Question Technics SL-1500C vs SL-1200GR

[Nicko_Sparks]

Hey everyone!
I'm new here and I hope I picked the right forum to place this question.
I consider to replace my turntable. Right now I have Pro-ject Primary E Phono which is my first TT and I think it's great entry-level turntable, it served me for 5 years, but I want to step up
my listening experience and make an investment in a decent TT, so I wouldn't need to ever think about replacing it again and rather upgrade what I already have.
I read a bunch of reviews and forums and it looks like SL-1500C and SL-1200GR are both great options while SL-1200GR is slightly better sounding one.
I really like that 1500C has integrated Phono-Stage and Cartridge as well as auto-lift up function, at the same time I don't need DJ features of the 1200GR, anyways my main concern is the sound and price, I'm from Ukraine and 1200GR costs around $2300 here while the price for 1500C is $1500, so looks like I need to overpay around $300 for 1500C and around $600 to get 1200GR considering retail prices of the aforementioned TTs, plus in case of 1200GR I will need to get a dedicated phono preamp and cartridge right away which I think will cost me around $1500 more over the initial price of the TT.
The main question is 1200GR that better than 1500C soundwise to overpay and is it possible to upgrade 1500C over time to get closer or even better sounding turntable? I can afford any of them, but I don't know if it's reasonable in this particular case to get 1200GR, at the same time I don't want to regret my decision later.

Other suggestions are also very welcomed. Thanks in advance =)

 

[Al ears]

Quite a problem to have.
The main issue appears to be the fact that you do not have an amplifier with a built in phono stage.
This, in reality means you are going to have to pay over double for the 1200GR system.
This is why I would put my money on the 1500C but upgrade it's cartridge.
There are other options around within that sort of price range but have no idea what is available where you are or indeed how much they will cost you.
Don't limit yourself to one manufacturer would be my advice and look further into the likes of Pro-ject, Origin Live, Roksan, Avid and the like.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Quite a problem to have.
The main issue appears to be the fact that you do not have an amplifier with a built in phono stage.
This, in reality means you are going to have to pay over double for the 1200GR system.
This is why I would put my money on the 1500C but upgrade it's cartridge.
There are other options around within that sort of price range but have no idea what is available where you are or indeed how much they will cost you.
Don't limit yourself to one manufacturer would be my advice and look further into the likes of Pro-ject, Origin Live, Roksan, Avid and the like.

Thank you so much for the answer. From the brands you mentioned only Pro-Ject is available, here are examples for the similar price range:
- X2 costs around $1600
- Classic Evo Quintet around $2000

 

[Al ears]

Thank you so much for the answer. From the brands you mentioned only Pro-Ject is available, here are examples for the similar price range:
- X2 costs around $1600
- Classic Evo Quintet around $2000

Thanks, I believe both of those would require the addition of a phono preamp but good quality ones should be available for around $300

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Thanks, I believe both of those would require the addition of a phono preamp but good quality ones should be available for around $300

Thanks, so would you still go with 1500C in my case or some of the aforementioned Pro-ject TTs + phono preamp is a better option?

 

[Al ears]

Thanks, so would you still go with 1500C in my case or some of the aforementioned Pro-ject TTs + phono preamp is a better option?

I would say it pretty much comes down to what you like the look of. However as the Classic Evo is coming in very close to the 1200GR in price it becomes difficult to suggest one of the other.
At the end of the day I would suggest all of the turntables mentioned deserve a cartridge upgrade, not sure exactly what the 1200GR comes fitted with where you are, it gets even more complicated and ultimately depends on your maximum budget.
Personally, although I like the Evo I don't like the cheap moving coil cartridge it comes fitted with. That would have to go unless there was a chance of buying the turntable without any cartridge fitted.
Having really thought about it I would go for the 1500C but also upgrade the cartridge and buy an external phono preamp as an upgrade over the one that is fitted to the deck itself.
No doubt others will be along soon to advise differently...

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

I would say it pretty much comes down to what you like the look of. However as the Classic Evo is coming in very close to the 1200GR in price it becomes difficult to suggest one of the other.
At the end of the day I would suggest all of the turntables mentioned deserve a cartridge upgrade, not sure exactly what the 1200GR comes fitted with where you are, it gets even more complicated and ultimately depends on your maximum budget.

