Rothwell in-line attenuators

[bretty]

Hi everybody,

I'd been circling these for ages, as I knew I had too much gain in my system (I couldn't even get to 9 o'clock on the the volume dial before it was too loud). I took the plunge yesterday.

Firstly, the service at Rothwell is superb. I ordered them yesterday afternoon and they arrived today. Nice. Now I get the whole weekend to have a proper listen to them. I'll give you my first impressions, though.

Ok, they aren't cheap (£40), but they really look the part. They turn up in a cufflink-style box, with the attenuators set into foam recesses inside. The attenuators themselves are weighty and solid looking and are gold plated. Good start.

So, I plugged them into the inputs of the power amp and had a listen. With them in, I can get the volume to twelve o'clock, before it's too loud.

Sonically, the first thing I noticed was a HUGE jump in the realism of vocals. Kelly Clarkson (yeah, yeah, I know. Shut it.) on 'Sober' actually gave me goose bumps. That hasn't happened to me in ages.

I will say that I think that there may be a drop in dynamism, i'll see if this improves over the weekend.

I'll post again after a couple days listening.

 

[Anonymous]

Try them in various places, to find out the best sound they give. I had mine from the cd (amp end) I think, but can't remember if I did though.

They work alot better in some systems, as when got the one in my sig, didn't need them. Must admit, they do look very good though, even if it is just a resistor inside the shell of them.

Happy listeneing with them. Phil

 

[bretty]

potboyslim:
Try them in various places, to find out the best sound they give. I had mine from the cd (amp end) I think, but can't remember if I did though.

They work alot better in some systems, as when got the one in my sig, didn't need them. Must admit, they do look very good though, even if it is just a resistor inside the shell of them.

Happy listeneing with them. Phil

Thanks for your comments, Phil. I will take your advise on different placements, over this weekend. they're in the power amp now, i'll switch them to the pre, tomorrow.

I've been listening for a couple of hours, now. The changes to mid range and vocals has really got me smiling.

Damien Rice's 'O' is pretty much my reference disc, right now, as I know it in, out and backwards. The acoustic guitars notes start much more quickly and have a longer reverberation. Also, the violins have a more definite placement in the soundscape.

I'm also happy that my fears of a reduction is dynamism were unfounded. From the discs that i've played so far (Kelly Clarkson - 'My December', Opeth - 'Ghost Reveries' & 'Damnation', Damien Rice - 'O') i've found that the attenuators haven't taken anything away from the sound.

As Phil said in his post, these attenuators aren't needed by everyone. My last amp, a Cyrus 2, didn't need them. Also, they aren't magic, they aren't adding characteristics, sonically, that weren't already there. What they do, brilliantly, is allow systems such as mine, with far too much gain, to hit that magical 'sweet spot' on the volume dial, where everything opens up, separates and sounds natural.

I Recommend, whole-heartedly.

 

[matengawhat]

big fan of attenuators personally - never owned the roths but do have a pair of golden jacks that i used before replacing with a russ andrews attenuated interconnect which is between my dac and pre amp

i just wanted the extra travel on the volume control to make it easier to use and to make the amp work harder as like above by 9 o'clock was to loud now have to 12o'clock which is great as the remote control of the volume before was quiet to loud in an instant

 

[Sizzers]

Apologies for being thick!, but may I ask what they do?

 

[matengawhat]

they reduce the volume level of the line level input they are connected too

for example have you ever noticed that your cd player is far louder than say your tuner or record player whilst switching inputs - this is cause they each have a different volume level if you place in attenuators on the cdp out it will reduce the volume on that channel input

if you place between pre amp and power amp reduces level on all inputs

 

[Sizzers]

matengawhat:they reduce the volume level of the line level input they are connected too

 

[Sizzers]

matengawhat:
they reduce the volume level of the line level input they are connected too

for example have you ever noticed that your cd player is far louder than say your tuner or record player whilst switching inputs - this is cause they each have a different volume level if you place in attenuators on the cdp out it will reduce the volume on that channel input

if you place between pre amp and power amp reduces level on all inputs

Thanks. So do they generally improve sound quality or is that dependent on the kit?

 

[bretty]

Sizzers:matengawhat:
they reduce the volume level of the line level input they are connected too

for example have you ever noticed that your cd player is far louder than say your tuner or record player whilst switching inputs - this is cause they each have a different volume level if you place in attenuators on the cdp out it will reduce the volume on that channel input

if you place between pre amp and power amp reduces level on all inputs

Thanks. So do they generally improve sound quality or is that dependent on the kit?

