• If you ever spot Spam (either in the forums, or received via forum direct message) please use the Report button at the bottom of each post to make sure a Moderator can handle it quickly. Thanks for your help in keeping things running smoothly!

Sibilance after Bi-wiring

Page 4 - Seeking answers? Join the What HiFi community: the world's leading independent guide to buying and owning hi-fi and home entertainment products.

batonwielder

Well-known member
May 13, 2008
32
2
18,545
This is exactly how my biwiring experiment went when I had the Proac D2's. I had tried Chord, Kimber, and Audioquest in separate runs as well as internal biwire. The results were the same, increased sibilance. At first, it could be perceived as more detail, but became unbearable. It did something to the crossover and there was no cure for it.
 

shadders

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2009
152
88
18,670
This is exactly how my biwiring experiment went when I had the Proac D2's. I had tried Chord, Kimber, and Audioquest in separate runs as well as internal biwire. The results were the same, increased sibilance. At first, it could be perceived as more detail, but became unbearable. It did something to the crossover and there was no cure for it.
Hi,
Did you put the plates back in ? to remove the sibilance.

Regards,
Shadders.
 

shadders

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2009
152
88
18,670
Retaining the plates while biwiring is highly unorthodox. Would this not result in short circuiting?
Hi,
No, as the wires connected to amplifier output A are still connected to the wires connected to amplifier output B, internally in the amplifier.

Regards,
Shadders.
 

Adam W.

Well-known member
Aug 19, 2020
68
37
70
What would likely cause an increase in sibilance/distortion when bi-wiring, and why might reinstalling the plates fix it?
 

shadders

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2009
152
88
18,670
Are you sure about that in the CXA81?
Hi,
There is only 1 amplifier that has two channels (left and right).

By replacing the plates, you are connecting HF and BASS, which are already connected at the amplifier output node on the PCB before the output relays for the A and B connections.

Regards,
Shadders.
 

Adam W.

Well-known member
Aug 19, 2020
68
37
70
I remember reading somewhere, possibly several years ago, that the idea behind using A and B outputs on the amp for a single pair of speakers is that it would provide a cleaner signal path by effectively increasing the wire gauge, removing the need for jumpers/plates and therefore, potentially, resulting in better sound quality.

Is that the general idea?
 

nopiano

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2009
363
227
19,270
I remember reading somewhere, possibly several years ago, that the idea behind using A and B outputs on the amp for a single pair of speakers is that it would provide a cleaner signal path by effectively increasing the wire gauge, removing the need for jumpers/plates and therefore, potentially, resulting in better sound quality.

Is that the general idea?
Using double the quantity of wire increases the gauge, but whether it’s connected two 1 or 2 pairs of amp terminals doesn’t alter that. And removing jumpers/plates is easily done without bi-wiring.

I have found biwiring can work, but so can using better - often more costly - cables, hence the skeptic may say it is really a case of ‘Buy Wire’!
 

nopiano

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2009
363
227
19,270
As for the power output, the amp doesn’t strictly ‘send’ anything, which is exactly how I used to think of it too. Apparently, the speaker demands it. Somewhat counter-intuitive, and maybe someone more brainy than me will be able to expand on that. (I can best imagine it that if you shorted the speaker cables the speaker would ‘demand’ the impossible!)
Apologies for quoting myself, but another contributor has reminded me where I read this. Here’s the link below, which also explains the whole idea better than I ever could.
 

Gray

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2015
1,106
704
6,070
Yes I know that QED are never gonna say that bi-wiring is a bad idea.
However, read, follow and understand what they're saying here and it's hard to argue against what they say about the electron route:
 

Gray

Well-known member
Nov 27, 2015
1,106
704
6,070
Apologies for quoting myself, but another contributor has reminded me where I read this. Here’s the link below, which also explains the whole idea better than I ever could.
I must have just posted that at the same time as you!
 

manicm

Well-known member
May 1, 2008
641
85
18,970
WHF seem to have often recommended biwiring B&W speakers, so if one wants to experiment why not.

But ALWAYS remove the jumper plates from the speakers if biwiring.
 
  • Like
Reactions: plus 1

abacus

Well-known member
Sep 24, 2008
427
173
19,070
It’s a good article above, and proves you need measurements to see any differences (The ear/brain on its own is just so sub-par) however what the article forgot to mention was that as speakers are mechanical the distortion they produce is an order of magnitude above what was measured in the cable, so you would not hear the difference anyway.
Leaving the links in when bi-wiring will not make any difference to the sound, however NEVER leave them in if you bi-amp.
Bill
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gray

TrevC

Well-known member
Jun 12, 2013
338
145
19,070
It’s a good article above, and proves you need measurements to see any differences (The ear/brain on its own is just so sub-par) however what the article forgot to mention was that as speakers are mechanical the distortion they produce is an order of magnitude above what was measured in the cable, so you would not hear the difference anyway.
Leaving the links in when bi-wiring will not make any difference to the sound, however NEVER leave them in if you bi-amp.
Bill
Leaving the links in place might be beneficial because you are doubling the thickness of the conductors.
 
  • Like
Reactions: plus 1

shadders

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2009
152
88
18,670
Leaving the links in place might be beneficial because you are doubling the thickness of the conductors.
Hi,
The issue of biwiring is that you double the capacitance and inductance of the cables as seen by the amplifier.

Depending on the cable, the capacitance per metre can be quite high, and some amplifiers may not be completely stable with such an increased capacitance.

Regards,
Shadders.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY

TRENDING THREADS

Latest posts