New amp and floorstanders for £1500

[relocated]

Now pop your tricycle into the shed, get washed and off to bed with you. :wave:

And you're telling me to grow up......

Anyway, I was out at the Swansea v Chelsea game. I didn't realiase being a ball boy was such a Hazrd-ous occupation.

Yes it was put there as an 'out' for you. It gave you something to come back on, because there was no point to you continuing as you had been.

As to the Chelsea chap. What an incredibly stupid thing to do, especialy at an away ground. It could have sparked crowd trouble and then got Swansea in deep do-do for inadequate crowd control.

His excuse, sorry - explanation, I suspect will not be easily swallowed by the FA.

 

[jcbrum]

They also won't fill a 6 x 6m room (standmounts within budget).. Thats the point.

Of course they will. I have used them in similar conditions, also in schools, and at the NEC.

JC

 

[moon]

They also won't fill a 6 x 6m room (standmounts within budget).. Thats the point.

Of course they will. I have used them in similar conditions, also in schools, and at the NEC.

JC

the NEC :quest:

 

[jcbrum]

The National Exhibition Centre.

 

[relocated]

Just one other point to clear up because some people have clearly missed this:

"am I right in thinking floorstanders will be needed for a room this size?"

It has a question mark at the end, so it indicates a need for an answer. An answer that need not be 'floorstanders'.

Always happy to help.

:O

 

[CnoEvil]

Unfortunately this is where paranoia takes you.

The answer to everything is not the AVI ADM 9RS/S or AVI ADM 40. But in many instances it is at least a consideration and as so few people are aware of the benefit of actives then owners of AVI ADMs put forward the suggestion. Not to wind you passive people up, because if you are as happy as I am then that is BRILLIANT. But because most of us[most=speculation] have years of 'not-quite-right' passive ownership that we have tinkered with to try and get the sound just right.

Since moving to AVI ADMs, I [and they] have found a solution to their wanderings. Mine arrived, unpacked, placed on stands, connect to a source, to each other, power up and away you go. 13 months of the most regular use I have ever put a music system to and I only ever listen without doing anything else. No wishing this was a bit better, would a new cable/mains cable/mains conditioner etc etc etc make a difference? Just 100% listening pleasure and rediscovering my music collection. Cheapest year on cd purchasing ever, too many old cds being rediscovered.

I have to ask, what are you so scared about? The AVI ADMs won't eat your children, ravish your wife or constantly bleed your wallet dry. They were the answer to my 40 year journey, I was made aware of them via this forum and I am just passing on my experience so that others might not waste years and thousands £££££££££££ like I did.

Thank you for, hopefully, taking the time to read what I have said.

:cheer:

The problem comes because we all think we know best, and so recommend it......often in spite of what someone is actually looking for (that's not meant as a dig). We then take umbrage if that recommendation is criticized, as it would appear the egos of male audiophiles are fairly precious and testosterone driven. :shifty:

Hifi should be a fun, enjoyable hobby, where shared experiences should be welcomed as well as beneficial, and opinions respected.

Amen!

 

[moon]

The National Exhibition Centre.

yup I know what it stands for

 

[Frank Harvey]

I think there's a lot of exaggerated rubbish talked about passive speakers - phrases like "horrendous distortion" tend to crop up, which are excessively melodramatic to say the least. Of course, we would expect this from a company that doesn't sell passive speakers, and there are many other statements from the same company that apply to electronics, because they don't produce separate electronics either. Anything they don't do is talked about negatively.

Yes, there have been some dire passive speakers in the past, and there are still some mediocre ones around nowadays, and quite a few are overpriced. Yes, active speaker may measure better in certain areas and solve a few issues, BUT, speaker development has now come to a point where most speaker issues are better understood and are/have been/being addressed. So while people may well have spent decades and a load of cash looking for the right sound in the past, it isn't the mammoth task nowadays that it used to be. There's a lot of speakers out there, and it isn't too hard to find something that suits your own personal tastes, whatever that may be.

The ADM9's are a valid suggestion as far as budget is concerned, but room size may be the issue. Much of it will depend on the listening distance. If you're sitting 3 feet away from a small pair of standmounts in a 20m by 20m room, they'll be fine because the speaker only has to be efficient enough to get the sound to you. The further you move away from the speaker, the louder it has to be played to give you the same listening level. At some point, that speaker will start struggling, regardless of its design. And the bass will start to disappear too as it starts getting lost in the room because the drivers aren't big enough to shift any air.

