Oppo 103 Blu-ray Player Gets 3 Stars!

[strapped for cash]

Well, of course there's calibration and calibration.

Perhaps it would be useful if WHF could clarify specifically what calibration procedures they use.

As I understand it, based on reviews and prior forum discussion, WHF reviewers calibrate televisions using the THX Optimiser (in other words by eye). The quantity of products reviewed by the magazine far exceeds review sites frequently discussed on here. Full ISF calibration of every TV WHF reviews would prove highly impractical, and probably impossible.

If the above is true (and I'm not stating anything as fact), that would indeed represent the experiences of most consumers (only a small minority of enthusiasts will actually pay for professional calibration, or purchase a colorimeter and go the DIY route).

However, if there is no reference display against which to evaluate other products, that does potentially create difficulties reviewing other links in the video chain.

For the record, I'm not suggesting WHF's review process is wrong. One could justifiably argue that advanced technical reviews have little bearing on the great majority of consumers' real world experiences.

 

[Ian986]

Wow this thread Is gathering a lot of posts now ! There is no chance that the oppo unit supplied was faulty ?

 

[strapped for cash]

I can no longer trust the content of the magazine and bid yo al kind farwell.

With the greatest of respect, looking at your post count, you hadn't even said hello...

 

[Frank Harvey]

Wow this thread Is gathering a lot of posts now ! There is no chance that the oppo unit supplied was faulty ?

Possible, but I'm sure if WHF thought there was anything wrong with the unit, they'd have contacted Oppo and questioned it before printing the review.

I forget which magazine does it now, but I always enjoyed reading the manufacturer's feedback which would appear in the following issue to a product's review. If it was a good review the reply was always good, but when it was a bad review, or highlighted some negative points, it was interesting to read what the manufacturer came back with. There have been many reviews that I would have liked to have replied to (not any one specific publication). I've seen some unfair reviews in the past where a product has been reviewed with another product that just doesn't work together, so its blatantly obvious what the conclusion of the review is going to be before you even read it.

How about that WHF? A Manufacturer's Feedback page?

 

[daveh75]

Well that's nearly four years old now! Plus as I understand it there are different levels of isf training.

I seem to recall one of the staff blogged on the ISF training they attended (Simon Lucas possibly) some time back, can't remember when exactly but certainly post dates that AVF thread...

 

[bigboss]

I can no longer trust the content of the magazine and bid yo al kind farwell.

With the greatest of respect, looking at your post count, you hadn't even said hello...

 

[Anonymous]

For once, I am an expert on this thread, as it seems to have turned into an attack on the integrity of the Publisher founded on advertising. I work in advertising at a media agency, and we buy advertising with Haymarket, and in fact almost any publisher you can think of on behalf of many clients and have done so a long time. Most hifi brands spend so little though they do their own advertising work, just in case you think there is mega bucks in it.

i can say that sales teams will say its good to advertise next to a five star review, and they will also say its good against a three star review to put across some other communication to help counter. in fact the sales team know loads of reasons why advertising is good and they are all true because advertising works, so reviews don't influence advertising. It's also great to advertise around the awards because readership / circulation increases, so you reach more people, in case someone asks why there is more advertising in these editions.

Editors are essentially journalists too, so they work with all brands, and they try to uncover the truth whilst the brands try and influence it. These brands wouldn't trust WHFSV if they were for sale, so if the conspiracy is true, it would be backed up with a really EDITED magazine, and there would be no circulation and then the brands wouldn't have an audience to reach. So it is in the interest of the brands for the publisher to be independent and beyond reproach. The conspiracy would need to be true for all the publishers to be effective also, and these hifi brands like KEF have such small advertising investment it would be cheaper to make a 5 star product

they do get random punters to review stuff too ,but this should really make the point to demo for yourself. And if you think they like bright, you also mean you like warm - see how subjective it is?

On the flip side, editors do sometimes reject advertising because it affects the aesthetics of the magazine and ultimately the publishers brand. You would be shocked how many times our budget is turned down because the ad is ugly, or the ad has a price promotion in it that may reflect on the aesthetics or image of the magazine. Obviously it is magazine dependant, but the sales team usually know what will upset the editors through experience.

And for what it's worth, the most I ever got from haymarket is the odd free magazine if our client was in it. And the most the brands that advertise ever want is the best position in the magazine (for example in the first half) and the best price. Nothing to do with the editors I'm afraid. I'm pretty sure they hate advertising folk like me, so last thing I want to do is go near any of them.

The comment from Duncan between editor and sales team made me laugh because its true, although I think it's a tech thing, because I'm sure some of the sales team at Conde Nast/ vogue magazine could be models, or probably are! Which reminds me, I need to get my beauty sleep.

