Ok it isn't the be all and end that the wave form is thinker with the Chord cables on the system. I didn't necessarily hear a difference in volume as I did the test. Of course from a picture you can't tell if it sounds different.
I can tell youo though and I will try to get a screen shot instead of a photo from my phone to show you that the structure of the wave is different on each pass. You can tell the peaks are in the same place as the notes in the songs don't change no matter how many times I play them. When I add the DAC the spikes are more bulbous than tight cones. When I add the Chord Cables they they are less bulbous but more refined as the lower frequencies sound tighter.
What I hear with these cables on, as apposed to the stock cables is things like backing vocals that are usually non coherant, the rythem the bass player is actually playing that usually sound like a pitch shifting rumble under the guitars, I also hear how often the guiarist changes guitar sound/tone during a song and the resonent head of the bass drum after the initial attack of the beater. where as before it would sound like the beater was hitting a big pillow. I can also hear little intricasies the guitarist sometimes play outside of the main rythem riff, along with other procussive things like tambourines, cow bells and chimes. Guitar solos sing free of the rest of the music instead of trying to fight there way out.
I'm not for one minute saying that the stock cables hid these sounds, just that they didn't let them out as easily so they wouldn't reach my ears in time before another stronger sound in the mix got to me first. Thus my brain wouldn't register them. As you know this is the "Timing" the manufacturers talk about.
There were nothing wrong with the stock cables I used. I take very good care of any cable I own not matter what I think of it.
I won't sit here and say my test is difinitive by any means. My opinion is some people prefer to rely souly on technical assistance and scientific proof to believe something. I don't dissagree with that notion. I'm all for definitive proof. I do how ever believe my ears. As you can see that Hi-Fi is in my bedroom, I live in a flat. The picture of the ZOOM H4 was taken from the doorway to the bedroom. My listening position for that Hi-Fi is mostly on my couch in the lounge. This is behind and to the left of that doorway if you are looking into the room. (if you go to the "youor System" thread called My Home Cinema & Hi-Fi pride and joy, my HT is in my lounge.
Before putting on the current Chord Anthem that has made the most difference I had listened to many of my CDs in that disjointed position. I don't sit and listen directly at the music trying to hear everything that is coming out the speakers. I have to be doing something else. So when I put the Chord Anthem cable on and listen in the same manner to those same CDs, suddenly new things are jumping out at me in the first listen with the new cable that didn't do in the previouse 10 listens.
I can tell youo though and I will try to get a screen shot instead of a photo from my phone to show you that the structure of the wave is different on each pass. You can tell the peaks are in the same place as the notes in the songs don't change no matter how many times I play them. When I add the DAC the spikes are more bulbous than tight cones. When I add the Chord Cables they they are less bulbous but more refined as the lower frequencies sound tighter.
What I hear with these cables on, as apposed to the stock cables is things like backing vocals that are usually non coherant, the rythem the bass player is actually playing that usually sound like a pitch shifting rumble under the guitars, I also hear how often the guiarist changes guitar sound/tone during a song and the resonent head of the bass drum after the initial attack of the beater. where as before it would sound like the beater was hitting a big pillow. I can also hear little intricasies the guitarist sometimes play outside of the main rythem riff, along with other procussive things like tambourines, cow bells and chimes. Guitar solos sing free of the rest of the music instead of trying to fight there way out.
I'm not for one minute saying that the stock cables hid these sounds, just that they didn't let them out as easily so they wouldn't reach my ears in time before another stronger sound in the mix got to me first. Thus my brain wouldn't register them. As you know this is the "Timing" the manufacturers talk about.
There were nothing wrong with the stock cables I used. I take very good care of any cable I own not matter what I think of it.
I won't sit here and say my test is difinitive by any means. My opinion is some people prefer to rely souly on technical assistance and scientific proof to believe something. I don't dissagree with that notion. I'm all for definitive proof. I do how ever believe my ears. As you can see that Hi-Fi is in my bedroom, I live in a flat. The picture of the ZOOM H4 was taken from the doorway to the bedroom. My listening position for that Hi-Fi is mostly on my couch in the lounge. This is behind and to the left of that doorway if you are looking into the room. (if you go to the "youor System" thread called My Home Cinema & Hi-Fi pride and joy, my HT is in my lounge.
Before putting on the current Chord Anthem that has made the most difference I had listened to many of my CDs in that disjointed position. I don't sit and listen directly at the music trying to hear everything that is coming out the speakers. I have to be doing something else. So when I put the Chord Anthem cable on and listen in the same manner to those same CDs, suddenly new things are jumping out at me in the first listen with the new cable that didn't do in the previouse 10 listens.
