Which Pro-ject Debut would be most valuable? Edwards Audio Apprentice MK2 enters game.

[BigH]

Other options are Nagaoka mp-110 which is about £110.

Or Denon DL110 but not with a metal platter, they are about £150.

 

[Al ears]

Other options are Nagaoka mp-110 which is about £110.

Or Denon DL110 but not with a metal platter, they are about £150.

Agreed. There is one other, cheaper again, but nothing to touch it at the price and that's the Shure M97xE

 

[Mihai]

I've recently upgraded my Debut Carbon cart from OM10 to 2M Red and I'm happy with the result. The 2M Red is clearly a better cart compared to the OM10. I wouldn't describe the Red being bright as others on this forum, I think that is even less bright than the OM10, but the hights have now detail.

So if I were you I would go for the Debut Carbon prefited with the 2M Red, save a little more because the price difference isn't big. I've done the same mistake buing the Debut Carbon fitted with OM10 and I was never happy with it untill I've upgraded the cart.

if you buy the Debut Carbon with the standard platter have in mind that the felt mat is a joke and it should be the first upgrade to the deck.

 

[Al ears]

I've recently upgraded my Debut Carbon cart from OM10 to 2M Red and I'm happy with the result. The 2M Red is clearly a better cart compared to the OM10. I wouldn't describe the Red being bright as others on this forum, I think that is even less bright than the OM10, but the hights have now detail.

So if I were you I would go for the Debut Carbon prefited with the 2M Red, save a little more because the price difference isn't big. I've done the same mistake buing the Debut Carbon fitted with OM10 and I was never happy with it untill I've upgraded the cart.

if you buy the Debut Carbon with the standard platter have in mind that the felt mat is a joke and it should be the first upgrade to the deck.

This is why I suggested buying the turntable without either of these entry level cartridges fitted and buying something really decent instead.

 

[Canguino Purlat]

Hi again, while deciding between the Debuts, I've been offered a Music Hall mmf 2.2. Its list price was 446€ but I can get it for 300€. I've been looking for information and it seems very similar to Pro-jects. Worth the price?

 

[Al ears]

Hi again, while deciding between the Debuts, I've been offered a Music Hall mmf 2.2. Its list price was 446€ but I can get it for 300€. I've been looking for information and it seems very similar to Pro-jects. Worth the price?

Looks like a Rega, however it is a Czech built turntable made in same factory as Project I believe.

Czech made using Chinese parts but it may be worth considering at that price.

Fit it with a decent cartridge and who knows?

 

[BigH]

Sounds like a good deal. Found this article about it: http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/tested-affordable-turntables-from-music-hall-pro-ject-rega-nottingham/

 

[Canguino Purlat]

I've seen on Music Hall webpage that there's a new mmf 2.3 with carbon fiber arm (of course! Is there anything that hasn't got a carbon fiber part, hehehe?). So that would be the cause of the price drop. The cartridge on the 2.2 is a Music Hall Tracker. Not a lot of information about it, but people say its a decent sounding cart.

 

[Al ears]

I've seen on Music Hall webpage that there's a new mmf 2.3 with carbon fiber arm (of course! Is there anything that hasn't got a carbon fiber part, hehehe?). So that would be the cause of the price drop. The cartridge on the 2.2 is a Music Hall Tracker. Not a lot of information about it, but people say its a decent sounding cart.

The cartridge may say Music Hall but I it's a rebadged Goldring Elektra which isn't too bad (about £69 worth).

 

[Canguino Purlat]

The dealer has said me the cartridge is an Ortofon OM10, so... I don't know, I can get a Debut Carbon with OM10 for 290€ or with a 2M Red for 330... Decisions, decisions...

 

[Al ears]

The dealer has said me the cartridge is an Ortofon OM10, so... I don't know, I can get a Debut Carbon with OM10 for 290€ or with a 2M Red for 330... Decisions, decisions...

