Video as opposed to filmic quality a shock, comments please

[admin_exported]

I have just received my Samsung LED UB468000 and whilst the picture is stunning but I don't know whether I am disappointed at the almost too real presentation of the picture. I recorded on sky HD Lark Rise and Hustle and watched a BD film last night and the smoothness or luxurious feel to what I believe would have been 'recorded on film' picture has gone. The loss of atmosphere is palpable and I am not sure I like it. Some things that I never saw on my beautiful but sadly now defunct 28" WEGA like depth of field changes are amazing but this too is confusing me as to whether this new level of detail is a good thing. It will take some getting used to.

My question is: The Samsung's picture and the device itself are quite spectacular but I need to know is this 'reality' normal or is there a way no doubt spending quite some time with picture settings to try and get this back.

Will a lifetimes conditioning to a CRT presented PAL picture eventually be overcome because right now and it has only been a couple of hours viewing I think I miss the smaller, smoother more intimate picture.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi there,

I think I know what you mean and can't disagree

I recently purchased a JVC HD350 projector which for me and my budget is my pinacle of cinema at home - I love the way films pretty much convey the same feeling I seem to remember I get when I go to the cinema

I don't even mind films that are a bit grany - they add up to the vintage aspect of the film and art of film making (at least for me and I am sure many will disagree)

On the other hand though my Philips TV set is great and especially for watching TV on a regular basis. Details are fantastic and the picture does stand out.

Though when it comes to movies I don't get the cinematic feel to the same extent (I wonder if you could minimise the impact of the TV set artifacts by tunring off the frame creation and other picture processing options?)

So for me the French connection and taxi driver in grany stock and over saturated 70's colour pallettes will always be my choice over three dimensional-looking films on the newest LCD out there

But do play with settings - they should make a big difference

 

[Anonymous]

I agree. Too much detail and perfect quality can take some of the "feeling" out of a movie for sure. Just like the less than "perfect" sound quality of vinyl can sound better or atleast more pleasant to the ears than a perfect digital source.

 

[aliEnRIK]

Sounds to me like you have some sort of 'motion' processing switched on that makes the picture look unrealistic

 

[Anonymous]

mmvi:
I have just received my Samsung LED UB468000 and whilst the picture is stunning but I don't know whether I am disappointed at the almost too real presentation of the picture. I recorded on sky HD Lark Rise and Hustle and watched a BD film last night and the smoothness or luxurious feel to what I believe would have been 'recorded on film' picture has gone. The loss of atmosphere is palpable and I am not sure I like it. Some things that I never saw on my beautiful but sadly now defunct 28" WEGA like depth of field changes are amazing but this too is confusing me as to whether this new level of detail is a good thing. It will take some getting used to.

My question is: The Samsung's picture and the device itself are quite spectacular but I need to know is this 'reality' normal or is there a way no doubt spending quite some time with picture settings to try and get this back.

Will a lifetimes conditioning to a CRT presented PAL picture eventually be overcome because right now and it has only been a couple of hours viewing I think I miss the smaller, smoother more intimate picture.

i recently had a samsung tv for a week , 46b650 , i too was unhappy with motion , until i got the correct(for me anyway) settings , then it was fine , try these settings , it should be much better ... they are for a 46b8000......

Mode: Movie
Backlight: 4
Contrast: 95
Brightness: 44
Sharpness: 0
Color: 53
Tint: G49/R51

Advanced settings submenu
Black tone: Off
Dynamic contrast: Off
Gamma: +2
Color space: Auto
Flesh tone: 0
Edge enhancement: Off
xvYCC: Off

White balance submenu
R-Offset: 26
G-Offset: 25
B-Offset: 25
R-Gain: 28
G-Gain: 23
B-Gain: 19

Picture options submenu
Color tone: Warm2
Size: Screen Fit
Digital NR: Off
HDMI black level: Normal [grayed out]
Film mode: Off [grayed out]
Blue only mode: Off
Auto motion plus 120Hz: Custom
Custom settings:
Blur reduction: 10
Judder reduction: 0

