SACD transport - recommendations please

[Al ears]

But 100 volts, which is why many Japanese items look good value, but not for UK or EU buyers. What a shame more don’t have switchable voltages like the good old days.

Made for Japanese market where they know they sell. No need for voltage switching unfortunately.

 

[DistortedVision]

I own a few Japanese domestic model hi-fi. Most from the early 2000s. I use transformers from Airlink Transformers. I find JDM stuff from late 90s and 2000s to be high build quality and reliable as they were made in Japan.

 

[TRIPLE A]

And if you don't go the expensive PS Audio route, yet insist on having true DSD output from the player, you're stuck with relying on the DAC inside the player... so to overcome the noise etc. generated from that, you're gonna have to spend even more on a higher-end bit of equipment than you would in using it as a transport. Total non-starter - better off ripping or downloading the dsf files then running them through a decent, external reclocker etc.

 

[manicm]

And if you don't go the expensive PS Audio route, yet insist on having true DSD output from the player, you're stuck with relying on the DAC inside the player... so to overcome the noise etc. generated from that, you're gonna have to spend even more on a higher-end bit of equipment than you would in using it as a transport. Total non-starter - better off ripping or downloading the dsf files then running them through a decent, external reclocker etc.

Well I don't think having an internal DAC on a high end player is a bad thing or necessarily causes noise. Marantz have the Model CD30n, for example.

 

[TRIPLE A]

I'm sure the CD30n is an awesome piece of kit!

Ofc, it's the internals that create noise for the DAC and not so much the other way around as your message implies.
So as a basic principle, it's always for this reason that it's better to have your DAC as isolated as possible e.g. not in the same casing as something needing to perform a different function. But Sony and Philips couldn't have that when it comes to SACD could they?
Sony & Philips' insistence on SACD bitstreams being downscaled and converted to something defeating the purpose, is ultimately what holds the format back then. And you can get DSD sources of much better quality/multiples than the entry-level DSD64 that's on SACDs anyway.

 

[Jasonovich]

And you can get DSD sources of much better quality/multiples than the entry-level DSD64 that's on SACDs anyway.

Exactly, I'm downloading my DSD multiples of SACD and it's really really sweet.
Hi Res streaming is welcoming but for me, DSD is the pinnacle of music listening experience.

 

[manicm]

To all those considering SACD, ignore the clickbaitish title, this is an excellent video explaining SACD transport requirements in addition to a review of the new Shangling SACD/CD transport.

Enjoy.

View: https://youtu.be/s4Vyxd9s1gA?si=OFlzhHMZUXlOFfkh

 

[ToppingSMSL]

On the hand, if you have good Cyrus CDi player or some older, they sound terrific for their size and price. For sure such player will sound better than SACD from Denon 1700 or similar Marantz. I will bet my trousers. But machine like Magnetar UDP 900 will sound better. It is based on Oppo harritage and is very universal for audio and video playback. It costs around 3000,- Eur. Has full stack of inputs amd outputs. BR.

They're going to sound the same.

 

[manicm]

On the hand, if you have good Cyrus CDi player or some older, they sound terrific for their size and price. For sure such player will sound better than SACD from Denon 1700 or similar Marantz. I will bet my trousers. But machine like Magnetar UDP 900 will sound better. It is based on Oppo harritage and is very universal for audio and video playback. It costs around 3000,- Eur. Has full stack of inputs amd outputs. BR.

NONE of those universal players preserve the DSD stream when playing SACDs - they all convert to PCM. The Denon DCD 1700ne and Marantz SACD players both preserve DSD without conversion, so for you to say they would sound inferior, with SACD discs at least, is completely unfounded and unsubstantiated.

Your Oppo universal players and Magnetar etc all convert DSD to PCM with SACDs.

 

[abacus]

NONE of those universal players preserve the DSD stream when playing SACDs - they all convert to PCM. The Denon DCD 1700ne and Marantz SACD players both preserve DSD without conversion, so for you to say they would sound inferior, with SACD discs at least, is completely unfounded and unsubstantiated.

Your Oppo universal players and Magnetar etc all convert DSD to PCM with SACDs.

I had a Pioneer 450 Universal Player and also have a Sony 800 Universal player, and they output DSD not PCM when playing SACD (You have to switch it on though, as by default it is set to PCM) , therefore I would be extremely surprised if the Oppo and Magnetar didn't also output DSD on SACD.

Bill

 

[Revolutions]

To all those considering SACD, ignore the clickbaitish title, this is an excellent video explaining SACD transport requirements in addition to a review of the new Shangling SACD/CD transport.

Enjoy.

View: https://youtu.be/s4Vyxd9s1gA?si=OFlzhHMZUXlOFfkh

I actually watched this video most of all the way through - the first time I’ve probably done that with a YouTube hifi review.

It basically left me sad that my pre doesn’t have I2S input. Which in turn is perfect as I no longer have an urge to spend £2k on a cd player 😥

 

[Al ears]

I had a Pioneer 450 Universal Player and also have a Sony 800 Universal player, and they output DSD not PCM when playing SACD (You have to switch it on though, as by default it is set to PCM) , therefore I would be extremely surprised if the Oppo and Magnetar didn't also output DSD on SACD.

Bill

Pretty sure my Oppo 105 has switchable output for DSD or PCM.
However a mute point as I doubt anyone would notice the difference.

 

[Jasonovich]

I actually watched this video most of all the way through - the first time I’ve probably done that with a YouTube hifi review.

It basically left me sad that my pre doesn’t have I2S input. Which in turn is perfect as I no longer have an urge to spend £2k on a cd player 😥

There are a few Youtubers who are honest brokers (yes, they all have sponsorships, always a small caveat). I like listening to Jay. He's analyst is always thorough.