The dealer is wrong if it is the standard fit cartridge. In the UK it is fitted with the rebadged Goldring. If the dealer has retro fitted it with an OM10 you are going to get a cheaper cartridge than normal.

 

[Canguino Purlat]

That's what I think. So I don't like this offer at all.

 

[macdiddy]

the Debut Carbon with a 2M Red for 330, good value considering the 2M goes for about £90 on it's own.

*music2*

 

[Benedict_Arnold]

I have a Debut III SB from about 2010. Barely used, 50Hz pulley, Ortofon Red cartridge. Couple of scratches on the perspex cover. Cant seem to be able to get a 110 volt power supply and the smaller pulley needed for 60 Hz. Also I can't find the little weight on a string for the anti-skate.
I'm open to offers but I might just buy another used one on EBay and make the best one out of the two.
I'd also like to be able to ditch the onboard phono preamp and soldered in cables. Ideas?

 

[brownz]

I have a Debut III SB from about 2010. Barely used, 50Hz pulley, Ortofon Red cartridge. Couple of scratches on the perspex cover. Cant seem to be able to get a 110 volt power supply and the smaller pulley needed for 60 Hz. Also I can't find the little weight on a string for the anti-skate. I'm open to offers but I might just buy another used one on EBay and make the best one out of the two. I'd also like to be able to ditch the onboard phono preamp and soldered in cables. Ideas?

PSU Should be auto switching between 100-240 have a look at what it says on it. http://www.henleydesigns.co.uk/Anti-Skate-Weight-p600 http://www.henleydesigns.co.uk/Replacement-Pulleys-p877 http://www.henleydesigns.co.uk/RCA-Junction-Box-p1245 Apologies for not posting live links but it triggered the rather over-zealous spam filter.... Jeesh. I was only trying to help !! ;-)

 

[Benedict_Arnold]

Thanks for that. The PSU is definitely only 230 volt / 50 Hz and I've already been told I need a new pulley. Still, Alvin and the Chipmunks doing Barry White numbers could be fun...

 

[Al ears]

Thanks for that. The PSU is definitely only 230 volt / 50 Hz and I've already been told I need a new pulley. Still, Alvin and the Chipmunks doing Barry White numbers could be fun...

Only if you're some serious drugs ....... like Scotch. ;-)

 

[Benedict_Arnold]

Thanks for that. The PSU is definitely only 230 volt / 50 Hz and I've already been told I need a new pulley. Still, Alvin and the Chipmunks doing Barry White numbers could be fun...

Only if you're some serious drugs ....... like Scotch. ;-)

The doctors made me give all that up a few years ago :-( :-(

Anyway, I checked the turntable ands its definitely a Debut III Phono SB with the Speedbox screwed on underneath and what appears to be an Ortofon OMB-10 cartridge. I say appears to be, because I can't find any reference to that cartridge on the Ortofon website and I've long since lost the original purchase receipt. Power supply is 16 volts AC, and since it's AC I assume that the frequency affects the motor speed, hence the need for different pulleys for different locales.

Assuming it IS an OMB-10, is there any point in upgrading now or should, as I think, wait until I've finally got my "proper stereo" up and running and see what it sounds like then? Suggestions for a replacement cartridge if I do?

Also, It's got the original platter (die-cast aluminium - yes,. with the proper number of "i"s in it) and felt mat. Any point in upgrading those to something with more inertia? If so, what?

I don't see much point in upgrading the tonearm as well, might as well throw the whole shebang in the trash and buy a new one if I do that as well as the cartridge, platter, mat.... Start with a Ford Focus and upgrade until it's a GT40? Not likely!

 

[Canguino Purlat]

Oh my god: is it internet a blessing or a curse? When you think you are on target, another option comes in. What about Edwards Audio tt? I've seen an EA Apprentice MK2 for a very good price. I've read it's basically a Rega P2 with some tweaks: acrylic platter, some bearing upgrade, different belt, Rega RB202 arm and Zephyr C100 cartridge (rebadged AT95). List price was 469€ but they sell it for 299€. Good deal?

