Question for Rega.

[chebby]

Hello Paul.

If you see this could you do me a favour and ask Terry Bateman which old Kefs he used in the development and ‘voicing’ of the Brio (2017) amplifier?

I have read it but forgotten where. I remember he used a P5 turntable with Ortofon 2M Red (amongst other carts) and a selection of 1970s recordings and some equally vintage Kefs but I cannot recall which ones (nor the reasons why).

I am fascinated by the development of the Brio (partly due to owning one of the early ‘clamshell’ versions for 11 years from 1996 - 2007 with matching Rega Radio tuner).

 

[chebby]

It’s ok I found the answer after going through my recent browsing history.

 

[nopiano]

Interesting link, chebby. But KEF Concertos were fairly hefty three way, iirc, not mini monitors as Stereophile says. Codas were smaller, but each name was reused, so maybe there was a smaller Concerto that passed me by?

 

[chebby]

I think by the standards of 1970s studios (and enthusiasts) the Concertos were probably considered ‘mini’!

You wouldn’t believe the size of some of the old loudspeakers i’ve seen described as ‘bookshelf’

 

[plastic penguin]

Mate, you are suffering. *sorry2*

FWIW I heard one of the Codas years ago, and they failed to impress. It was at Richer Sounds I think, so the chances are the amplification was the best (probably).

 

[drummerman]

I assume you're looking to replace your current amp going by your recent interest in things small ... Naim, Rega?

 

[chebby]

I assume you're looking to replace your current amp going by your recent interest in things small ... Naim, Rega?

Far from it.

I actually have a surfeit of ‘amps’ and need to sell one. (Probably the Vena.)

This Brio related question is motivated by historical/academic interest and the UnitiQute temptation lasted about 30 minutes the other day

 

[CnoEvil]

I assume you're looking to replace your current amp going by your recent interest in things small ... Naim, Rega?

Far from it.

This Brio related question is motivated by historical/academic interest...

You're bored - just admit it. *biggrin*

 

[Vladimir]

There's nothing mini about those, but they are indeed classified as 'bookshelf', popular name being 'monkeycoffins'.

 

[chebby]

Rega’s book “A Vibration Measuring Machine” now on my Christmas list.

 

[jimmy1]

you would need a sturdy bookshelf

 

[chebby]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

The Brio is supposed to be inspired by a Linsley Hood amplifier design from a 1970 issue of Wireless World, so maybe that’s it. Perhaps they should make Kef Concerto inspired speakers to go with it.

 

[nopiano]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

The Brio is supposed to be inspired by a Linsley Hood amplifier design from a 1970 issue of Wireless World, so maybe that’s it. Perhaps they should make Kef Concerto inspired speakers to go with it.

I share your puzzlement. My recollection is that Concerto was pretty muddy, and I was intrigued to see the power handling stated as thirty watts. Things have moved on further than I realised! Still, any amp that can make them sound good must be superb!!

 

[Vladimir]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

Rega knows, appreciates and is happy to emulate HiFi history. Ironically its customers don't and put their noses up if you recommend TOTL vintage kit.

 

[davedotco]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

Rega knows, appreciates and is happy to emulate HiFi history. Ironically its customers don't and put their noses up if you recommend TOTL vintage kit.

Back in the day, (early 80s) I used to demonstate equipment, in booked appointments, for as much as 10 hours a day. Pivotal to these demonstrations were Linn and Rega turntables, A&R, Naim, Nytech and Creek amplifiers and speakers like Mordaunt Short, Linn (Kans) and others I can barely remember.

We used to encourage customers to bring in there own gear, most of it mainstream japanese brands, to compare to the product we were selling. It was easy, top of the line direct drive record players being blown away by even the humble planar 3, expensive high powered amplifiers being outperformed by the Nytech or A&R60, everytime.

I was still learning the trade as this point, I just did the dems, I knew what worked and demonstrated it time after time after time. It left me with a fairly dismissive attitude to most mainstream gear, including some pretty highly rated product.

 

[drummerman]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

Rega knows, appreciates and is happy to emulate HiFi history. Ironically its customers don't and put their noses up if you recommend TOTL vintage kit.

I don't think there is anything uniquely old fashioned or historic about the Brio's (or other Rega amps) design. No more than most other amplifiers of similar topology. - Some may put unique small twists on decade old circuits others subtly refine or invent fancy acronyms but they all go back to roughly the same time.

The only things that makes Rega totally vintage is that they don't yet offer a streamer, powered life style speakers or all-in-one unless I've missed something.

Btw, the brio seems good value nowadaisies.

 

[Vladimir]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

Rega knows, appreciates and is happy to emulate HiFi history. Ironically its customers don't and put their noses up if you recommend TOTL vintage kit.

Back in the day, (early 80s) I used to demonstate equipment, in booked appointments, for as much as 10 hours a day. Pivotal to these demonstrations were Linn and Rega turntables, A&R, Naim, Nytech and Creek amplifiers and speakers like Mordaunt Short, Linn (Kans) and others I can barely remember.

We used to encourage customers to bring in there own gear, most of it mainstream japanese brands, to compare to the product we were selling. It was easy, top of the line direct drive record players being blown away by even the humble planar 3, expensive high powered amplifiers being outperformed by the Nytech or A&R60, everytime.

I was still learning the trade as this point, I just did the dems, I knew what worked and demonstrated it time after time after time. It left me with a fairly dismissive attitude to most mainstream gear, including some pretty highly rated product.

I seriously doubt real japanese high-end entered yours or any UK shop for a shootout. We've had this conversation before, UK only got budget cheapies from the Orient. Very few of their best went to Germany, some to the US and most simply remained in Japan.