Darko is good but too much of the Roon stuff. When I listen to Steve Huff, I get the impression he was smoking some exotic stuff before making the video!

I like Aussie Lachlan also, exchanged some text with him, gave me some tips on tube amps, good bloke. 🙂

 

[manicm]

I had a Pioneer 450 Universal Player and also have a Sony 800 Universal player, and they output DSD not PCM when playing SACD (You have to switch it on though, as by default it is set to PCM) , therefore I would be extremely surprised if the Oppo and Magnetar didn't also output DSD on SACD.

Bill

They would output on HDMI, but no internal decoding.

I had a Pioneer 450 Universal Player and also have a Sony 800 Universal player, and they output DSD not PCM when playing SACD (You have to switch it on though, as by default it is set to PCM) , therefore I would be extremely surprised if the Oppo and Magnetar didn't also output DSD on SACD.

Bill

That's true, but AVR receivers handling DSD have been like hen's teeth. The early SACD players all had internal decoding for stereo where the DSD stream was preserved, and had individual RCA or HDMI outputs for multichannel SACD if so equipped.

Today SACD players with internal DSD decoding are very expensive. The said Denon is one of the cheapest ones actually.

 

[Lash]

Pretty sure my Oppo 105 has switchable output for DSD or PCM.
However a mute point as I doubt anyone would notice the difference.

If it's a mute point, you probably WON'T hear the difference. 🙂

 

[Shaddowfax]

Hi, am considering picking up an SACD transport and would like recommendations please!
Here's my wishlist:
- don't want to pay for additional DAC or inbuilt amplification. Transport only
- USB output ideally, as the stream from the player would then be fed into USB-based gear which will reconstruct the stream before they then feed my DAC. I'm not interested in having loads of other connection options. This said I've read but not fully absorbed yet, some stuff about Sony encryption with SACD players in that if the player doesn't have appropriate certification(?), then the outputs from the player to a DAC outside of the player are downsampled and output as PCM. True/any more details? I read that PS Audio were able to workaround or reverse engineer the necessary, but their stuff costs a bomb.
- half-width casing ideally, to go with my Cyrus gear
Thanks so much!

I have just received the Shanling Onix Zenith XST20 SACD/CD transport. Only listened for abut 2 hours, however, just on that short listen I highly recommend it and it would fulfil your requirements, no problem.

 

[nopiano]

I have just received the Shanling Onix Zenith XST20 SACD/CD transport. Only listened for abut 2 hours, however, just on that short listen I highly recommend it and it would fulfil your requirements, no problem.

Welcome to the forum! Where did you buy your Shanling, and where was it delivered to?

I’m curious because I’m unclear how their international distribution is working.

 

[Jasonovich]

Welcome to the forum! Where did you buy your Shanling, and where was it delivered to?

I’m curious because I’m unclear how their international distribution is working.

I have seen them selling on AliExpress. A UK distributer, like they have with Eversolo now, would be preferable.

 

[James105]

I have seen them selling on AliExpress. A UK distributer, like they have with Eversolo now, would be preferable.

Peter Tyson also sell them.

 

[Jasonovich]

Peter Tyson also sell them.

Ah thanks 👍

 

[Shaddowfax]

Welcome to the forum! Where did you buy your Shanling, and where was it delivered to?

I’m curious because I’m unclear how their international distribution is working.

Hi, thanks for the welcome. I live in Australia and bought the player through AliExpress. It took five days to arrive and was well packed. I did look at the Shanling website, but AliExpress had a better price.
Hope that helps

 

[Shaddowfax]

NONE of those universal players preserve the DSD stream when playing SACDs - they all convert to PCM. The Denon DCD 1700ne and Marantz SACD players both preserve DSD without conversion, so for you to say they would sound inferior, with SACD discs at least, is completely unfounded and unsubstantiated.

Your Oppo universal players and Magnetar etc all convert DSD to PCM with SACDs.

If you use the audio only HDMI output of the universal player to the I2S input of an external DAC and ensure the audio output is DSD you can get raw DSD sent to the DAC. You have to use a converter box between the player and the DAC. I got mine through Amazon for a good price. It works really well.

 

[Al ears]

If you use the audio only HDMI output of the universal player to the I2S input of an external DAC and ensure the audio output is DSD you can get raw DSD sent to the DAC. You have to use a converter box between the player and the DAC. I got mine through Amazon for a good price. It works really well.

You could but not sure what difference it would make when you already have a decent Dac in the player itself .........
Why commit to more expense in an external dac and a converter and use the player as a transport only?

 

[manicm]

You could but not sure what difference it would make when you already have a decent Dac in the player itself .........
Why commit to more expense in an external dac and a converter and use the player as a transport only?

There are hardly any SACD players under 5k or more, and I mean if any, that do internal DSD decoding. You have your Marantz SACD 30n which is over 3k GBP. I can't think of a single one below this price.

So if you're getting a SACD transport you 100% want a I2S interface with a DAC to match, otherwise you're not going to get the pure DSD goodness out, or it will be converted to PCM which defeats the entire purpose.

 

[Al ears]

There are hardly any SACD players under 5k or more, and I mean if any, that do internal DSD decoding. You have your Marantz SACD 30n which is over 3k GBP. I can't think of a single one below this price.

So if you're getting a SACD transport you 100% want a I2S interface with a DAC to match, otherwise you're not going to get the pure DSD goodness out, or it will be converted to PCM which defeats the entire purpose.

Indeed, although I have an Oppo which is switchable but I would struggle to tell difference between PCM and DSD when listening and not knowing.
That aside the OPs question was about transports, in which case you would indeed need a suitably equipped DAC