New amp Roksan K3?

[Andrewjvt]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures...   ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

Look up the cost of toroidal power supply.

Ive listened many times to caspian amps

 

[Vladimir]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures...   ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings.
The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

 

[Al ears]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures... ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

 

[Vladimir]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures... ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

I didn't mean to imply you did. We are merely commenting on the differences between the two. I think they are both interesting amps to own. One is more powerfull and smoother, while the other is nervous and fast, viceral. The 10kHz test shows confirms what people are listening.

The input sensitivity of the Caspian gives it the edge in sounding more powerful with greater impact, as well as the higher voltage and current slews. But it will run out of steam sooner than the Kandy and begin sounding nasty. So it shouldn't go paired with demanding speakers into territory where the Kandy will pass usncaved.

The Caspian is more of a british amp tradition, like say Naim and Exposure. The Kandy is more Japanese, like big Pioneers, Hitachi and Sansuis. Well, somewhat. *smile*

I don't read company marketing. I make up my own. *pardon*

 

[Al ears]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures... ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

I didn't mean to imply you did. We are merely commenting on the differences between the two. I think they are both interesting amps to own. One is more powerfull and smoother, while the other is nervous and fast, viceral. The 10kHz test shows confirms what people are listening.

The input sensitivity of the Caspian gives it the edge in sounding more powerful with greater impact, as well as the higher voltage and current slews. But it will run out of steam sooner than the Kandy and begin sounding nasty. So it shouldn't go paired with demanding speakers into territory where the Kandy will pass usncaved.

The Caspian is more of a british amp tradition, like say Naim and Exposure. The Kandy is more Japanese, like big Pioneers, Hitachi and Sansuis. Well, somewhat. *smile*

I don't read company marketing. I make up my own. *pardon*

Don't we all?? ;-)

I do, however, concur with your observation that the Caspian is more 'British' and Kandy is simply nondescript, or at least non-individual, in it's presentation if not build.

 

[Vladimir]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures... ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

I didn't mean to imply you did. We are merely commenting on the differences between the two. I think they are both interesting amps to own. One is more powerfull and smoother, while the other is nervous and fast, viceral. The 10kHz test shows confirms what people are listening.

The input sensitivity of the Caspian gives it the edge in sounding more powerful with greater impact, as well as the higher voltage and current slews. But it will run out of steam sooner than the Kandy and begin sounding nasty. So it shouldn't go paired with demanding speakers into territory where the Kandy will pass usncaved.

The Caspian is more of a british amp tradition, like say Naim and Exposure. The Kandy is more Japanese, like big Pioneers, Hitachi and Sansuis. Well, somewhat. *smile*

I don't read company marketing. I make up my own. *pardon*

Don't we all?? ;-)

I do, however, concur with your observation that the Caspian is more 'British' and Kandy is simply nondescript, or at least non-individual, in it's presentation if not build.

It's only nondescript if you never owned old mosfet amps based on the original Hitachi topology. It's a recognizable type of sound.

 

[Andrewjvt]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures...   ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was  ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

I didn't mean to imply you did. We are merely commenting on the differences between the two. I think they are both interesting amps to own. One is more powerfull and smoother, while the other is nervous and fast, viceral. The 10kHz test shows confirms what people are listening. 

The input sensitivity of the Caspian gives it the edge in sounding more powerful with greater impact, as well as the higher voltage and current slews. But it will run out of steam sooner than the Kandy and begin sounding nasty. So it shouldn't go paired with demanding speakers into territory where the Kandy will pass usncaved.

The Caspian is more of a british amp tradition, like say Naim and Exposure. The Kandy is more Japanese, like big Pioneers, Hitachi and Sansuis. Well, somewhat. *smile*

I don't read company marketing. I make up my own. *pardon*

Very recently I've demo'd cyrus, naim and have very similar sound characteristics on atc speakers

Very exciting sound but the mids/highs get very rough when pushed and very similar memories to the caspian

 

[Andrewjvt]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures...   ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was  ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

1 watt = 1 watt regardless of amp
What makes it different is amp design and power/current reserves for demanding music/higher volume and demanding speakers. Both amps sound good to me when used well within their limits.
The rest is down to input sensitivity a cheap trick

 

[Vladimir]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures... ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

1 watt = 1 watt regardless of amp What makes it different is amp design and power/current reserves for demanding music/higher volume and demanding speakers. Both amps sound good to me when used well within their limits. The rest is down to input sensitivity a cheap trick

If I had a penny for every "It's so powerfull, I can't go past 9 o'clock on the volume dial" I'd buy Apple and rebrand it as SQNY.

