Monitor Audio going active (probably)

[gowiththeflow]

People think that lowering the box count reduces cabling, but it doesn't seem to, even in an active system....

.....The Dynaudios were based on £900 speakers, and retailed for £2300, and you then had to add your source. A good £500/600 amp would work fine with the passive versions.

The difference for me is the difficulty of having to run thick, heavy speaker cables around a room, on one side across a doorway and on the other side, across to the other side of a fireplace; versus a short mains lead from the back of the speaker, into a very close by and convenient wall socket. The speaker cable cannot be hidden under the carpet, or floor (solid) and is an eyesore. The mains cables would be much shorter largely hidden from view.

Then there are the other choices and compromises associated with speaker cable to be considered. Doing away with speaker cable has to be the greatest benefit.

As for the Dynaudio speakers, presumably you are referring to the original and now superceded Xeo 3 & 5 models? The current Xeo 4 & 6 retail at only £555 & £600 above the equivellent Exite models, the X14 & X34 respectively.

I would say that £555/600 is very good value for on-board DAC's and multiple power amps, specifically and optimally matched to the drivers.

It's an etirely different situation with the cost of the Focus XD speakers series. Dynaudio's pricing is adding between £2195 and £3545 to the cost of the equivellent passive Focus models. Then again, a suitable high quality integrated or pre/power to match the Focus series speakers, will set you back from £2500 to £6000 or more. That's before DAC's are factored in.

/

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Well I am old school and when I buy a set of speakers I like them to be speakers not speakers with electricity running in side them and running a amp inside and if the salesman said to me wow I got this good set of speakers but they have amps inside and sound the dogs nuts I would still want to look at a pair of normal speakers . Why change something that's not broken but then the younger generation would get to grips with it ok but maybe some of us older people might not like the changes if it went that way and if they wanted to get people interested in this new technology then they have to make them the same prices as conventional speakers

 

[Jota180]

Ask any speaker manufacturer that makes passive and active speaker which one they think provides best sound quality and they all say the actives. And how the hell are they going to make them the same price and their passives? ATC SCM40 actives have three power amps in each speaker, that's 6 in total.

 

[chebby]

... if they wanted to get people interested in this new technology ...

Hardly 'new technology'. Active loudspeaker systems go back 30 - 40 years as far as I know.

These Meridian M1s came out 33 years ago (for an example).

The BBC were using active monitor loudspeakers after 1979 (with Quad amps) in the form of their Rogers LS5/8s. (.PDF file see section 5)

 

[marou]

But hardly anyone's buying them and neither are you. Inflexible if the DAC is included, additional boxes needed if not, unsightly cables in plain view, and John Lewis a hifi outlet? Give me a break.

 

[abacus]

There are more active speakers sold them passive speakers, (And have been for decades) its just that they are mostly used by pros (The ones that make and produce the music you listen too) and for live stage work.

Bill

 

[gowiththeflow]

But hardly anyone's buying them and neither are you.

It's probably fair to say that until recently, active speakers that are designed for and aimed at the "audiophile" or "HiFi" market, or whatever you want to call it, as opposed to studio type monitors or at the other end, "lifestyle" type products, have been mostly aimed at the higher price end of the market and as such, fewer in sales numbers.

The recent development is a slow but steady growth in the number of active "HiFi type" speakers being offered at more affordable prices. Some of these new active speakers are also bringing built-in digital and WiFi technology to the table, allowing the speaker manufacturers to tap into the changing landscape of listening and lifestyle habits.

Only a few of the speaker manufacturers having ventured into this area so far and there aren't that many models available. Those manufacturers that have, may be testing the water, so this could be described as an embryonic market. So with most HiFi dealers only stocking a limited range of speaker brands, it's probably inevitable that availability, visibility and market penetration are relatively limited. That may change as more brands start playing in the active speaker arena.

The other thing is dealer resistance. Last year when looking at various speakers in a large HiFi dealership, I mentioned to the sales person that I was also considering the possibility of reducing the "box count" in my HiFi system and was open to looking at all-in-one electronics to go with a new pair of speakers. Various options were discussed and suggested, but nothing was said about the Dynaudio Xeo's standing nearby, despite them being in the same price range and possibly fitting the bill.