It depends. If you can already hit that 'sweet spot' on the volume control, without it being too loud, then the attenuators won't actually do anything, apart from make the system 10 decibels quieter (although Rothwell do claim that using them reduces the signal to noise ratio). However, if your system is like mine, the excess gain coming from the CDP means that the amps volume is so low that it's not running to it's full potential. In this case, the attenuators 'lift the veil' from the music, to use the cliche, by letting you turn the volume up til it hits it's optimum level, without being too loud.

 

[Sizzers]

Thanks for the explanation. Will bear that in mind when I get other bits and bobs added on.

 

[Anonymous]

Let me see. You buy a Lamborghini (sp), then fit a landing parachute off the space shuttle just so you can push the throttle to the floor around the M25.

Date checked.

Didn't fall for it, though some will......

 

[matengawhat]

think of it more as putting a ferrari engine in a mini and then having to fit bigger brakes to slow it down!!!!

when you mix and match hi fi they have different outputs and inputs so your cdp and amp could be mismatched screwing all the dynamics

 

[Anonymous]

if they are so good, why dont the very expensive audiophile equipment have them fitted as standard? ... or are they already fitted? ....

I am just curious

 

[Anonymous]

They have... They call it volume control...

 

[Anonymous]

ediots:They have... They call it volume control...

Ooh ... then they must be good, as my amp have several controls for all sorts of things

 

[matengawhat]

think you're missing the point - if you don't need them don't buy them - to some of us they are invaluable

this is nearly beginning to read like a cable thread

 

[Anonymous]

matengawhat:

think you're missing the point - if you don't need them don't buy them - to some of us they are invaluable

I know ... just winding ... have read lots of good reviews from owners

 

[Anonymous]

dim_span:

ediots:They have... They call it volume control...

Ooh ... then they must be good, as my amp have several controls for all sorts of things

you know how they can be more sophisticated and expensive then whole average amplifier

 

[Sizzers]

Picked mine up yesterday and obviously been having a bit of a play!

Bit too early to give a definitive opinion on how much of a total improvement they're making, but I can now move the volume up to 12-13 instead of 9-10 (I have a digitised volume control). Vocals are definitely opening up, though ,so things are looking good!

My Denon has a digitised volume control so will have to change that before the speakers. Was going to do it the other way round, but now I can see the potential in the Rothwells I will have to change the amp first (I have anti-social neighbours who don't like music, hence my delve in to attenuators).

Would also just like to say thanks for introducing me to them; did my research, bought them, and think they will really do the job with an amp with a "normal" volume control. Slight aside, but moved my kit around this morning and dropped the Denon on my CDP. Managed to catch it before it did any serious damage, but got a dent in the top of it now! *crying*

 

[Anonymous]

Attenuators work well when the voltage from your CD player, for example, is too high for your amp and produces distortion. If you have no distortion (and that's the norm by a country mile) you don't need an attenuator. They also should be strictly neutral.

Adding an attenuator to an amp that doesn't need one just means you'll be using more electricity.

 

[drummerman]

There's the added complication that an amplifier freqency response can vary with volume control settings. So whilst an attenuator may not solve that problem it could, in theory shift it to somewhere where it does'nt impact so much or, vice versa, create one where there wasn't one in the first place. To much fiddling around for me but I can see the point to an extend even though I think even an interconnect is one variable to much in the signal path ...

 

[Sizzers]

Tarquinh:
Attenuators work well when the voltage from your CD player, for example, is too high for your amp and produces distortion. If you have no distortion (and that's the norm by a country mile) you don't need an attenuator. They also should be strictly neutral.

Adding an attenuator to an amp that doesn't need one just means you'll be using more electricity.

 

[Sizzers]

Tarquinh:
Attenuators work well when the voltage from your CD player, for example, is too high for your amp and produces distortion. If you have no distortion (and that's the norm by a country mile) you don't need an attenuator. They also should be strictly neutral.

Adding an attenuator to an amp that doesn't need one just means you'll be using more electricity.

The problem is having to listen at relatively low volumes, and then having very limited volume control at those volumes. Okay, having a digitised volume control on the Denon is not ideal, but right now I can turn the amp up and get more out of the music. May not be be the same when I replace the amp, but more than happy with how it's sounding right now.

 

[idc]

I had attenuated interconnects from Russ Andrews and the sweet spot for low volume listening was the biggest beneficiary. As Tarquinh said, the voltage output on many CDPs is more than enough for the amp, so attenuation means more volume control and more volume control means a larger sweet spot.

Cables can also affect the amount of volume control you have as their resistance varies.

 

[Anonymous]

Er - no, that's not what I said, mon ami! Basically if you hear distortion, that's when you need an attenuator. I agree that volume increments at low levels in budget amps can be problematical, and that an attenuator is going to help - in fact my amp has that problem - but an attenuator isn't going to improve the sound of any amp except where there is distortion caused by too high an input voltage.

The whole attenuator/sweet-spot thing is yet another myth I'm afraid.