 

[Al ears]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures... ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

1 watt = 1 watt regardless of amp What makes it different is amp design and power/current reserves for demanding music/higher volume and demanding speakers. Both amps sound good to me when used well within their limits. The rest is down to input sensitivity a cheap trick

If I had a penny for every "It's so powerfull, I can't go past 9 o'clock on the volume dial" I'd buy Apple and rebrand it as SQNY.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

I'm looking to update my system in stages with the first being the amp. I am looking a the K3 as I like the fact it has a phono stage and has a matching power amp that I could purchase in the future.

For the foreseeable future I will be keeping the bx5s but the plan is to upgrade to MA silvers or golds.

My only concern is that I will see limited improvement with the amp upgrade due to the speakers. Or is it the case I would still see a performance boost with the K3?

Is there any other amps that would work well with MA speakers as I plan to organise some demos in September. Have Ltd spare time these days with 2 kids and want to make the demos as focused as possible.

i agree with some of previous posts. It seems what is obvious is you need to upgrade speakers if you are spending that sort of money. Many think something from neat, or tannoy etc. Then come back to amps as the next upgrade. It's a false economy spending double or more the price in amps to speakers, as you are unlikely to get much benefit. On the other hand start with a best possible speaker for your needs and then go from there with amps.

 

[Andrewjvt]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures...   ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was  ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

1 watt = 1 watt regardless of amp What makes it different is amp design and power/current reserves for demanding music/higher volume and demanding speakers. Both amps sound good to me when used well within their limits. The rest is down to input sensitivity a cheap trick

If I had a penny for every "It's so powerfull, I can't go past 9 o'clock on the volume dial" I'd buy Apple and rebrand it as SQNY.

Or special naim watts

Im going to start a new thread when I've got more time as im moving house about all the amps I've recently demo.
Price and performance are not related though.

 

[Vladimir]

Was hoping you could suggest a good phono stage. Like the OP I've always had a very good stage built-in, but after buying the Tucana the Leema Elements is superb (based on a Pulse Elements stages).

If the Op is looking for a long-term amp the Caspian would be above the K3 - and others at the budget.

Ive taken a look inside both amps as Vlad suggested and also can see nothing inside that makes the caspian a better amp except price and marketing.

We can thank What hifi for some of that hype too

They probably actually listened to it rather than look at pictures... ;-)

..the twin toroidal power supply might be one reason, as is the bi-polar rather than MOSFET output design.

It's not a dual mono amp. Caspian has one small transformer for the power amp and one even smaller for the pre section. The Kandy has one big transformer for everything, with separate windings. The main audible difference comes from the input sensitivity. The Caspian is louder and comes off as more powerful to the unsuspecting listener. However, it isn't.

I wasn't aware that I said it was ;-)

It does indeed sound more powerful, at least it did compared to my L111, but everyone knows there's watts and there's watts....

1 watt = 1 watt regardless of amp What makes it different is amp design and power/current reserves for demanding music/higher volume and demanding speakers. Both amps sound good to me when used well within their limits. The rest is down to input sensitivity a cheap trick

If I had a penny for every "It's so powerfull, I can't go past 9 o'clock on the volume dial" I'd buy Apple and rebrand it as SQNY.

Or special naim watts

Im going to start a new thread when I've got more time as im moving house about all the amps I've recently demo. Price and performance are not related though.

Amp rant thread! Wohoo! *clapping*

 

[CnoEvil]

Everybody knows there's Watts...and then there's Class A Watts. *dance4* *diablo*

 

[Andrewjvt]

Everybody knows there's Watts...and then there's Class A Watts. *dance4* *diablo*

Yes but i have a class a rant coming haha

 

[CnoEvil]

Everybody knows there's Watts...and then there's Class A Watts. *dance4* *diablo*

Yes but i have a class a rant coming haha

You'll get hot (under the collar), which is all part of a good Class A rant! *aggressive*

 

[Al ears]

Everybody knows there's Watts...and then there's Class A Watts. *dance4* *diablo*

Yep , I currently utilise 25 of them.... it's the delivery method that counts... ;-)

 

[emcc_3]

Hoping to avoid buying a separate phono stage. Don't have any plans to move to a moving coil.