 

[pioneer7]

Just out of interest, :shifty: :shifty: and this has been done in the past in the mag, if Oppo issued a press release stating a price drop of say 150-quid to 350 would WHSAV then award the player a 4 or a 5star, what do we think the 2 star drop means is one a combination of picture and sound, and the other value for money, if so this would then be a 4-star player and would probably be more excepted, me personally you do get what you pay for, I have seen how these oppos come well packaged case/bag it exudes quality, you only have to read how many threads there are with people asking does anyones player sound noisy when playing, but they have only paid 60-150 pounds so qaulity is going to be shaved a bit, either way you will never get anyone to say that advertising is an issue, If I made qaulity equipment that was well regarded through out the world lets say, and I asked a mag would you like to review this product, but had never advertised with themag would that mag give a 5star glowing review, knowing it has not cost the manufactuer any money to get the review, then thinking if we give a glowing review 5-star bla bla would they advertise, really who cares.

I liked pioneer products for years, but not any more, especailly blu-ray players,but I do know qaulity when I see it and the oppo has it in spades, but I would not buy one, why?? because I dont need all the facilitys it offers because i would not use them, so a cheaper player would do me.

I think the mag genuinly got this wrong and i suspect deep down, this review has done them no favours. :clap: :clap:

 

[pioneer7]

Just out of interest, :shifty: :shifty: and this has been done in the past in the mag, if Oppo issued a press release stating a price drop of say 150-quid to 350 would WHSAV then award the player a 4 or a 5star, what do we think the 2 star drop means is one a combination of picture and sound, and the other value for money, if so this would then be a 4-star player and would probably be more excepted, me personally you do get what you pay for, I have seen how these oppos come well packaged case/bag it exudes quality, you only have to read how many threads there are with people asking does anyones player sound noisy when playing, but they have only paid 60-150 pounds so qaulity is going to be shaved a bit, either way you will never get anyone to say that advertising is an issue, If I made qaulity equipment that was well regarded through out the world lets say, and I asked a mag would you like to review this product, but had never advertised with themag would that mag give a 5star glowing review, knowing it has not cost the manufactuer any money to get the review, then thinking if we give a glowing review 5-star bla bla would they advertise, really who cares.

I liked pioneer products for years, but not any more, especailly blu-ray players,but I do know qaulity when I see it and the oppo has it in spades, but I would not buy one, why?? because I dont need all the facilitys it offers because i would not use them, so a cheaper player would do me.

I think the mag genuinly got this wrong and i suspect deep down, this review has done them no favours. :clap: :clap:

 

[pioneer7]

sorry about the double post

 

[Frank Harvey]

I doubt anyone will be looking to fail a Bluray player on technical issues if the TV isn't calibrated, so I don't think that this is a better review for the majority.

 

[ellisdj]

Just following on from my last post re using calibrated tv's for this type of test - I didnt fully explain my reasoing for the comment based on this thread And to be honest O think I am wrong for the best part anyways

In a situation where there is divided opinion such as the Oppo 103 - a lot of other reviewers give it high praise / reference status - WHF 3 stars.

Maybe in this instance the performance difference of the Oppo over cheaper players are not clear as a result of the test TV not being calibrated (just suggesting not implying) - however thinking about it in a way that makes it a more accurate review for the average punter - and their expectations of what to expect if they purchase.

If they did use a Panasonoic VT for example to test the player then that set is reported to have a very close to calibrated performance out of the box in THX mode - so then my theory goes out the window. I only mentioned it as I do feel a calibrated reference set for blu ray player etc testing is the equivalent to a treated listening room for av / hifi in its fairness to all products.

Blu Ray Players should be the easiest to A/B test - you can feed several into a receiver and as long as you have multiple copies of the test disc you can go back and fourth between the inputs for a quick A/B/C/D etc assessment of the same scene. I am sure that is what they do and therefore give a review opinion on that result

Its amazing one review I have read of the Oppo 103 assesses its performance purely on actual technical tests and does not once mention picture or sound from a sit and watch point of view and they award it Reference status. That is a stark contrast purely scientific kind of review.

However in that same review he does state that other players if setup correctly will also provide perfect picture the same as the Oppo- such as from Panasonic - however the Oppo is perfect straight out of the box.

This the conclusion to that review - and really shows why WHF have given 3 stars I feel - Price vs Performance

If you own a 1080p TV, watch mainly 1080p/24 movies on Blu-ray, and feed bitstream audio to an HDMI capable AV receiver, you’ll end up with the same AV quality from cheaper players – provided you seek a “known good” one out and avoid players which inflict some whimsical alterations on the picture without the consent of the user (or the filmmaker, for that matter!)

For that reason, assigning ratings to disc players is difficult. Unlike display devices which always have various parameters to consider (and prioritise in importance), a disc player’s performance is largely decided by whether it passes or fails a multitude of tests. There is even less subjectivity involved than there is in a scientifically-minded review of a TV or projector, which is saying something.