Maybe the active brigade can just take it back a notch (or two) and make valid suggestions, just don't make them in an arrogant or condescending way. The 9's may be touted as the most accurate thing this side of the 40's, but next year there'll be a new improved version, one that gets you even closer to the music. This isn't a new claim - its been happening for decades.

 

[hoopsontoast]

The answer to life, the universe and everything isn't 42. It's 9 or 40. For these are the model numbers used by AVI. Any hi-fi query and the answer's 9. Or 40. Doesn't matter what your room size is. Or your taste in music or hi-fi. The answer's always ADM9. Or 40. In the AVI universe anyway.

Unfortunately this is where paranoia takes you.

The answer to everything is not the AVI ADM 9RS/S or AVI ADM 40. But in many instances it is at least a consideration and as so few people are aware of the benefit of actives then owners of AVI ADMs put forward the suggestion. Not to wind you passive people up, because if you are as happy as I am then that is BRILLIANT. But because most of us[most=speculation] have years of 'not-quite-right' passive ownership that we have tinkered with to try and get the sound just right.

Since moving to AVI ADMs, I [and they] have found a solution to their wanderings. Mine arrived, unpacked, placed on stands, connect to a source, to each other, power up and away you go. 13 months of the most regular use I have ever put a music system to and I only ever listen without doing anything else. No wishing this was a bit better, would a new cable/mains cable/mains conditioner etc etc etc make a difference? Just 100% listening pleasure and rediscovering my music collection. Cheapest year on cd purchasing ever, too many old cds being rediscovered.

I have to ask, what are you so scared about? The AVI ADMs won't eat your children, ravish your wife or constantly bleed your wallet dry. They were the answer to my 40 year journey, I was made aware of them via this forum and I am just passing on my experience so that others might not waste years and thousands £££££££££££ like I did.

Thank you for, hopefully, taking the time to read what I have said.

:cheer:

This is the problem, you are creating an us Vs them issue. I dont care that they are active or not, I dont care that they are made by AVI but its the sheer outright 'this is the best thing ever, it will change you life' right up until there is a new model out, and thats the best thing ever.

Give it a rest. I see you are happy with your purchase, and many others are. Good for you. Make a suggestion and then take offence when other people recommend something else.

At the end of the Day, the OP has a 6m square room, with open/vaulted ceiling. As I said, no 6" bookshelf, no mater who its made by, no matter if its active or passive, no matter how much power you stick into it will work optimally in that room. Its the law of physics.

Now, as we are declaring best things ever, I will recommend that Magnepan speakers (again as he did not hear the first time) will be the best he will get and nothing else will do for him! and all you people with boxed speakers are wrong and enjoy your coloured sound....... :rofl: :silenced:

 

[Anonymous]

David,

I see from your website you have some ex demo CM9s for sale, what colour are they ?

After reading all of the above i am leaning towards either the Dynaudios highlighed on ebay or the CM9s,

Both look a good deal, although i realise i would be buying without a demo, but from what i've seen not many demo rooms will reproduce my room, once i have a quality pair of speakers that will fill the room then i could search for an amp to partner them

Many thanks for all the advice, its stirred up a good old debate over the AVI issue !

 

[richardw42]

If ever I was to go back to amp + speakers, your idea of settling on a speaker then finding a suitable amp is exactly what I'd do.

Id go so far as contacting the speaker makers and finding what amps (make, power) that they've used in development or demonstrations. Lots have a Facebook presence.

Somebody has mentioned it here, also think about AV amps, much better vfm.

 

[Frank Harvey]

The CM9's are in walnut, if I recall correctly. There will be plenty of other options too with a bit of research.

A demo is always worthwhile, even if the room is nothing like yours. Comparing a few speakers in the same environment will give you an idea of how they sound, and more importantly, how they sound compared to each other. Most averagely sized speakers can be made to sound good in most averagely sized rooms with a bit of experimentation, but the more important thing is whether they're being driven properly. Regardless of what anyone says, the partnering amplifier does make a difference, and it doesn't matter whether the speaker is in its optimal position in the room if the amp can't provide what the speaker needs in order to work as it has been designed.

As a side note, I'm not brushing off room acoustics having a big effect on speakers, but room modes are room modes, and they'll be present regardless of the speaker you're using, so all speakers auditioned in the same environment will be at the same disadvantage.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Somebody has mentioned it here, also think about AV amps, much better vfm.