That' s excatly what happened to my system once I put the Tellurium Q Ultra Black RCA interconnect the soundstage became huge no matter
the position I was sitting it sounded huge , bunch of details and stroner and richer bass .
I was totaly amazed I didn't know that a cable can make such a big impact on a system ...
the position I was sitting it sounded huge , bunch of details and stroner and richer bass .
I was totaly amazed I didn't know that a cable can make such a big impact on a system ...
@ Glacialpath
You could try taking the comparative measurements, but with the volume on the more expensive cable, audibly a little less, and see how that looks....this should, at least, give a guide as to what you are measuring.
...Or get a sound meter to match the volume.
You could try taking the comparative measurements, but with the volume on the more expensive cable, audibly a little less, and see how that looks....this should, at least, give a guide as to what you are measuring.
...Or get a sound meter to match the volume.
abacus
Well-known member
- Sep 24, 2008
- 1,323
- 1,136
- 21,070
Even a slight increase in overall volume can give a much larger sound experience; (Everything seems clearer with more detail) this is why it is paramount that levels are matched. Also don’t forget that one person’s large improvement in sound can be minute to another, hence you need a fixed frame of reference.
Testing has to be methodical & repeatable to provide proof, otherwise no music professional will take it seriously. (Also music professionals usually have far better trained ears than Hi Fi Nuts, and are the reasons they roll over on the floor laughing at Hi Fi Nuts when they say they can hear a difference but provide no proof)
Bill
Testing has to be methodical & repeatable to provide proof, otherwise no music professional will take it seriously. (Also music professionals usually have far better trained ears than Hi Fi Nuts, and are the reasons they roll over on the floor laughing at Hi Fi Nuts when they say they can hear a difference but provide no proof)
Bill
abacus said:
Fair point Bill.
I will expand on my previous post. Even at lower volumes these differences are still audible. Just turning up the volume on the stock cables makes the sound louder and maybe slightly clearer but also hard to listen to as it sounds harsh. All I want to do then is turn it down a preserve my hearing.
Not only do the Chord cables improve the sound stage but the take most of that harshness away and suddenly I can cope with the music at a louder volume and not feel ear fatigue. I'm sorry but that constitutes a physical difference in what I'm hearing.
None of what I write about has come form 1 volume setting, one listening pass of the CD apart from maybe we have only listened to each CD once since adding in the cable. The fact new sounds have jumped out from this one listen as apposed to the multiple listens before the cables were added tells me I am hearing more than before and I'm 100% confident I will hear them every other time I listen with the new cables.
I understande the notion of Hi-Fi nuts as youo put it telling the guys in the shop that they can hear a differecne. First off if a Hi-Fi speciallist fell on the floor laughing if I said that I would leave the store imediately i disggust with how rude and un professional they were (yes I'm sure they would wait till I'd left befre laughing) secondly I'm not just a Hi-Fi nute. As I've mentioned in the thread regarding the Double Blind test in London I have been using my ears for the past 10 years for my job and know for a fact my ears are better than most of the people I have worked with. I'm a musician, producer and a Home Theater/Hi_fi enthusiast.
I'm going along with the different views on these forums because I believe in everyone having their say. I have learnt some things along the way and still am. Even with this experiment I posted here people have pointed out areas that proveit inconclusive and I agree. I didn't fully think it through and now know I can do much more to make it a more conclusive test.
I'm 98% sure even if it is proven that cables make a difference that the people who want out and out scientific proof won't want to believe it because they have in their minds it can't be. You can say the same for us guys who do believe. If it's scientifically proven they don't alter the signal in any way then we will just go on believeing we can hear a difference. It is our human nature.
To be honest. If I feel I enjoy my music more with the cables on and it does turn out to be a placebo effect I will go on listening with the cables on as I'm happier that way. I'm sure it's the same for youo guys.
I'm going to try my eperiment again adding in the things people have had reservations about. I'm hoping to post audio as well as the picture this time.
Remember the placement of the Mic was in the optimum listening position. at roughly speaker level and 4-5 feet away from the speakers. I can hear a difference on the recordings so when I comment abouot what Ii hear from my lounge or even my kitchen that is a 2nd and 3rd place as difference can be heard.
Covenanter
Well-known member
- Jul 20, 2012
- 96
- 50
- 18,620
Glacialpath said:
I don't think that's neccesarily true. I would come to such an experiment with an expectation bias that they wouldn't make a difference but if I heard one, or even better saw some measurements showing one, I would accept it and then try to find out what was causing it. I've never heard a difference or seen any such measurements to date.
The expectation bias is a problem! Am I subconsiously going to deny hearing any differences? The trouble is you can't know. It's very easy to say you can't hear a difference. It's much harder to say that you can hear a difference and then back that up with repeatable results from a double blind test.
