The Apex Club

[RickyDeg]

WOW, very nice ric71 :clap: Seems Anthem is definitely doing the trick for you! I read a few online reviews of the A5 amp and they were all very favorable. But it's such a beast! haha

The higher you go with surrounding kit the better Apex does indeed sound. Don't know if I told you but I was present at my dealer when they tested Apex with kit costing three/four times your A5 (Classé, Lexicon, Krell) and the speakers are transparent enough to show off improvements in electronics, without doubt! Not that one could justify an investment like that with these speakers but it was still an eye-opener. So, that your Anthem ain't overkill comes as no surprise.

May I ask about the noise-level of the amp? Is it 'silent' or can you hear backround noise coming from the speakers? And I take it dynamics have improved for you on the whole? Can you go louder with smoothness intact? I've been eyeing the NuForce MCH-300SEC7 myself, if I ever move to separates that is. I've yet to hear it but naturally I will if it comes to that. It's hella compact too!

Enjoy your nitrous oxide upgrade! :rockout:

 

[ric71]

The A5 is completely silent through the speakers no hiss which surprised me. Yes the Apex are far more dynamic now. I can crank the volume to much higher levels without it sounding too loud if you know what I mean. Loads of headroom and all remains smooth and controlled no matter the volume. It's is now on par with my old Lexicon,ADA,Def Tech system even though the Apex cost a fraction of my old Def Techs. They really do sound like an open window to the music/movie now. In my room I feel no need to upgrade them. I may get some front heights but that is now down to aesthetics. Would use my A10's for this and replace them with a pair of A40's but now the Sub15 is sat in the bay window with the A5 on the floor where the sub used to reside my wife is starting to have enough. Oh for a dedicated room.

Once again I can't reiterate how good the Apex are. You really should get a home demo of some serious amplification Ricky. I have been at this hobby for over 15 years and finally have a system that puts a grin on my face.

 

[RickyDeg]

Once again I can't reiterate how good the Apex are. You really should get a home demo of some serious amplification Ricky. I have been at this hobby for over 15 years and finally have a system that puts a grin on my face.

Cheers to that! :cheers: Seems we have enjoyed this hobby for equal amounts of years! I'll never forget my first Pioneer combo-player that swallowed both laserdiscs and dvd's (before dvd's really took off) and my first Yamaha receiver with Sony speakers (!) haha. I wonder if your A5 will improve further after running in? What do you think? I really should home demo some serious amplification with Apex, yes. You are experiencing that first hand. I could never make room for the Anthem though, so the NuForce would be 'perfect' thanks to it's compact size. Dedicated room! If only!

It's good that you don't experience any noise/hissing through the speakers with the A5. That was always an issue I had with my first separates system like a decade ago, and I was not a fan of that. I went from a silent receiver to noisy separates. No matter how good they were overall the noise was irritating. If an amp has a low noise floor it often boads well for it's dynamic capabilites. Who wants to hear constant backround noise from their speakers? I sure don't. Apex deserve better.

 

[greedy]

Paulbroke> you may return that damn Pioneer and buy for that money Denon or Onkyo with MUlteqxt32.And i 100% guaranted, you will have a very big improvement in Apex performance!

DID somebody remember WHATHIFI AW-12 review?Comparision aw-12 to PV1D? http://www.whathifi.com/review/apex-aw12

review is changed.surprise

 

[michael hoy]

Paulbroke> you may return that damn Pioneer and buy for that money Denon or Onkyo with MUlteqxt32.And i 100% guaranted, you will have a very big improvement in Apex performance!

DID somebody remember WHATHIFI AW-12 review?Comparision aw-12 to PV1D? http://www.whathifi.com/review/apex-aw12

review is changed.surprise

Greedy,

Have you ever heard a Pioneer amp with the Apex in your own room and set up correctly. If you had you probably would not be slating it against the Denon as much as you are doing.

XT32 is not the be all and end all of an amplifier.