While they're improving, integrated AV receivers will not represent as good value for money as far as two channel performance is concerned, and very few compete with a good two channel amp at half its price. I've seen the comments, and its just another crusade to try and overthrow other aspects of the British hi-fi industry.

 

[BigColz]

David,

I see from your website you have some ex demo CM9s for sale, what colour are they ?

After reading all of the above i am leaning towards either the Dynaudios highlighed on ebay or the CM9s,

Both look a good deal, although i realise i would be buying without a demo, but from what i've seen not many demo rooms will reproduce my room, once i have a quality pair of speakers that will fill the room then i could search for an amp to partner them

Many thanks for all the advice, its stirred up a good old debate over the AVI issue !

As David said def worth demoing even if the room is different they'll all be in the same enviroment which is the main thing.. I demoed x36s with my cyrus pre/power and was hideously brutal on top end.. Couldn't turn it past moderate listening levels before ears start bleeding. With my Electro it was 10 x more satisfying overall but it does have a darker top end than most amps.. I tried CM8s with M6i and found them ok but bass light. CM9's are meant to be much better.. If you HAVE to buy blind i'd probably think the CM9s are safer bet. Def worth a listen though if possible. as well as KEF R700 (assuming theyre in budget) and ProAcs if possible.. It's a lot of money to invest and important to get it right for YOU and only you will know..

 

[relocated]

Hoops and Cno,

I don't speak for others because I don't have their life etc.

All I have ever done when speaking about AVI ADM speakers is say what has happened to me and put forward AVI speakers as a possibility for others. I don't preach, I don't direct, I pass on my experience.

If people allowed me to just do that without making inaccurate comments then there would be no argument from me. I will however, respond when people are talking drivel, I am mis-quoted or quoted out of context.

There have been deliberately inflammatory comments made in the past by AVI owners[??], but for months now there has been a much more grown up debate and restraint by the mods. People need to respond to what is placed before them NOW and treat it on its own merits, not harp back to long gone wind-ups.

David @ a hifi dealers,

Unfortunately your involvement in this sort of conflict/discussion always leads me to ponder the same old question. What is the proportion of passive to active hifi that you sell, especialy if you exclude subs? How much income does this same group of products earn the dealership? This for me always taints your posts.

What worries me more is that you seem to be steering away from good and VFM AV amps partly because they are an attack on the British HiFi industry. If that is the bias you come from, then what value is your opinion as a balanced provider of the best products suitable for each individual? I quote below just in case it should get lost.

Somebody has mentioned it here, also think about AV amps, much better vfm.

While they're improving, integrated AV receivers will not represent as good value for money as far as two channel performance is concerned, and very few compete with a good two channel amp at half its price. I've seen the comments, and its just another crusade to try and overthrow other aspects of the British hi-fi industry.




As I almost always say [it is always my thought], if you have a passive system and you are as pleased with it as I am with my AVI ADM 9Ts then I am as pleased for you as you are for yourself. I also keep my testosterone clear of hifi.

Thank you for taking the time to read my contribution.

 

[CnoEvil]

Hoops and Cno,

I don't speak for others because I don't have their life etc.

All I have ever done when speaking about AVI ADM speakers is say what has happened to me and put forward AVI speakers as a possibility for others. I don't preach, I don't direct, I pass on my experience.

I was speaking very generally; it just so happened that my comment was in reply to your post.....so apologies if I appeared to be insinuating anything different. Give me proactive / positive posts over reactive / negative ones, any day of the week.

 

[richardw42]

Re the AVR thing. Stereo amp manufactures really need to offer more.

DAC inputs are nosing there way in, but with Spotify etc they need to do more.

Onkyos TX8050 should be the way to go, and I seem to remember a Peachtree amp with a slot for a Sonos.

Maybe I'm a bit cynical but one box to do it all would not be good for manufacturers ?

 

[Frank Harvey]

Re the AVR thing. Stereo amp manufactures really need to offer more.

DAC inputs are nosing there way in, but with Spotify etc they need to do more.

Onkyos TX8050 should be the way to go, and I seem to remember a Peachtree amp with a slot for a Sonos.

Maybe I'm a bit cynical but one box to do it all would not be good for manufacturers ?

AV receivers HAVE to offer more. Firstly because it is a very competitive market, but also because it is expected. Unfortunately more features generally come at the expense of overall quality.