 

[emcc_3]

Agree with your sentiment. Current weak spot is the amp other half has told me to go for as close to the end point on components as possible. So amp first this year speakers next;-) I like the monitor audio sound and they also pass the waf test.

 

[Al ears]

Agree with your sentiment. Current weak spot is the amp other half has told me to go for as close to the end point on components as possible. So amp first this year speakers next;-) I like the monitor audio sound and they also pass the waf test.

It may or may not be of interest that I have found that the one manufacturer that provides probably the best internal phono stage is Creek, although Roksan not far behind.

If you have the money I would strongly suggest the Creek Evolution 100A with Sequel mark 2 plug-in phono preamp card.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

If you are looking at spending around £1k on an amp and you say the current weak point is the amp but you own speakers at around half that, it seems to me the weak point is the speakers. Assuming sound quality is the most important consideration aside the phono issue.

Buying a good amplifier to a situation where you will then change speakers, is about the worst thing you can do. The reason is because you will then be trying to match the amp to the different speakers which may not work. The best thing to do is buy the speakers first and see what they sound best with in dealers to get an idea for amps, also how they will perform with best possible amps to reach the speakers full potential. Then even if your current amp is not up to standard, you will know where future upgrades take you. You may find you really like x brand of speaker after your amp purchase, but then realise the new amp doesn't suit it.

 

[Andrewjvt]

If you are looking at spending around £1k on an amp and you say the current weak point is the amp but you own speakers at around half that, it seems to me the weak point is the speakers. Assuming sound quality is the most important consideration aside the phono issue. 

Buying a good amplifier to a situation where you will then change speakers, is about the worst thing you can do. The reason is because you will then be trying to match the amp to the different speakers which may not work. The best thing to do is buy the speakers first and see what they sound best with in dealers to get an idea for amps, also how they will perform with best possible amps to reach the speakers full potential. Then even if your current amp is not up to standard, you will know where future upgrades take you. You may find you really like x brand of speaker after your amp purchase, but then realise the new amp doesn't suit it. 

Yes the more money its costs the better it sounds great advice.
Forget about room acoustics.
Please explain to us all again how much money your amps cost and how much better the speakers sound with each boring upgrade.
When are you going to start practicing what you originally preached about 'its all about the music' and equipment bores you?

 

[Vladimir]

If you are looking at spending around £1k on an amp and you say the current weak point is the amp but you own speakers at around half that, it seems to me the weak point is the speakers. Assuming sound quality is the most important consideration aside the phono issue.

Buying a good amplifier to a situation where you will then change speakers, is about the worst thing you can do. The reason is because you will then be trying to match the amp to the different speakers which may not work. The best thing to do is buy the speakers first and see what they sound best with in dealers to get an idea for amps, also how they will perform with best possible amps to reach the speakers full potential. Then even if your current amp is not up to standard, you will know where future upgrades take you. You may find you really like x brand of speaker after your amp purchase, but then realise the new amp doesn't suit it.

Yes the more money its costs the better it sounds great advice. Forget about room acoustics. Please explain to us all again how much money your amps cost and how much better the speakers sound with each boring upgrade. When are you going to start practicing what you originally preached about 'its all about the music' and equipment bores you?

Confession: I never actually read what he trolls about. I just scroll through. *biggrin*

 

[Andrewjvt]

If you are looking at spending around £1k on an amp and you say the current weak point is the amp but you own speakers at around half that, it seems to me the weak point is the speakers. Assuming sound quality is the most important consideration aside the phono issue. 

Buying a good amplifier to a situation where you will then change speakers, is about the worst thing you can do. The reason is because you will then be trying to match the amp to the different speakers which may not work. The best thing to do is buy the speakers first and see what they sound best with in dealers to get an idea for amps, also how they will perform with best possible amps to reach the speakers full potential. Then even if your current amp is not up to standard, you will know where future upgrades take you. You may find you really like x brand of speaker after your amp purchase, but then realise the new amp doesn't suit it. 

Yes the more money its costs the better it sounds great advice. Forget about room acoustics. Please explain to us all again how much money your amps cost and how much better the speakers sound with each boring upgrade. When are you going to start practicing what you originally preached about 'its all about the music' and equipment bores you?

Confession: I never actually read what he trolls about. I just scroll through. *biggrin*

Ja for sure best that way

 

[emcc_3]

Appreciate you are trying to help but using your logic with the speakers my current amp cost £299.