1200GR comes without cartridge here. I probably like 1500C and X2 looks more out of four TTs. I think maximum budget is up to $3000 approximately.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Personally, although I like the Evo I don't like the cheap moving coil cartridge it comes fitted with. That would have to go unless there was a chance of buying the turntable without any cartridge fitted.
Having really thought about it I would go for the 1500C but also upgrade the cartridge and buy an external phono preamp as an upgrade over the one that is fitted to the deck itself.
No doubt others will be along soon to advise differently...

What cartridge and phono would you recommend for the 1500C?

 

[Al ears]

1200GR comes without cartridge here. I probably like 1500C and X2 looks more out of four TTs. I think maximum budget is up to $3000 approximately.

In that case I think either of them would be good but I would certainly think about an external phono preamp and a cartridge upgrade in each case but do not be too hasty, let us wait and see if others come along with alternative suggestions.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

In that case I think either of them would be good but I would certainly think about an external phono preamp and a cartridge upgrade in each case but do not be too hasty, let us wait and see if others come along with alternative suggestions.

Sure, thank you so much!

 

[Al ears]

I am not sure who the only other voter was but , with the distinct lack of input from other members, I could explain my reasoning in detail should it be required.
However, I noticed you don't mention the rest of your system.....

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

I am not sure who the only other voter was but , with the distinct lack of input from other members, I could explain my reasoning in detail should it be required.
However, I noticed you don't mention the rest of your system.....

That's very kind of you. I believe the rest of my system is the most fun part. It will probably sound like a completely noob setup, but I stream my turntable via Sennheiser BT100 Bluetooth transmitter to Marshall Woburn bluetooth speaker, both has aptx codec which likely helps it sound better a bit. I read somewhere that there shouldn't be no noticeable difference between wired and bluetooth when used with turntable like mine. I know that BT compresses the sound and that I will probably need to upgrade the rest of the system for the new turntable. I'm considering Sonos Port + Sonos Speakers because it streams via wifi losslessly, but I'm not sure yet if this is the best possible option. I use everything wirelessly for now as my turntable is placed on a dedicated shelf and there's not much space left to put wirelessly connected speakers. It's probably good to add that sometimes I use Shure SRH1540 headphones via RCA to 3.5mm adapter plugged directly to the turntables integrated phono stage.

 

[nopiano]

Of the two Technics, I think the 1500C looks better value in your currency, as you do say you need the included phono stage.

Here in the UK, the 1200GR is typically around £1300 without cartridge, while the Pro-Ject Classic Evo with Quintet Red MC is about £1500. So, on the face of it, the Pro-Ject is the best value for you at $2000, if the 1200GR is $2300.

 

[nopiano]

PS. Now I see you use Bluetooth, even the 1500C looks extravagant, but if you’re planning use a traditional amplifier and speakers in future, the Pro-ject might be the best bet.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Of the two Technics, I think the 1500C looks better value in your currency, as you do say you need the included phono stage.

Here in the UK, the 1200GR is typically around £1300 without cartridge, while the Pro-Ject Classic Evo with Quintet Red MC is about £1500. So, on the face of it, the Pro-Ject is the best value for you at $2000, if the 1200GR is $2300.

Thank you! Actually I just checked that I can order 1200GR from Juno and it will cost me around $1850 with all the taxes included, the only downside here is that it would be really inconvenient to send back if any warranty issue appears.

PS. Now I see you use Bluetooth, even the 1500C looks extravagant, but if you’re planning use a traditional amplifier and speakers in future, the Pro-ject might be the best bet.

Which Pro-ject would you suggest? Pro-Ject Classic Evo with Quintet Red MC?

 

[Al ears]

That's very kind of you. I believe the rest of my system is the most fun part. It will probably sound like a completely noob setup, but I stream my turntable via Sennheiser BT100 Bluetooth transmitter to Marshall Woburn bluetooth speaker, both has aptx codec which likely helps it sound better a bit. I read somewhere that there shouldn't be no noticeable difference between wired and bluetooth when used with turntable like mine. I know that BT compresses the sound and that I will probably need to upgrade the rest of the system for the new turntable. I'm considering Sonos Port + Sonos Speakers because it streams via wifi losslessly, but I'm not sure yet if this is the best possible option. I use everything wirelessly for now as my turntable is placed on a dedicated shelf and there's not much space left to put wirelessly connected speakers. It's probably good to add that sometimes I use Shure SRH1540 headphones via RCA to 3.5mm adapter plugged directly to the turntables integrated phono stage.

