So Arcam no longer manufacture in the UK either now ?

[eggontoast]

As the title says really, so when did Arcam stop completely stop manufacturing in the UK then. It sort of continues from the thread the other day regarding Audiolabs vague COO markings. I knew Arcam manufactured their rDacs and small equipment like that overseas but always assumed its high end audio equipment was build here, in England. It appears not, so not only is their support structure appalling now they don't even support the local economy. I don't remember seeing the prices fall 30% when overseas manufacturing started, or notice a dramatic improvement in the materials used to build them which means only one thing, more money for the fat cats at the top. Not only that the BOM's for building the amplifiers etc would be minimal, the profit margins huge. Makes me puke, yet another once great British brand to avoid.

 

[scene]

Unless things have changed in the last couple of years, I believe arcam do make their high end avrs and bdp in the uk - though some of the basic parts, like the disc transports are not made here.

There's a whf editor's blog on a visit to their hq from 2010, with the avr600s being made at Waterbeach

 

[bigblue235]

Makes no difference to me.

If companies put their prices up they get pilloried, if they cut costs they get criticised for that too.

How do people know how the manufacturing costs compare? In my industry some companies switched because although it was barely cheaper to have stuff manufactured over there, the quality was better. The quality from a far East production line was faultless in fact, far better than specialist companies in the UK. But if they said, in public, that British assembly was poor, they'd get criticised for that too.

Can't win.

 

[Overdose]

Unless things have changed in the last couple of years, I believe arcam do make their high end avrs and bdp in the uk - though some of the basic parts, like the disc transports are not made here.

There's a whf editor's blog on a visit to their hq from 2010, with the avr600s being made at Waterbeach

A lot can happen in two years.

 

[stevebrock]

Rega sill manufacture in the UK and there stuff is very well priced

 

[eggontoast]

Makes no difference to me.

Well it should do, in case you haven't noticed the country is in the poo. The main GDP for the country is from financial services o/ god help us and this won't last forever either. Job opportunities for the younger generation are getting scarce, shop assistants, burger flippers or more than likely dole que. Why is this, because everything is out sourced, manufacturing, service industry plus many others. The country is losing a vast majority of skills, forever.

If companies put their prices up they get pilloried, if they cut costs they get criticised for that too.

They also get criticised for making huge profits at the expense of the local people/economy.

How do people know how the manufacturing costs compare?

Well I do as I work in the manufacturing industry.

In my industry some companies switched because although it was barely cheaper to have stuff manufactured over there, the quality was better. The quality from a far East production line was faultless in fact, far better than specialist companies in the UK. But if they said, in public, that British assembly was poor, they'd get criticised for that too.

You are talking about outsourcing production which is completely different. Arcam built in house with their own manufacturing lines, quality control was in their hands. In this case it's simply to take advantage or exploit the cheaper labour rate to the cost of the local labour work force, who are now flipping burgers or shop assistants

Can't win.

They can, just don't be greedy.

 

[Anonymous]

I just registered to state that I find it disgusting to move production to another country, irrespective the product line (low-, mid-, high-end).

What should be done is working more efficiently and use better, simpler designs which hopefully could reduce some cost associated with manufacturing. Obviously, I guess most of these company's issue is with labour cost and they rather move it to the East rather than promoting and helping their country of origin and its people.

Sad times these are.

 

[Andrew Everard]

I've asked Arcam for a response to this thread – will post it when received

 

[TheHomeCinemaCentre]

Perhaps Arcam were forced to change their production to actively compete on the worldwide stage. With the constant consumer demand for the higher quality at lower prices - see threads ad infinitum - prehaps something had to give. Everyone wants a bargain but that means someone somewhere in the chain has to work for less.

IMO it is far better that we have overseas production rather than no Arcam at all.

As for it being disgusting may I refer you to any news outlet - there far bigger concerns on our doorstep let alone the world stage.

 

[eggontoast]

As for it being disgusting may I refer you to any news outlet - there far bigger concerns on our doorstep let alone the world stage.

Maybe so, but this is a hi-fi forum........

 

[Andrew Everard]

As promised, here's the response from Arcam MD Charlie Brennan:

'To set the record straight, Arcam make a large amount of kit in the UK, including the AVR600/AV888 and P777 Home Cinema components, the A18, A28 and A38/P38 Hi-fi Amplifiers, the CD37 High-end CD Player, D33 SuperDAC and the MZ 8 and MZ12 multi-room amplifiers. Hardly abandoning the country!

'Your correspondents may want to save their ire for the many Hi-fi and AV brands that are British in name only and haven't manufactured in the UK for decades if ever!'

 

[TheHomeCinemaCentre]

As for it being disgusting may I refer you to any news outlet - there far bigger concerns on our doorstep let alone the world stage.

Maybe so, but this is a hi-fi forum........

Regardless of the overall topic there still needs to be persepctive.

 

[Son_of_SJ]

As promised, here's the response from Arcam MD Charlie Brennan:

'the many Hi-fi and AV brands that are British in name only and haven't manufactured in the UK for decades if ever!'

Such as, for instance ....??

 

[The_Lhc]

As promised, here's the response from Arcam MD Charlie Brennan:

'To set the record straight, Arcam make a large amount of kit in the UK, including the AVR600/AV888 and P777 Home Cinema components, the A18, A28 and A38/P38 Hi-fi Amplifiers, the CD37 High-end CD Player, D33 SuperDAC and the MZ 8 and MZ12 multi-room amplifiers. Hardly abandoning the country!

'Your correspondents may want to save their ire for the many Hi-fi and AV brands that are British in name only and haven't manufactured in the UK for decades if ever!'

I think the OP needs to name the source for his (mis)information...