 

[Jim_W]

Oh my god: is it internet a blessing or a curse? When you think you are on target, another option comes in. What about Edwards Audio tt? I've seen an EA Apprentice MK2 for a very good price. I've read it's basically a Rega P2 with some tweaks: acrylic platter, some bearing upgrade, different belt, Rega RB202 arm and Zephyr C100 cartridge (rebadged AT95). List price was 469€ but they sell it for 299€. Good deal?

That is obviously a very good deal; yes, it's a Rega by any other name with a decent rebadged AT 95e which won't need to be upgraded immediately to get the table to produce a good quality sound. I think it's a great deal.

 

[Al ears]

Thanks for that. The PSU is definitely only 230 volt / 50 Hz and I've already been told I need a new pulley. Still, Alvin and the Chipmunks doing Barry White numbers could be fun...

Only if you're some serious drugs ....... like Scotch. ;-)

The doctors made me give all that up a few years ago :-( :-(

Anyway, I checked the turntable ands its definitely a Debut III Phono SB with the Speedbox screwed on underneath and what appears to be an Ortofon OMB-10 cartridge. I say appears to be, because I can't find any reference to that cartridge on the Ortofon website and I've long since lost the original purchase receipt. Power supply is 16 volts AC, and since it's AC I assume that the frequency affects the motor speed, hence the need for different pulleys for different locales.

Assuming it IS an OMB-10, is there any point in upgrading now or should, as I think, wait until I've finally got my "proper stereo" up and running and see what it sounds like then? Suggestions for a replacement cartridge if I do?

Also, It's got the original platter (die-cast aluminium - yes,. with the proper number of "i"s in it) and felt mat. Any point in upgrading those to something with more inertia? If so, what?

I don't see much point in upgrading the tonearm as well, might as well throw the whole shebang in the trash and buy a new one if I do that as well as the cartridge, platter, mat.... Start with a Ford Focus and upgrade until it's a GT40? Not likely!

The cartridge would be my first point of upgrade if you can get that pulley sorted. What sort of money where you thinking of? I don't think a platter upgrade will make much difference on a turntable of this price. Many upgrades and you son find you have spent again the original purchase price of the turntable, for a small gain in sound quality. Better, to my mind, is to take a hit, sell the turntable and buy a whole new one that should suffice as is for years. Only don't buy a turntable with a pre-fitted cartridge as this is extremely limiting and you could do a whole lot better, most of the time, but wisely choosing your own cartridge.

What's your budget for cartridge?

 

[Benedict_Arnold]

20p

I think you're right. Live with it as is, hand it on to one of the "Millenials" so that he might actually play those vinyl things, save up the beer money for something newer / better. Will probably wait and see how the new Technics turns out compared to similar priced offerings from Pro-Ject, Rega, etc. This one was just a toe in the water to see if I still liked vinyl.

 

[Al ears]

20p

I think you're right. Live with it as is, hand it on to one of the "Millenials" so that he might actually play those vinyl things, save up the beer money for something newer / better. Will probably wait and see how the new Technics turns out compared to similar priced offerings from Pro-Ject, Rega, etc. This one was just a toe in the water to see if I still liked vinyl.

Are we to assume then that you do? ;-)

 

[nopiano]

I'd chose the 111 because the Red cartridge can be upgraded to a Blue, and is a more current design.

Really? I thought the Carbon was the more recent model?

It is. Perhaps nopiano means the cartridge.

Thanks, Al, yes, the OM10 is the old bit. For a new user, upgrading the stylus is the easiest improvement, hence my suggestion.

And to the OP, the Edwards is a bargain at that price. (I once knew Kevin Edwards, who I believe is responsible for this, but I have no interest in promoting it!).

 

[Canguino Purlat]

How does the AT95 compare to the Ortofons (OM10 or 2M Red)?