--Setup menu
Game Mode: Off
Energy saving: Off

 

[Anonymous]

mmvi:

I have just received my Samsung LED UB468000 and whilst the picture is stunning but I don't know whether I am disappointed at the almost too real presentation of the picture. I recorded on sky HD Lark Rise and Hustle and watched a BD film last night and the smoothness or luxurious feel to what I believe would have been 'recorded on film' picture has gone. The loss of atmosphere is palpable and I am not sure I like it. Some things that I never saw on my beautiful but sadly now defunct 28" WEGA like depth of field changes are amazing but this too is confusing me as to whether this new level of detail is a good thing. It will take some getting used to.

My question is: The Samsung's picture and the device itself are quite spectacular but I need to know is this 'reality' normal or is there a way no doubt spending quite some time with picture settings to try and get this back.

Will a lifetimes conditioning to a CRT presented PAL picture eventually be overcome because right now and it has only been a couple of hours viewing I think I miss the smaller, smoother more intimate picture.

When I got rid of my old CRT for my samsung LCD it took a while for me to get used to the new screen. I was even tempted to return it at first as I thought the picture looked strange. After a week or so your eyes will probably adjust and get used to it. As it's brand new you are probably over analysing details of the screen instead of just switching off and enjoying the new set. Keep it as long as you can but make sure you leave time to return it for a full refund if you don't get used to it.

 

[Sorreltiger]

I walked past the Sony shop in town at the weekend, saw the footy and felt exactly the same. It looked nothing like the real thing (well, rugby) from the day before. I patted myself on the back for choosing plasma over LCD (ducks to avoid flying brickbats!!!!)

 

[ElectroMan]

I'm sure I read a comment some years ago when DVD was first introduced, that its pictures didn't look as 'filmic' as laserdisc.

 

[aliEnRIK]

Sorreltiger:I walked past the Sony shop in town at the weekend, saw the footy and felt exactly the same. It looked nothing like the real thing (well, rugby) from the day before. I patted myself on the back for choosing plasma over LCD (ducks to avoid flying brickbats!!!!)

I too watched some demo at my local sony shop and saw they had ALL image processing switched on making it look pap

Mine has the lot switched off and looks just fine. NEVER judge a tv in a shop display

 

[scene]

I also can't help but agree about picture processing. I was in RS and they had eight different panels on the wall, all showing the same film, one scene on loop. I suspect they must have had the picture processing on all of them set up to max - or maybe it's just how the manufacturers supplied them - on two of the screens the action looked rotoscoped and on the Phillips it looked more like a Pixar animation than live action

I think there is much too much concentration on "enhancing" the picture to deal with defects in the source (and the abilities of their screens...

) . I've reset the picture processing on screens in stores before now

to get them closer to at home viewing settings (IMHO) and it always improves the picture. It's bad enough that half the shops either show a looping demo of freeview split between 30 screens or a specially made "demo" BD with virtually no motion... Don't get me started on motion blur

Sorry the above seems like a bit of a rant

Vote with your cheque books / credit cards and watch the poorer screens disappear...

 

[Anonymous]

Superb repsonse maxflinn, I have not tried that yet but I will. There are an awful lot of options on the 8000 and I have yet to fully explore every combination

Here is something strange though. I have also bought a PS3 to play BD and be a media centre. Downloading Star Trek in HD (720p) did not have the same Videoesque quality and looked like film. Later the same day I watched Austrailia on Sky HD and to say it was just awful is an understatement. Yes is was pin sharp, yes taken at face value its astonishingly three dimensional but frankly not only do I not like it I am beginning to resent it and am disappointed I have just dropped 2k on a system to find I don't enjoy watching it.

When something is in video and supposed to be, its fine but films I find are almost cringeworthy in their presenation. Its like watching a razor sharp wonderfully coloured, Open university film from the 70's with even changes of scene seeming disjointed and odd.

