Sibilance after Bi-wiring

[batonwielder]

This is exactly how my biwiring experiment went when I had the Proac D2's. I had tried Chord, Kimber, and Audioquest in separate runs as well as internal biwire. The results were the same, increased sibilance. At first, it could be perceived as more detail, but became unbearable. It did something to the crossover and there was no cure for it.

 

[shadders]

This is exactly how my biwiring experiment went when I had the Proac D2's. I had tried Chord, Kimber, and Audioquest in separate runs as well as internal biwire. The results were the same, increased sibilance. At first, it could be perceived as more detail, but became unbearable. It did something to the crossover and there was no cure for it.

Hi,
Did you put the plates back in ? to remove the sibilance.

Regards,
Shadders.

 

[manicm]

Hi,
Did you put the plates back in ? to remove the sibilance.

Regards,
Shadders.

Retaining the plates while biwiring is highly unorthodox. Would this not result in short circuiting?

 

[shadders]

Retaining the plates while biwiring is highly unorthodox. Would this not result in short circuiting?

Hi,
No, as the wires connected to amplifier output A are still connected to the wires connected to amplifier output B, internally in the amplifier.

Regards,
Shadders.

 

[Adam W.]

What would likely cause an increase in sibilance/distortion when bi-wiring, and why might reinstalling the plates fix it?

 

[manicm]

Hi,
No, as the wires connected to amplifier output A are still connected to the wires connected to amplifier output B, internally in the amplifier.

Regards,
Shadders.

Are you sure about that in the CXA81?

 

[Al ears]

What would likely cause an increase in sibilance/distortion when bi-wiring, and why might reinstalling the plates fix it?

Not a good idea....

 

[shadders]

Are you sure about that in the CXA81?

Hi,
There is only 1 amplifier that has two channels (left and right).

By replacing the plates, you are connecting HF and BASS, which are already connected at the amplifier output node on the PCB before the output relays for the A and B connections.

Regards,
Shadders.

 

[TrevC]

Retaining the plates while biwiring is highly unorthodox. Would this not result in short circuiting?

Only if you've wired it incorrectly. If your wiring is quite thin it could well improve the sound.

 

[TrevC]

Not a good idea....

Why do you think that?

 

[TrevC]

Oops, sorry, I’d quite forgotten, it’s so long since the first post! I think using A and B terminals is a red herring then. It makes no difference whether you use one or both pair of outputs to the amplifier, does it?

That is correct.

 

[Adam W.]

I remember reading somewhere, possibly several years ago, that the idea behind using A and B outputs on the amp for a single pair of speakers is that it would provide a cleaner signal path by effectively increasing the wire gauge, removing the need for jumpers/plates and therefore, potentially, resulting in better sound quality.

Is that the general idea?

 

[nopiano]

I remember reading somewhere, possibly several years ago, that the idea behind using A and B outputs on the amp for a single pair of speakers is that it would provide a cleaner signal path by effectively increasing the wire gauge, removing the need for jumpers/plates and therefore, potentially, resulting in better sound quality.

Is that the general idea?

Using double the quantity of wire increases the gauge, but whether it’s connected two 1 or 2 pairs of amp terminals doesn’t alter that. And removing jumpers/plates is easily done without bi-wiring.

I have found biwiring can work, but so can using better - often more costly - cables, hence the skeptic may say it is really a case of ‘Buy Wire’!

 

[nopiano]

As for the power output, the amp doesn’t strictly ‘send’ anything, which is exactly how I used to think of it too. Apparently, the speaker demands it. Somewhat counter-intuitive, and maybe someone more brainy than me will be able to expand on that. (I can best imagine it that if you shorted the speaker cables the speaker would ‘demand’ the impossible!)

Apologies for quoting myself, but another contributor has reminded me where I read this. Here’s the link below, which also explains the whole idea better than I ever could.

Bi-wiring Speakers: An exploration of the benefits -

(Bi-wiring Speakers) Bi-wireable loudspeakers have been available since at least the late 1980s and are now quite common. You can easily tell if your spea

www.qacoustics.co.uk

 

[Gray]

Yes I know that QED are never gonna say that bi-wiring is a bad idea.
However, read, follow and understand what they're saying here and it's hard to argue against what they say about the electron route:

Bi-wiring Speakers: An exploration of the benefits -

(Bi-wiring Speakers) Bi-wireable loudspeakers have been available since at least the late 1980s and are now quite common. You can easily tell if your spea

www.qacoustics.co.uk

 

[Gray]

Apologies for quoting myself, but another contributor has reminded me where I read this. Here’s the link below, which also explains the whole idea better than I ever could.

Bi-wiring Speakers: An exploration of the benefits -

(Bi-wiring Speakers) Bi-wireable loudspeakers have been available since at least the late 1980s and are now quite common. You can easily tell if your spea

www.qacoustics.co.uk

I must have just posted that at the same time as you!

 

[nopiano]

I must have just posted that at the same time as you!

 

[Gray]

Great minds think alike.
But so do stupid ones (let's disregard that possibility ).

We recognise absolute snake oil justification when we see it, but there's no denying there's a bit of logic there.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

I'm so glad I can't bi-wire, (not enough terminals on the amp or speakers), takes another potential tinkering foray out of my head

 

[manicm]

WHF seem to have often recommended biwiring B&W speakers, so if one wants to experiment why not.

But ALWAYS remove the jumper plates from the speakers if biwiring.

 

[abacus]

It’s a good article above, and proves you need measurements to see any differences (The ear/brain on its own is just so sub-par) however what the article forgot to mention was that as speakers are mechanical the distortion they produce is an order of magnitude above what was measured in the cable, so you would not hear the difference anyway.
Leaving the links in when bi-wiring will not make any difference to the sound, however NEVER leave them in if you bi-amp.
Bill

 

[Gray]

I'm so glad I can't bi-wire, (not enough terminals on the amp or speakers), takes another potential tinkering foray out of my head

Not Tempted? Easy job to modify and hard-wire your crossovers 😁

 

[TrevC]

It’s a good article above, and proves you need measurements to see any differences (The ear/brain on its own is just so sub-par) however what the article forgot to mention was that as speakers are mechanical the distortion they produce is an order of magnitude above what was measured in the cable, so you would not hear the difference anyway.
Leaving the links in when bi-wiring will not make any difference to the sound, however NEVER leave them in if you bi-amp.
Bill

Leaving the links in place might be beneficial because you are doubling the thickness of the conductors.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Not Tempted? Easy job to modify and hard-wire your crossovers 😁

Think I'll pass, Gray

 

[shadders]

Leaving the links in place might be beneficial because you are doubling the thickness of the conductors.

Hi,
The issue of biwiring is that you double the capacitance and inductance of the cables as seen by the amplifier.

Depending on the cable, the capacitance per metre can be quite high, and some amplifiers may not be completely stable with such an increased capacitance.

Regards,
Shadders.