Ah, forget what I have said.
There is no reason to progress from what you already have to be truthful.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Ah, forget what I have said.
There is no reason to progress from what you already have to be truthful.

But what if I will add a wired setup in the future?

 

[nopiano]

Which Pro-ject would you suggest? Pro-Ject Classic Evo with Quintet Red MC?

Yes.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Yes.

Thank you!

 

[Gray]

....I'm from Ukraine

Best wishes to you and all in your country Nicko.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Best wishes to you and all in your country Nicko.

Thank you so much! Best wishes to you too!

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

I am not sure who the only other voter was but , with the distinct lack of input from other members, I could explain my reasoning in detail should it be required.

I still would like to hear your opinion in detail if it's possible.

 

[Al ears]

Well headed purely on budget the 1200GR is out of the equation once you add on a decent cartridge and phono preamp. It also has, as you have stated, functions you don't require.
The 1500C is not that far behind in quality but still leaves you plenty of money to upgrade it to a higher quality.
I can see other people recommend the Pro-ject and I might concur if you didn't have to buy it with that cartridge fitted. It still means you would have to budget for a separate phono preamp and I don't like the Quintet Red. You may think it's acceptable but it's their lowest price moving coil cartridge that has all of the disadvantages of the moving coil design and none of the benefits.
I have said in the past that I don't see the point in buying hi output moving coils at all and don't consider it worth getting a low output one if you are not prepared to spend more than £400. However that is just me. I think that you could get a better moving magnet cartridge, with the benefit of a replaceable stylus for the £280 that the Quintet Red costs.
I don't know the quality of the inbuilt phono preamp in the 1500C so I would certainly budget for a good quality external one that would allow you to upgrade to a Moving coil cartridge in the future if you do wished.
In the end it all comes down to what you like the look of.
Whichever way you go I suggest you look at the MOFI Studiophono phono preamp as it is excellent and can be had for around £249. It also has the added benefits of being designed by Tim De Paravicini, a Mono button and a subsonic filter which can come in very useful.

 

[Nicko_Sparks]

Well headed purely on budget the 1200GR is out of the equation once you add on a decent cartridge and phono preamp. It also has, as you have stated, functions you don't require.
The 1500C is not that far behind in quality but still leaves you plenty of money to upgrade it to a higher quality.
I can see other people recommend the Pro-ject and I might concur if you didn't have to buy it with that cartridge fitted. It still means you would have to budget for a separate phono preamp and I don't like the Quintet Red. You may think it's acceptable but it's their lowest price moving coil cartridge that has all of the disadvantages of the moving coil design and none of the benefits.
I have said in the past that I don't see the point in buying hi output moving coils at all and don't consider it worth getting a low output one if you are not prepared to spend more than £400. However that is just me. I think that you could get a better moving magnet cartridge, with the benefit of a replaceable stylus for the £280 that the Quintet Red costs.
I don't know the quality of the inbuilt phono preamp in the 1500C so I would certainly budget for a good quality external one that would allow you to upgrade to a Moving coil cartridge in the future if you do wished.
In the end it all comes down to what you like the look of.
Whichever way you go I suggest you look at the MOFI Studiophono phono preamp as it is excellent and can be had for around £249. It also has the added benefits of being designed by Tim De Paravicini, a Mono button and a subsonic filter which can come in very useful.

Thank you so much! Do you have exact cartridge in mind that you would recommend? I actually can expand my budget if it's worth it, I also consider to order 1200GR from Juno for $1850 as it's the only TT from the aforementioned that doesn't come with phono preamp and cartridge, so I won't have no spare parts as a result. Can you also please recommend an alternative phono as I'm not sure if I'll manage to find the MOFI one here, I still can order it from ebay though if there's no other decent option. I'm not sure if it's allowed to post links here, so I'll just leave screenshots of available phono preamps and MC cartridges from the shop I trust. Thanks in advance!

 

[Al ears]

The Thorens MM 008 is excellent for the price so are the Vincents.
Cannot recommend any of those cartridges as you don't need moving coil and the Thorens will only handle moving magnet,