I have had both and yes personally I did not like the effect Audyssey had, I liked the Denon itself however.

 

[RickyDeg]

Well, I wouldn't be surprised if PV1D had more agile bass than AW-12, much thanks to the built-in DSP EQ. Without it perhaps it would be more of an even match? But hey, you already have Audysseys advanced subwoofer EQ in your XT32 so it's a no-brainer in your case Greedy!

 

[greedy]

Michael hoy> i'm not saying that Pioneer are bad amps.They are good, but...I had LX-83 and had very bad controlled subwoofer( AW-12).I try many tricks with mcacc, tried to change subwoofer placement in room, but i cant get all ok with my AW-12.I heard not only me have that issues.Some people bought another brand receivers, some bought antimode, which takes control of subwoofer..Now i have Denon avr-4311 and my aw-12 is decent If you can have good results with your LX-85- respect

 

[greedy]

RickyDeg> maybe it's misunderstanding- i dont want to buy PV1D Maybe another AW-12 in the future >) because avr-4311 can conect two subs :dance:

 

[paulbroke]

Hi greedy,

I will wait for their response. I will insist for replacement the new one especially lx-85. Because i didnt hear any fault like mine.

Pioneer receiver and apex speakers are producing very quality sound.

If they only accept to repair this lx-75 no matter fo me, i will give this product and my definitive speaker set to my sister. I will buy a new lx-85 or lx-86 :wave:

 

[RickyDeg]

No, no Greedy - there's no misunderstanding. I didn't think you were interested in the PV1D. But you mentioned WH changed review and potential comparisons between the subs, hence my post.

 

[greedy]

RickyDeg> sorry, i was wrong.They didnt change any review.Comparision AW-12 vs pv1d is in Apex set review, but not in AW-12 review..

 

[Chord_Freak]

Hi guys, still running in the new Apex. They are starting to sound a bit smoother at the top end, they sounded a bit bright to start with. I'm impressed with the amount of top-end detail, much more revealing than I expected!

Quick question for people who use the stands and sub on carpet - do you use the supplied spikes? I haven't fitted the spikes as they are so chunky and the carpet is new I don't want to make big holes in it!

Another question for people with the white Apex - does you're Apex sub white match the white of the the A10's and A40? My sub looks darker, more of a creamy white, to the rest of the speakers?

My neighbours are away this weekend so it's the first chance I've had to see what the sub can do and wow, it's got some serious muscle!

A good track for monster bass is 'GO' by Delilah - it felt like my head was going to explode! :rockout:

 

[michael hoy]

Hi Chord_Freak,

I have the spikes fitted to my rear stands and have not found any damage to the carpet after I last moved them.

Mine are black, so cannot comment on the whiteness of the sub.

Keep enjoying the speakers.

 

[Chord_Freak]

Hi Chord_Freak,

I have the spikes fitted to my rear stands and have not found any damage to the carpet after I last moved them.

Mine are black, so cannot comment on the whiteness of the sub.

Keep enjoying the speakers.

Hi Michael, thanks for that. Did you stab the spikes through the carpet and the underlay to the hard floor underneath or do you just let the spikes sit on top of the carpet?

Also, do you use the spikes on the sub - as these are much chunkier than the stand spikes?

Thanks

 

[greedy]

chord_freak> in my opinion, there is no neccesary use spikes at all Stand stability with no spikes is ok even on carpet 8)

 

[michael hoy]

Hi Chord_Freak,

I have the spikes fitted to my rear stands and have not found any damage to the carpet after I last moved them.

Mine are black, so cannot comment on the whiteness of the sub.

Keep enjoying the speakers.

Hi Michael, thanks for that. Did you stab the spikes through the carpet and the underlay to the hard floor underneath or do you just let the spikes sit on top of the carpet?

Also, do you use the spikes on the sub - as these are much chunkier than the stand spikes?