 

[chebby]

Does this mean that the old (1970s) Kef Concertos are the best loudspeakers with which to partner a Rega Brio (2017) given that’s what it was developed and voiced with?

If Paul does see this maybe he can expand on the linked Stereophile article (or correct it if necessary) and say what other loudspeakers were used.

 

[Vladimir]

If you're taste and room matches exactly like the designer's, then probably yes.

 

[drummerman]

Does this mean that the old (1970s) Kef Concertos are the best loudspeakers with which to partner a Rega Brio (2017) given that’s what it was developed and voiced with?

If Paul does see this maybe he can expand on the linked Stereophile article (or correct it if necessary) and say what other loudspeakers were used.

Still in the interest of science?

No Brio on the shopping list at all ... ?

 

[chebby]

Does this mean that the old (1970s) Kef Concertos are the best loudspeakers with which to partner a Rega Brio (2017) given that’s what it was developed and voiced with?

If Paul does see this maybe he can expand on the linked Stereophile article (or correct it if necessary) and say what other loudspeakers were used.

Still in the interest of science?

No Brio on the shopping list at all ... ?

Not unless they put a DAC in it and they never will. They have a pretty purist approach that wouldn’t allow such ‘horrors’ (not whilst Roy Gandy still draws breath) and I respect that. It would be an engineering compromise too far. (And reduce demand for their separate DAC*.)

* Which urgently needs a new case to match the Brio 2017 and new Apollo.

 

[Al ears]

Does this mean that the old (1970s) Kef Concertos are the best loudspeakers with which to partner a Rega Brio (2017) given that’s what it was developed and voiced with?

If Paul does see this maybe he can expand on the linked Stereophile article (or correct it if necessary) and say what other loudspeakers were used.

Still in the interest of science?

No Brio on the shopping list at all ... ?

Not unless they put a DAC in it and they never will. They have a pretty purist approach that wouldn’t allow such ‘horrors’ (not whilst Roy Gandy still draws breath) and I respect that. It would be an engineering compromise too far. (And reduce demand for their separate DAC*.)

* Which urgently needs a new case to match the Brio 2017 and new Apollo.

I would agree that DACs have never been Regas forte, these being turntable firstly and amps second, they need to continue developing their amps and inbuilt phono stages to stay in the game.

DACs continue to improve rapidly and they shouldn't attempt to build one into their amps as this adds instant depreciation. Stick with what they do best, and yes I have ignored their speakers for a reason, and leave 'all in ones' alone.

 

[davedotco]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

Rega knows, appreciates and is happy to emulate HiFi history. Ironically its customers don't and put their noses up if you recommend TOTL vintage kit.

Back in the day, (early 80s) I used to demonstate equipment, in booked appointments, for as much as 10 hours a day. Pivotal to these demonstrations were Linn and Rega turntables, A&R, Naim, Nytech and Creek amplifiers and speakers like Mordaunt Short, Linn (Kans) and others I can barely remember.

We used to encourage customers to bring in there own gear, most of it mainstream japanese brands, to compare to the product we were selling. It was easy, top of the line direct drive record players being blown away by even the humble planar 3, expensive high powered amplifiers being outperformed by the Nytech or A&R60, everytime.

I was still learning the trade as this point, I just did the dems, I knew what worked and demonstrated it time after time after time. It left me with a fairly dismissive attitude to most mainstream gear, including some pretty highly rated product.

I seriously doubt real japanese high-end entered yours or any UK shop for a shootout. We've had this conversation before, UK only got budget cheapies from the Orient. Very few of their best went to Germany, some to the US and most simply remained in Japan.

No arguments there Vlad, real japanese hi-end has always been extremely rare in the uk, then as now.

No I was thinking of the TOTL regular models like the Pioneer 9100/9900 models, Technics 9600 pre-power and the rest, all outclassed by even the more modest models mentioned in my post.

I guess the point I was making was that these dems were not even close, the mainstream items were blown away every time and continued to be so right up until I sold up in 2000.

 

[Vladimir]

It still intrigues me why an electronics designer is using almost 50 year old speakers to ‘voice’ a new product. (Especially when they make their own range of loudspeakers.)

Rega knows, appreciates and is happy to emulate HiFi history. Ironically its customers don't and put their noses up if you recommend TOTL vintage kit.

Back in the day, (early 80s) I used to demonstate equipment, in booked appointments, for as much as 10 hours a day. Pivotal to these demonstrations were Linn and Rega turntables, A&R, Naim, Nytech and Creek amplifiers and speakers like Mordaunt Short, Linn (Kans) and others I can barely remember.

We used to encourage customers to bring in there own gear, most of it mainstream japanese brands, to compare to the product we were selling. It was easy, top of the line direct drive record players being blown away by even the humble planar 3, expensive high powered amplifiers being outperformed by the Nytech or A&R60, everytime.

I was still learning the trade as this point, I just did the dems, I knew what worked and demonstrated it time after time after time. It left me with a fairly dismissive attitude to most mainstream gear, including some pretty highly rated product.

I seriously doubt real japanese high-end entered yours or any UK shop for a shootout. We've had this conversation before, UK only got budget cheapies from the Orient. Very few of their best went to Germany, some to the US and most simply remained in Japan.

No arguments there Vlad, real japanese hi-end has always been extremely rare in the uk, then as now.

No I was thinking of the TOTL regular models like the Pioneer 9100/9900 models, Technics 9600 pre-power and the rest, all outclassed by even the more modest models mentioned in my post.

I guess the point I was making was that these dems were not even close, the mainstream items were blown away every time and continued to be so right up until I sold up in 2000.

Granted on those. They were chasing brochure numbers instead of sound on most of them.