m7 inside front top pic..jpg
 
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RCduck7

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2007
75
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18,545
Indeed (y) @ a UK RRP of £2850 enter Kinki Studio Audio's EX-M7. The EX-M7 amongst it's other qualities is a high speed, ultra wide bandwidth (0 - 2.5MHz), ultra high current amplifier enabling sustained power into practically any load. The EX-M7's ability to grip, drive and energise loudspeakers, combined with it's overall musicality is such that I've found the results to be preferable than some active loudspeakers I've heard over the years! The EX-M7 is one very serious amplifier and one which I'll be getting. Just need to decide between Silver or Black finish.

Btw, the quality of the EX-M7's build, fit, finishing and vault like solidity is exquisite
:)
:)

View attachment 2781

View attachment 2782
Very nice, keep us informed. What do you use now?
 
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I you go class D it doesn't have to be 5000£ to be stable at 2 ohms even Class a/b is possible you look hard with lesser known brands. But as said before in this thread good on paper is not always a good match. I agree a bigger power supply is better with harder to drive speakers.
Just because a manufacturer states a power output into 4ohms, it doesn’t necessarily mean they’ll be stable into it, which is quite a common occurrence for budget amplifiers. And 2ohms is a whole other story, but again, stating a power output at 2ohms and 1ohm isn’t always reliable if it’s just a stated spec on a website. My statement was be based on measured facts from hi-fi news.

Plus, that Kinki comparison is comparing a power amp to an integrated amplifier. We’re talking integrated amps here.
 
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MUSICRAFT

Well-known member
Very nice, keep us informed. What do you use now?
Thanks and will do (y)At the moment the system is on hold until. I did initially think about getting Kinki Studio Audio's just as impressive dual monaural EX-M1+ integrated amplifier which has the same price as the EX-M7 of £2850 btw. However as I am looking to use an Innuos Statement with either a dCS Bartok or an EMM Labs/Meitner Audio MA3 I thought about utilizing the Bartok's and the MA3's variable output. Hence an EX-M7 with direct drive from a Bartok or an MA3.

Btw, and out of interest what system are you using please?
 

MUSICRAFT

Well-known member
I wish these Chinese companies would employ some English speakers to check their product brands. Kinki Studio…? It’s almost as bad as ‘Nobsound’! 😄
The owner and chief designer of Kinki Studio Audio named the brand Kinki after his wife. Apparently Kinki is a fairly common name in China. Anyway, I guess different names and words can have different meanings in different parts of the world.

Btw, whilst and unfortunately there might be some who will take the mickey of the name, the Kinki Studio Audio guys are not messing around. They've got their heads down and are producing truly fabulous products.
 

RCduck7

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2007
75
14
18,545
The owner and chief designer of Kinki Studio Audio named the brand Kinki after his wife. Apparently Kinki is a fairly common name in China. Anyway, I guess different names and words can have different meanings in different parts of the world.

Btw, whilst and unfortunately there might be some who will take the mickey of the name, the Kinki Studio Audio guys are not messing around. They've got their heads down and are producing truly fabulous products.
I read a lot of good things about this amp. I have seen you are also a dealer of denafrips. They are known for the very good dac's they make. But what about the amplifiers? You have the "Thallo" amp in stock? I would like to know how this compares to the Kinky.
 
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MUSICRAFT

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I read a lot of good things about this amp. I have seen you are also a dealer of denafrips. They are known for the very good dac's they make. But what about the amplifiers? You have the "Thallo" amp in stock? I would like to know how this compares to the Kinki.
Yes, Kinki Studio Audio amplification is good and to put it mildly then some and more :) Yes, we also deal with Denafrips Audio's products. Funnily enough it was because of the lockdown here earlier on in the year and us wanting to take on Denafrips that I became aware of Kinki Studio Audio. In March I got a hold of an EX-M1+ dual monaural integrated amplifier to try and use at home. The rest is history.

At the moment we're only stocking Denafrips Audio's DAC's and DDC's. I've not yet heard the Thallo or any of their other amplification. By all accounts just as with their DACS's, Denafrips amplification is also supposed to be excellent.

Btw, are you using Dynaudio Heritage Special speakers please?
 

RCduck7

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2007
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Btw, are you using Dynaudio Heritage Special speakers please?
Yes, i do. Starting at 80 watt would be fine when i read a german test of these speakers but they do need current to shine. The test also shown that they are rather 83 to 84 db iffecient but the load is more like 5 ohm in general.
 
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Must’ve gone off Lyngdorf…what’s next?
Maybe he will go back to recommending Van Den Hul's The Integration Hybrid interconnect ?

 

MUSICRAFT

Well-known member
Yes, i do. Starting at 80 watt would be fine when i read a german test of these speakers but they do need current to shine. The test also shown that they are rather 83 to 84 db iffecient but the load is more like 5 ohm in general.
Thanks for your reply. It would also be useful to know what source and amplification you're using or were with your Heritage Special speakers please.

In the meantime yes, it looks like the Heritage Special speakers can do with a good dose of current and then some. Fwiw, I have a pair of Dynaudio DM 2/7's and these sound spectacular on the end of the Thor's Hammer of an amplifier that is the EX-M7. If you have a pre amp or a source with a variable output then please try and hear your Heritage Special speakers with an EX-M7. Like I said earlier the EX-M7 amongst it's other qualities is a high speed, ultra wide bandwidth (0 - 2.5MHz), ultra high current amplifier. Not intended to sound as a negative and as good as they are however I don't believe Heritage Special speakers are capable of fully revealing the qualities of the EX-M7. The positive is that the amp is unlikely to be a limiting factor and will readily withstand and reveal the potential of future component changes.
 

RCduck7

Well-known member
Aug 18, 2007
75
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18,545
Thanks for your reply. It would also be useful to know what source and amplification you're using or were with your Heritage Special speakers please.

In the meantime yes, it looks like the Heritage Special speakers can do with a good dose of current and then some. Fwiw, I have a pair of Dynaudio DM 2/7's and these sound spectacular on the end of the Thor's Hammer of an amplifier that is the EX-M7. If you have a pre amp or a source with a variable output then please try and hear your Heritage Special speakers with an EX-M7. Like I said earlier the EX-M7 amongst it's other qualities is a high speed, ultra wide bandwidth (0 - 2.5MHz), ultra high current amplifier. Not intended to sound as a negative and as good as they are however I don't believe Heritage Special speakers are capable of fully revealing the qualities of the EX-M7. The positive is that the amp is unlikely to be a limiting factor and will readily withstand and reveal the potential of future component changes.
I have very powerful class D amps that sound very good with the right speakers but it doesn't click with me on the Heritage. The Cambridge cxa81 was better, more bass impact but ultimately felt a bit short in a larger room at higher volumes. Not so in the lows but a little harsh on Billy idol records when higher volume is needed. Rightnow i just got an Audia Flight Three S. It is still in the box. I will connect it tommorow and propably will do critical listening to it next week.
 

MUSICRAFT

Well-known member
I have very powerful class D amps that sound very good with the right speakers but it doesn't click with me on the Heritage. The Cambridge cxa81 was better, more bass impact but ultimately felt a bit short in a larger room at higher volumes. Not so in the lows but a little harsh on Billy idol records when higher volume is needed. Rightnow i just got an Audia Flight Three S. It is still in the box. I will connect it tommorow and propably will do critical listening to it next week.
Ok . Thanks and I hope you enjoy the performance of the Three S (y)
 
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