When I asked about the Xeo's, the sales person made every effort to convince me to dismiss them from consideration. I've since been told that some dealers don't like the idea of losing the opportunity to sell lots of metal boxes to go with a pair of speakers. That situation might change if Monitor Audio, KEF, B&W et al start offering their own affordable actives.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Really? I remember my last 'separates' system (CDP, tuner, amp, DAC, speakers) had 12 cables (4 x mains, 2 x DIN -> DIN interconnect, 1x RCA pair, 1 x USB, 1 x optical, 2 x speaker cable, 1 x FM aerial co-ax).

I'm talking more from the point of view of active speakers. You'll have two mains leads, a lead between the two speakers, the lead from your source into them, and a mains lead for your source - that's a rough minimum, 5 cables. Let's take CD, amp and speakers. 2 mains leads, 2 speaker leads, and an interconnect cable. So in this case, a pair of active speakers like a certain brand I'm not going to mention, has the same amount of cables. It doesn't matter how many sources you add after that, there's going to be an interconnect and a mains cable, regardless of the system you add it to.

I found of you showed someone a pair of active speakers, explained the benefits, etc etc, many presumed there'd be less cabling, and there generally wasn't, which is the point where some people lose interest, and the benefits are instantly forgotten.

 

[steve_1979]

... The other thing is dealer resistance. Last year when looking at various speakers in a large HiFi dealership, I mentioned to the sales person that I was also considering the possibility of reducing the "box count" in my HiFi system and was open to looking at all-in-one electronics to go with a new pair of speakers. Various options were discussed and suggested, but nothing was said about the Dynaudio Xeo's standing nearby, despite them being in the same price range and possibly fitting the bill.

When I asked about the Xeo's, the sales person made every effort to convince me to dismiss them from consideration. I've since been told that some dealers don't like the idea of losing the opportunity to sell lots of metal boxes to go with a pair of speakers. ...

I have a thought on why the Xeo's weren't pushed by the sales person in the shop. How could he earn extra commision by selling you some fancy speaker cables when there aren't any?

Also there's no upgrade path so there's little chance of you coming back in the future to buy a new amplifier or whatever. You know that the built in amplifiers have already been designed and optimised specially for the individual drivers that they're driving so there's no need (or way) to change them.

Good news for the owner.

Not so great for the hifi shops.

 

[steve_1979]

I'm talking more from the point of view of active speakers. You'll have two mains leads, a lead between the two speakers, the lead from your source into them, and a mains lead for your source - that's a rough minimum, 5 cables. Let's take CD, amp and speakers. 2 mains leads, 2 speaker leads, and an interconnect cable. So in this case, a pair of active speakers like a certain brand I'm not going to mention, has the same amount of cables. It doesn't matter how many sources you add after that, there's going to be an interconnect and a mains cable, regardless of the system you add it to.

This is obviously referring to the AVI DM10 (and previous ADM9) speakers and I totally agree with what you're saying here. I'm running the DM10's together with the matching subwoofer and in this setup the left speaker has four cables plugged into it and the right speaker has two and TBH it all looks a bit messy round the back there. It reminds me a bit of spaghetti.

Even without a subwoofer plugged in (or using a separate DAC/pre with 2.1 outputs to connect the sub to) you can only reduce the left speaker cable count from four to three. Almost all other active speakers also require at least two cables per speaker which isn't much better either.

There's no way round it. Apart from a few of exceptions (eg Dynaudio Xeo and Audiovector) regular passive speakers tend to look a lot neater than actives. This is currently the biggest hurdle that active speakers will need to overcome if they're going to replace passive speakes for domestic use.

And don't get me started on surround sound setups using active speakers - the passive route is definitely much simpler and more elegant for home cinemas.

That said though for me the sonic benefits of active speakers, especially the DM10's, far outweighs the slight negative aspect of the extra cables. I love the way my speakers sound and have no intension of ever swapping them for anything else. But I don't doubt that a lot of potential customers would be put off by the extra cables which is a shame but totally understandable.