 

[chebby]

As promised, here's the response from Arcam MD Charlie Brennan:

'the many Hi-fi and AV brands that are British in name only and haven't manufactured in the UK for decades if ever!'

Such as, for instance ....??

Everything made by IAG.

 

[eggontoast]

As promised, here's the response from Arcam MD Charlie Brennan:

'To set the record straight, Arcam make a large amount of kit in the UK, including the AVR600/AV888 and P777 Home Cinema components, the A18, A28 and A38/P38 Hi-fi Amplifiers, the CD37 High-end CD Player, D33 SuperDAC and the MZ 8 and MZ12 multi-room amplifiers. Hardly abandoning the country!

'Your correspondents may want to save their ire for the many Hi-fi and AV brands that are British in name only and haven't manufactured in the UK for decades if ever!'

I don't mean to be pedantic but, can we have a definition of the made in the UK bit.

 

[Covenanter]

On another thread (Audiolab) I wrote:

In the 19th century Cobden wrote "... [should] a country be found whose cottons and woolens shall be cheaper than those of England and the rest of the world then to that spot ... shall all the traders of the earth flock; and no human power, no fleets or armies. will prevent Manchester, Liverpool and Leeds from sharing the fate of their once proud predecessors in Holland, Italy and Phoenicia ...". He was right and the textile industry is no longer located in Britain and what he said applies in the same way to every industry and we in this country would do best to realise that the world changes and we need to change with it.

We live in a global economy now and as a country we have to work hard to do well in whatever sectors we can find some advantage in. Companies will always look for low cost solutions to their problems because price is one of the biggest drivers of profits and the directors of companies have a duty in law to maximise returns to their shareholders.

The company that I used to part-own did high-end landscape design, a lot of which was in the Middle East. We did very well but we never did the implementation work as we would in the UK because there were local firms who could do it much cheaper than we could. So we sub-contracted that work but kept the parts we could do profitably. I expect hifi manufacturers have the same sort of issues, there will be bits they can do economically and bits they can't.

Chris

 

[bigblue235]

Makes no difference to me.

Well it should do, in case you haven't noticed the country is in the poo. The main GDP for the country is from financial services o/ god help us and this won't last forever either. Job opportunities for the younger generation are getting scarce, shop assistants, burger flippers or more than likely dole que. Why is this, because everything is out sourced, manufacturing, service industry plus many others. The country is losing a vast majority of skills, forever.... <snip>

So because you work in a manufacturing industry, you think you can presume what Arcam are doing, what their costs are, what their motives are, how much they're making, and summarise by saying that they're being greedy and we're going to end up with a nation of burger flippers? Come on!

If a company moved manufacturing out of the UK to generate obscene profits, then they could fairly be criticised in the eyes of some. But you had no idea that Arcam had actually done that, and it seems like you were misinformed in the first place anyway.

Maybe just me, but I wouldn't go on the net making assumptions and statements about a company without some facts behind me. It'd be quite easy for people to get the wrong idea and spread rumours, as seems to have happened here, possibly hurting one of the companies who does employ in the UK!

 

[shropshire lad]

As promised, here's the response from Arcam MD Charlie Brennan:

'the many Hi-fi and AV brands that are British in name only and haven't manufactured in the UK for decades if ever!'

Such as, for instance ....??

Everything made by IAG.

Yes , but not for decades .

 

[matthewpiano]

Cambridge Audio are British in name but haven't manufactured in the UK for many many years.

 

[andyjm]

There is very little electronic component manufacture in the UK anymore, the fab plants, pc board manufacturers and component suppliers are all in the far east, with the largest concentration around Shenzen.

It makes no sense to ship hundreds of separate parts halfway around the world to stuff the boards in the UK just for the sake of it. Apart from the logistics issues, it is far cheaper to stuff the boards in China when the suppliers of the components are clustered around you.

I believe that there are also import tax differentials that make it more expensive to import separate components than completed boards. So as a UK company you import completed boards and assemble the final product in the UK, or you give up completely and have it all built in China.

No reflection on the morals or otherwise of the companies concerned, just the economic realities of life.

 

[eggontoast]

Hmm, well on this occasion it appears that my information could be suspect which is unusual but is most welcome news on this occasion. Sorry Arcam.

It's good to hear that Arcam are indeed still manufacturing in England and with such a large number of products too. One would have thought that since they are now one of the minority of manufacturers who still do this that they would advertise the fact to a much greater degree. Why is it not plastered across their products, how come there is no mention of it on their website (I’ve just been on there and can't find any obvious references). Although there are a few numpties who don't care where their new equipment is manufactured, there is a large proportion which do, surely it would be a good idea to broadcast the fact since it is one advantage over your competitors.........

 

[eggontoast]

So because you work in a manufacturing industry, you think you can presume what Arcam are doing, what their costs are, what their motives are, how much they're making, and summarise by saying that they're being greedy and we're going to end up with a nation of burger flippers? Come on!

er no, perhaps you should actually read the posts. You said how do people know how the costs compare, I answered you question by saying I do because I work in the industry, that's it capiche

 

[tino]

Rear shot of an FMJ-A18 ... right hand side ... "Designed and Made in UK" ... I assume the photo is fairly current ...

Clicky

 

[chebby]

One would have thought that since they are now one of the minority of manufacturers who still do this that they would advertise the fact to a much greater degree. Why is it not plastered across their products, how come there is no mention of it on their website (I’ve just been on there and can't find any obvious references).

Because "Some of our stuff is made in Britain and some in China" doesn't quite look right maybe?

But yes, if a company decides to outsource manufacture to China then they should proclaim that as proudly as any other major development in their business on their 'About' page or company history/info pages.