Thanks

I do not use the spikes on the sub, the sub is on a granite slab to isolate it from my hollow wooden floor under the carpet.

The spikes do penetrate down to the wooden floor, the spikes also keep the speaker stands in place so they cannot be moved "accidently".

I also used a level whilst adjusting the spikes so they are level both front to back and left to right. Nothing worse than a wobbly speaker.

Click on AV System at the top of my sig, the TV has changed but the rear speakers and sub are the same.

 

[gosalh]

Hi Guys,



So the temptation bug has started to resurface again and im keen to get a second AW12 subwoofer to complete my system. Ricky i know you're a proud owner of two lovely AW12s, would you highly recommend the additional spend? Will it make a sonic difference to the system with a room approx 19ft (L) x 14ft (W)? I just wanted to get people's opinions and thoughts about acquiring a second subwoofer utilising MulteqXT32 (or whatever else) before i take the next step.

Cheers

 

[RickyDeg]

Hey gosahl, I take it your recent 'height-enhancement' really brought on this more-is-better thing for you? hehe Not too surprising! But after all you did consider adding a second AW-12 earlier on!

I know it might be tricky to borrow one from a dealer for testing, as that would of course be the best way to determine if dual subs will deliver an advantage in your room or not. In most cases I understand that it will, although I've also heard it's room-dependant, but perhaps not only due to the size of the room, but rather how the room itself deals with low frequencies. My room is a tad smaller than yours, given the measurements you stated, but I achieve better bass dispersion and a more coherent low frequency blend now that I have two and I could never go back. I don't really get more bass in theory, but in practice is feels that way. Low frequencies are "closer" somehow.

All of that is with MultEQ XT, mind you. No individual subwoofer calibration. When I tested the Onkyo TX-NR5009 with XT32 you may recall that I mentioned improvements with dual subwoofer calibration, and that's what I miss most about the Onkyo. Definition and control was amazing. I'd like to think that with your Denon you could attain similar results, but you never know. As always, if you can experiment with placement of the subs the better result you can get. My first AW-12 had a pre-determind placement (front right corner) and I had little option there. The second one I have moved around a bit til I found the very best placement (rear left corner, behind sofa).

 

[gosalh]

Thanks Ricky, cheers for the reply

Have you found that having two subs bring out more of the midrange as well? and dialogue to warmer or bassy?

 

[gosalh]

Thanks Ricky! i think its time for another demo...

No more goodies for me going forward if i do end up buying a second subwoofer, im done lol

 

[RickyDeg]

Honestly I haven't reflected upon that. It was a while ago now since I first installed the second AW-12. But I will say this: the entire soundstage have 'grown' in many aspects thanks to the improved bass dispersion alone and the overall presence in the room, which to me is essential. If that actually has to do with improvements in midrage perception aswell I'm not sure. It has added more 'weight' to dialogue in soundtracks that require it simply because low frequencies appear more profound and 'closer' than before. I wouldn't say dialogue sounds 'warmer' though.

Another slight advantage with XT32, I noticed, was also that the subwoofers disappear (blend) even better, which meant low frequencies were near impossible to determine where they eminated from. Honestly I can't wait to get XT32 down the line!

 

[RickyDeg]

No more goodies for me going forward if i do end up buying a second subwoofer, im done lol

Sure... you say that now! :rofl: hahaha

 

[gosalh]

hahaha lol

 

[pioneer7]

Hi gosalh

Out of interest have you considered a larger sub, personally I think you would get better results it would defo be worth trying this option out, also keep it with Monitor audio I am pretty sure your dealer would advise acordingly, I have tried in the past getting 2 subs but found the extra outlay would have been fruitless for the small gains I would have got, so I tried a larger sub and the results were very good, if this is an option to you it would not take to long to sell on your M/A Sub you have now.

Just a thought....

 

[gosalh]

Hi Pioneer7, thanks for the suggestion. I'll bear it in mind and will get a demo of dual and single large subwoofers, and will get back to you on the thread.