I dont know what I am going to do but would VERY much appreciate someone explaining some of the tech behind all this and why a transfer from film is resulting in this, and why interestingly the PS3 sourced Star Trek film was okay. I intend to rent the BD disc of the same file to compare. I dont think, and hope not that dropping to 720 is the answer and am looking forward to an expert from the Mag joining this thread to hopefully answer some questions.

 

[aliEnRIK]

Youve just stated your playing from different sources and you havnt yet changed the settings

Switch all the nonsense off as maxflinn put and calibrate them properly for ALL sources and see how it is then

 

[Anonymous]

Like AlienRik stated earlier, if you are seeing movies in an almost video like fashion, then that is the motion processing turned up too high. Frame interpolation can work for some material, but for movies it makes it look like the original film stock without any post editing/processing added - and altogether a bit weird and home movie-ish ! (is that a word ?)

I won't say that all picture processing is bad mind - to the contrary, the Realta processing in my 3800BD is what makes the images just that little bit sharper with lower noise, without sacrificing detail. If processing works then embrace it, if not then ditch it.

 

[Anonymous]

its just set up wrong , when i had the 46b650 it looked terrible until i applied the correct settings , then it looked great , motion was spot on , and the sd even looked a little better than on my plasma ...

 

[Anonymous]

I have just applied the settings recommended above and it has made a big difference. I have made a couple of small further changes and will list these as has been done above. I was surprised to find that many were already close but Gamma and a couple of others I had not already modified made a big difference. Its still not there though and a big surprise is just how much is turned off, just what purpose does all that stuff for if you promply minimise its impact.

Thanks once again for a detailed post maxflinn. That kind of assistance is what using a forum for.

 

[Anonymous]

no problem , just bear in mind , those settings are meant for watching hd in a dimly lit room

 

[aliEnRIK]

mmvi:

I have just applied the settings recommended above and it has made a big difference. I have made a couple of small further changes and will list these as has been done above. I was surprised to find that many were already close but Gamma and a couple of others I had not already modified made a big difference. Its still not there though and a big surprise is just how much is turned off, just what purpose does all that stuff for if you promply minimise its impact.

Thanks once again for a detailed post maxflinn. That kind of assistance is what using a forum for.

Welcome to the world of tvs ~ a sort of 'anti' hifi. With hifi its widely known that the less processing the better the sound quality. For some reason people believe with pictures there should be MORE processing!

At its basics there should be a brightness, contrast and colour selection. Gamma and white balance controls to set greyscale correctly (Many tvs still dont have this function though), and the ability to sort through framerates correctly (Different tvs do this in different ways)

The only other option is to possibly enhance motion as the current standard is very poor. Why they dont make tvs to just 'fill in the blanks' ill never know but every motion control process ive ever seen looks bad every so often (Absolute terrible in some cases), if not all the time.

All other options (Unless ive missed something) is just adding processing that shouldnt be required if the tv did what it was supposed to

 

[digigriffin]

Why we have to spend our money on features that we just have to turn off I will never know.

Panasonic sold 09 NEO-PDPs advertising on TV about "600Hz Sub-field Drive Intelligent Frame Creation Pro".

How they have the cheek to advertise this when it just makes it look like its filmed with a video camera is astounding.

 

[tvspecv]

maybe if you switch to hd viewing you will know the difference between crt and these newer sets

 

[Anonymous]

digigriffin:
Why we have to spend our money on features that we just have to turn off I will never know.

Panasonic sold 09 NEO-PDPs advertising on TV about "600Hz Sub-field Drive Intelligent Frame Creation Pro".

How they have the cheek to advertise this when it just makes it look like its filmed with a video camera is astounding.

i have a g10 , and the motion is very realistic , with or without ifc turned on ...

its impossible to get that video camera look on this tv ...

 

[Anonymous]

My picture is now in order and the smooth image I want is being shown. Funnily enough I have now dialled back in a little bit of the sharpness and am pretty happy. Lesson learned is that the default settings are so off they are almost unreasonable,that quite some time is required to set the system up, and finally is some of this headline grabbing picture processing tech actually needed.

Now to fix the sound, I dont know where to start