There's at least one guy on the AVI forum who's done a stellar job of hiding the cables though which proves that it can be done with the right speaker stands, a bit of fore thought and a few zip ties.

 

[drummerman]

I'm talking more from the point of view of active speakers. You'll have two mains leads, a lead between the two speakers, the lead from your source into them, and a mains lead for your source - that's a rough minimum, 5 cables. Let's take CD, amp and speakers. 2 mains leads, 2 speaker leads, and an interconnect cable. So in this case, a pair of active speakers like a certain brand I'm not going to mention, has the same amount of cables. It doesn't matter how many sources you add after that, there's going to be an interconnect and a mains cable, regardless of the system you add it to.

This is obviously referring to the AVI DM10 (and previous ADM9) speakers and I totally agree with what you're saying here. I'm running the DM10's together with the matching subwoofer and in this setup the left speaker has four cables plugged into it and the right speaker has two and TBH it all looks a bit messy round the back there. It reminds me a bit of spaghetti.

Even without a subwoofer plugged in (or using a separate DAC/pre with 2.1 outputs to connect the sub to) you can only reduce the left speaker cable count from four to three. Almost all other active speakers also require at least two cables per speaker which isn't much better either.

There's no way round it. Apart from a few of exceptions (eg Dynaudio Xeo and Audiovector) regular passive speakers tend to look a lot neater than actives. This is currently the biggest hurdle that active speakers will need to overcome if they're going to replace passive speakes for domestic use.

And don't get me started on surround sound setups using active speakers - the passive route is definitely much simpler and more elegant for home cinemas.

That said though for me the sonic benefits of active speakers, especially the DM10's, far outweighs the slight negative aspect of the extra cables. I love the way my speakers sound and have no intension of ever swapping them for anything else. But I don't doubt that a lot of potential customers would be put off by the extra cables which is a shame but totally understandable.

There's at least one guy on the AVI forum who's done a stellar job of hiding the cables though which proves that it can be done with the right speaker stands, a bit of fore thought and a few zip ties.

That looks very nice and probably sounds even better Steve

 

[Frank Harvey]

I have a thought on why the Xeo's weren't pushed by the sales person in the shop. How could he earn extra commision by selling you some fancy speaker cables when there aren't any?

Also there's no upgrade path so there's little chance of you coming back in the future to buy a new amplifier or whatever. You know that the built in amplifiers have already been designed and optimised specially for the individual drivers that they're driving so there's no need (or way) to change them.

I hardly think that a "salesman" who is only thinking of earning some commission out of someone is really thinking of any long term loss of sales. He's in it for the here and now, and a sale is a sale. Just because someone buys a full seperates system, for example, it doesn't mean that customer is going to come back any time in the future - if they're happy with their purchase, they'll stick with what they have.

 

[matt49]

That looks very nice and probably sounds even better Steve

Just goes to show how tastes vary. IMO it's utterly hideous.

 

[Zax89swe]

I hope they release a pair of active Bronze 2 (fully featured), I think I'm not alone about that?

 

[Um]

In an interview with Monitor Audio in a recent edition of a hifi magazine MA stated they had taken 'conventional' speaker design and drive units as far as they could and are contemplating entering the active speaker market as the benefits (over passive xovers) are obvious.

They are of course not the first ones to do so, neither will they be the last.

At the time I did wish Quad would have made a larger version of its 9La active speaker for domestic purposes, Perhaps an 11la or 12la but it didn't happen.

Hi Drummerman, hope you are well

Monitor Audio already make active speakers in the WS100's.

They have turned out to be the best audio purchase for me. I love the sound of these dinkly little things. quite brilliant value for money, excellent clarity and very tight bass. They cant hit incredibly high dbls,but with extremely clear speakers you dont have to. they are plenty loud enough to fill my room.

They also have a very unobtrusive and minimilst design.

As you can tell i'm a fan of these. Little class d amp's. low power consumtion, excellent sound quality, no boom, wireless.

I think they would be wise to give their bronze range a go as active wireless designs.