Chris
Covenanter said:
Granted I can't ingnor the people who are willing to attend such a test with a purly open mind no matter which camp they currently reside. That's a mistake on my part. I can see people such as youorself then wanting to find out why there is a difference if the results clearly read there is.
I myself have tried to get explinations as to why something has gone wrong say in the process of converting a source audio stream to a DTS encode and some how ends up with a strange distortion on the dialogue. But I've then been told they don't know and to get on with my work. So appologies for not thinking of like minded people. It's kind of why I put 98% though lol.
TrevC said:
I'm guessing TrevC that you are an sparky or and electrical engineer? so can see where you are coming from.
In my view most of this cable issue is down to shielding. Outside interference may not alter the current passing through the cable in any way but to me alters the signal coming out the speaker at the other end as it passes through the system. So it's the shielding not the core cable.
That's just my view. Isotek had a meter of some sorts at this years sound and vision show. I believe it read RFI and EMI. I might be wrong. With stock cables on a stock mains block it read something like 63. With the it on their premium mains cables and one of their mains conditioners it read 00. I watched them disconnect and connect all the verious cables. I can't say that conclusive but they were willing to put there product on the line. I think one of the show goers like me was an electrical engineer or something and he was convinced.
Just saying. I'm not trying to say you are wrong.
is this a good time to post the thing about when the guy chewed up his 300 dollar power cable and found about 15 dollars worth of materials inside...
http://gizmodo.com/371536/300-audiophile-grade-power-cable-is-really-worth-15
the original thread doesn't have pictures anymore...
/runs for cover/
http://gizmodo.com/371536/300-audiophile-grade-power-cable-is-really-worth-15
the original thread doesn't have pictures anymore...
/runs for cover/
The founder of the bancrupted Virtual Dynamics company shows you some helpful tweaks here. He mentions the word science in there. Science good. :bounce:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bodniyBVABQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bodniyBVABQ
cheeseboy said:is this a good time to post the thing about when the guy chewed up his 300 dollar power cable and found about 15 dollars worth of materials inside...
http://gizmodo.com/371536/300-audiophile-grade-power-cable-is-really-worth-15
the original thread doesn't have pictures anymore...
/runs for cover/
They are all the same, manufactured for a few quid, sold for stupid money.
TrevC said:
Any idea then what the meter was reading then any why the stock cables showed a reading and the Isotek ones didn't?
FYI the mains supply was that of the hotel room at the Marriot in Bristol where the sow is held.
Covenanter
Well-known member
- Jul 20, 2012
- 96
- 50
- 18,620
Covenanter said:Vladimir said:
I won't be posting for a while, I have a few hundred CDs to sand down.
Chris
The vapor from so many alcohol felt tip markers is bound to make every CD sound better.
If you start singing "tadadaaadaaaaaaaam" alongside Beethoven's 9th, you know it's working.
TrevC said:cheeseboy said:is this a good time to post the thing about when the guy chewed up his 300 dollar power cable and found about 15 dollars worth of materials inside...
http://gizmodo.com/371536/300-audiophile-grade-power-cable-is-really-worth-15
the original thread doesn't have pictures anymore...
/runs for cover/
They are all the same, manufactured for a few quid, sold for stupid money.
Like a lot of thing including your house, car, etc - just saying.
Glacialpath said:TrevC said:
I asked you a genuine question. What sort of answer is that?????????
You said
"the hotel room at the Marriot in Bristol where the sow is held"
hence the tied up pig.
No idea what they did to make a meter read something.
Sorry.
sublime said:TrevC said:cheeseboy said:is this a good time to post the thing about when the guy chewed up his 300 dollar power cable and found about 15 dollars worth of materials inside...
http://gizmodo.com/371536/300-audiophile-grade-power-cable-is-really-worth-15
the original thread doesn't have pictures anymore...
/runs for cover/
They are all the same, manufactured for a few quid, sold for stupid money.
Like a lot of thing including your house, car, etc - just saying.
Are there Fiestas on sale for a million quid?
TrevC said:Glacialpath said:TrevC said:
I asked you a genuine question. What sort of answer is that?????????
You said
"the hotel room at the Marriot in Bristol where the sow is held"
hence the tied up pig.
No idea what they did to make a meter read something.
Sorry.
HAHAHAHAHAHA so i did. Ok opps. My proof reading sucks lol.
Similar threads
TRENDING THREADS
-
-
-
-
Question How do I get my sound working through my DAC? Need some advice!- Started by Yoran
- Replies: 34
-
-
-
Facebook
Twitter
Instagram