That leaves us with the question, does the OPPO BDP-103 deserve a “Highly Recommended” or a “Reference” rating? We went with the latter in the end, because although we’ve pointed out a few small areas where the player’s usability could be improved (we know from past experience with OPPO that it’s likely they actually will be), we can’t think of any better player when you look at the overall situation. The BDP-103EU does have it all: outstanding usability, fast performance, undistorted playback of 1080p/24 Blu-ray Discs, excellent handling of trickier sources such as 1080i content and DVDs, and a very quiet disc mechanism. Add 4K upscaling, online connectivity, network playback, and top notch build quality into your consideration, and you’ll probably agree with us that the final rating is deserved.

 

[ellisdj]

David - I think you has mis read ym meaning there - the calibration was aimed at WHF reviews.

The the review pasted from is based purely on the players merits at passing specific test - however I find his conclusion sums up the situation very well - however given what he has said 3 stars does seem harsh

I havent read the WHF review yet - I hasnt put me off the player - It has made me want to demo it even more actually to make my own mind up - against what I have on my calibrated TV

 

[Deleted member 2457]

David - I think you has mis read ym meaning there - the calibration was aimed at WHF reviews.

The the review pasted from is based purely on the players merits at passing specific test - however I find his conclusion sums up the situation very well - however given what he has said 3 stars does seem harsh

I havent read the WHF review yet - I hasnt put me off the player - It has made me want to demo it even more actually to make my own mind up - against what I have on my calibrated TV

Well according to David you are going to have to change the Oppo picture settings to get a good picture from it to start with!

 

[Frank Harvey]

Well according to David you are going to have to change the Oppo picture settings to get a good picture from it to start with!

Not really, but you can get an even better picture by playing about with the settings that are available on the player.

 

[The_Lhc]

For once, I am an expert on this thread

Oh my friend, I think you'll find we're ALL experts on every thread!

 

[Anonymous]

I think what seperates the experts from the hobbyists is whether people pay for your advice!

FYI - somone mentioned it already - I'm going to have to demo this player now.

 

[richardw42]

Just a thought. I wonder if WHF have made some changes to their scoring. There's less 5 stars given out in latest edition than you normally get. Tbh I was getting a bit cheesed off the way 5 stars were getting chucked about.

Viewed in isolation 3 stars is better than average. One might have expected its functionality to give it a bigger push though.

There are still anomalies though, like the Arcam amp. I think that in 2013 a £650 product needs to offer more especially with cheaper amps giving a DAC or even more.

 

[The_Lhc]

I think what seperates the experts from the hobbyists is whether people pay for your advice!

Only in the real world...

 

[GSB]

I was very suprised on hearing the 3stars awarded becouse of the fact that the 2dealers i had spoke too realy rated it.The one thing i learned was that,in their opinion, the picture quality was better than the 93 on a projector,if you looked realy hard!!

Great thread by the way...will there be a fight soon..... :shifty:

 

[duaplex]

I have never seen so many people upset over one review. The player doesn't suddenly become useless as a result of the rating.

 

[Ian986]

Slightly off topic but,

I went and had a demo today and seemed good not blown away I will proberly get one and try at home.

Just had one question I tried to conect My i phone to the oppo and just said error ? has anyone managed this ?

 

[manicm]

I've read the review and would say it's very fair. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and indeed all the hifi rags have their own. To say WHF have been unfair towards Oppo is rubbish - did they not give the 95 five stars??

So onto the review - the appraised the CD replay as average, and picture quality as no better than cheaper decks. And it has a lot of features - but how many will one use now? Not the 4k upscaling that's for sure. And I politely disagree with bigboss about Blu-ray video equivalence across brands. Noise is my bugbear and I've found subtle improvements from Sony 360 to 370, and onto my CA-751BD. Also the Marvel/Mediatek Odeo decoders and scalers are now ubiquitous across makes like CA/Oppo/Onkyo. And I strongly suspect that the Anchor Bay video DACs found in the Denon's and Marantz's are superior in sheer picture quality.

In which case WHF are to be trusted then I'd rather put my money on a Denon 2012 - no question about it even if it's an older model.

Furthermore, I seriously doubt the picture quality in the Oppo 105/CA 752 would be any better than the 95/751BD. And right now, right here, unless you have serious moola to burn, I would also politely disagree with David when I say that 4k upscaling is by and large a red herring. Especially in a few years when 4k display prices will undoubtedly fall yet Sharp at CES have demonstrated 8k technology. 3D has been missed and gone, and 4k may very well go the same way. It's Betamax stuff.

 

[jcshutts]

Given all the debate and without wishing to appear easily led..... I need an option of a Blu ray with onboard HD decoding that will send analogue 7.1 to my amp. Whilst the debates rage on around Oppo and I find a store which will allow me a test, are there any alternatives out there please????

 

[FennerMachine]

There are a few players with 7.1 analogue outputs.

Panasonic DMP-BDT500

Cambridge Audio 651BD

Oppo 103

These are a few I found after a quick check, there will be others.

If you need 7.1 analogue outputs then probably worth a demo as the audio being analogue outputs they could/will be massively different from each other.