There is a market for a do-it-all one box, and theyre creeping in. But there's also an equal, if not bigger market for those that just want a stereo amplifier.

 

[relocated]

Hoops and Cno,

I don't speak for others because I don't have their life etc.

All I have ever done when speaking about AVI ADM speakers is say what has happened to me and put forward AVI speakers as a possibility for others. I don't preach, I don't direct, I pass on my experience.

I was speaking very generally; it just so happened that my comment was in reply to your post.....so apologies if I appeared to be insinuating anything different. Give me proactive / positive posts over reactive / negative ones, any day of the week.

Here, here. We are in total agreement there. I also take your point about, coincidental posting, comment. It saves a lot of time trying to explain why you are saying what you are.

 

[Frank Harvey]

David @ a hifi dealers,

Unfortunately your involvement in this sort of conflict/discussion always leads me to ponder the same old question. What is the proportion of passive to active hifi that you sell, especialy if you exclude subs? How much income does this same group of products earn the dealership? This for me always taints your posts.

Very little, due to demand. But we do sell active speakers, and if that is what people want, then that is what they can buy. But as I've said before, we get about two people a year asking for active speakers. If there was a higher demand, we'd stock more options. At the end of the day, we want to still be around in 10 years time rather than disappear because we've spent too much money offering options that just don't sell. The next five years will re-shape the hi-fi industry for some time to come. Whatever route that may be.

What worries me more is that you seem to be steering away from good and VFM AV amps partly because they are an attack on the British HiFi industry. If that is the bias you come from, then what value is your opinion as a balanced provider of the best products suitable for each individual? I quote below just in case it should get lost.

I think you misunderstand. AV amps arent an attack on British hi-fi, what is being said about them and the way they're being talked about on a certain forum is (like other subjects). And much of what is being said just isn't true. Yes, an AV receiver is better value for money on a feature vs feature basis, but not on sound quality - show me an AV receiver for <£1000 that will drive a quality hi-fi speaker as well as a similarly priced hi-fi amplifier. You can't put the same quality of amplification into a similarly priced AV receiver because much of the money is spent on numerous (in many cases, unneeded) inputs, audio and video processing, and all the license fees that come with that.

Without value for money products, the industry wouldn't survive, but it is, because there's more and more options coming out for people to choose from. Many people do go for value for money products, but others go for a product that suits them and their needs, not necessarily the one with the most connections and the most features. If someone calls up to book a demo to compare a hi-fi amp and an AV receiver in two channel mode aren't treated like idiots - I'll book it in and perform the demo fairly - I've done quite a few during the course of last year.

For the past five years or so, many people have been coming away from AV receivers and going back to hi-fi because they just don't listen to them any more - they miss the sound quality from the old hi-fi system they had before they got rid of it and changed to a "do it all" system.

 

[Phileas]

[EDITED BY MODS - please don't attack other users]

I didn't. In response to Lindsayt, I said "A**e", which is a nickname for the ADM9 RSS.

I.e. I was just listing another AVI speaker that Lindsayt didn't mention in his little rant.

(So now we can't say "a**e" which seems a bit silly - it's a pretty harmless word.)

 

[relocated]

David @ a hifidealer,

Ah yes, the chicken and egg explanation.

Thank god for forums, because otherwise I would never have been enlightened about MY hugely positive journey into actives. Little exposure in hifi magazines and blank faces, or worse, at every hifi dealer I have visited - including yours David.

It is a conundrum is it not? Stock and promote good actives on an equal basis and where does your DAC upgrade[for some actives],amp upgrade, cable upgrade, etc., etc., etc., go? Pretty much down the pipe to the sewage works [didn't use the word 'toilet' in case it is too rude] I would speculate.

So not the best way for traditional hifi dealerships probably? Since getting my AVI ADM 9Ts I haven't had the previously inevitable; if I just adjust this, or add that or get an even more ludicrously expensive cable of some sort feeling/need. 13 months of no add-ons or upgrades, the best period in my hifi life. But no add-on business for the hifi industry/dealers, so for ME there is certainly more than a little scepticism in the chicken and egg explanation.

Good of you to respond by the way. No histrionics either, jolly good.

 

[relocated]

Where did the telling off of Phileas and him explaining bit go??

:?

 

[Phileas]

I probably said a**e once too often!

 

[BigColz]

Its all a conspiracy.. Why don't you start your own shop just selling actives?