How To (Potentially) Save £1500+ In One Evening!

[ESP2009]

Friday evening just gone I took something of a leap of faith. I invited a stranger into our home - someone I had spoken to only on the ‘net. Nope, not internet dating (or worse) so I was not expecting a stunning blonde to turn up on my doorstep after the OH had gone out! And, no, I didn't fall prey to the Hi-Fi Serial Killer.
Alan is a member of another forum; he lives locally and offered to come over to see what he could do to improve my listening experience, having 40+ years of experience himself. Well, what the heck! I agreed.

I was listening to Jacques Loussier's jazz-based interpretations of Bach when Alan arrived. Although not a great fan of jazz, I enjoy these adaptations and they sound really good on my system. However, Alan is unfamiliar with the work, so we switched to a disc he had brought along: Jennifer Warnes' The Hunter. Which, incidentally, on the strength of our listening session, I have now ordered from Play.com.

Alan's first response to the sound of my system was: "It sounds very nice, but it's a bit too laid back and polite - no bite" and then "Where's the bass? There's no bottom end!" Er, it's right there - I can definitely detect bass - what am I missing? Well, no, it wasn't there apparently. Alan suggested that I toe-in the Spendors more. I have had them toed-in a little, so they don't fire straight down the room, maybe at a 5° angle from straight. With a touch of trepidation on my part we soon had them angled in at what looks to be more like 30° away from straight. Suddenly, there was greater weight to Jennifer's voice - a better sense of presence and also of depth to the overall sound. Now that's interesting! I just hadn't realised how thin certain aspects of the music were...and just how caution can hold you back. Already the evening was bearing fruit.

Next on the agenda were my power cables. With the relatively short time available to us, it wasn't going to be possible to swap cables in and out (my system would have to be dismantled to achieve this). So Alan took the next option: he took the plugs apart! With the traditional, intake of breath of technicians the world over, he explained that there were improvements to be made (uh-oh, at what cost?!?) Surprisingly, it was a free upgrade: out came the Brasso (and some Deox-it) and the plug connections received a thorough clean; and then he replaced the 13amp Atlas fuses (discarded with contempt) with some very clean and shiny 10 amp equivalents (SEM?) The system was switched back on and - hey presto! - it was as though a veil had been lifted that, again, I had not previously noticed. The whole sound was somehow lifted and clearer. OK, so not a night and day change, but certainly a noticeable improvement. Which reminds me - I must clean the speaker connections next.

Finally, those interconnects. Yes, Alan is a believer and has spent money, a lot more money than I would consider, on various interconnects. £500+ on cable?! Ouch! With time running out before I had to go out and be sociable with the OH and some of our friends, we hooked up a pair of KCI Silkworm RCAs in parallel with the cheap Van Damme XLRs I am currently using. There seemed to be a touch more detail and three-dimensionality to the sound stage, but I am not completely prepared to swear to this. Of the changes made, this seemed to have the least impact. Bangs for you buckwise - very, very uneconomical. So, for now the Van Dammes continue to rule the roost.

Sadly, since we tinkered with my system, I have not had a chance to listen to it properly. However, based on what we achieved on Friday evening, it is possible to argue that the changes we made have taken away some of that closed-in and slightly dull and unimpressive low-end sound. So maybe I needn't spend £1500 or more on a new pair of speakers after all? Perhaps these tweaks have addressed my misgivings and vague feeling of dissatisfaction or wanderlust?

Nah, fat chance! I'm still off to Audio Affair on Saturday for another speaker demo! []

 

[idc]

An interesting story ESP. I firmly believe now, that of upgrades/changes you should do

1 - room acoustics/speaker placement is the most important and best value of all, by miles.

2 - volume control. Very difficult to do as you can't buy aftermarket volume controls to replace the dreadful ones that inhabit many an amp/pre-amp. But that is where attenuation comes in and getting a better range of volume allows you to find the sweet spot of dynamics and bass and overall cality over a greater volume range.

You should do 1 and 2 before you embark on anything else.

3 - speakers. Blind testing shows that speakers make by far the biggest difference to any hifi.

4 - vibration control. Decent stands, particularly for speakers which dampen vibration. Again that helps with bass and dynamics in particular.

 

[scene]

Very interesting and just goes to show how pretty simple tweaks can improve a system's experience. I must admit, I've never thought of actually cleaning my mains plugs - but now I'll have to add it to the list - it makes sense.

Also +1 on idc's comments. Of course, 2 - volume control, is quite often a bit of a non-starter for most of us. But the rest are relatively easy, though I would put 4 - vibration control, before replacing the speakers.

In these straitened times, what my grandmother used to say rings particularly true, make the most of what you've got. And if simply toeing in your speakers and cleaning some plugs can improve the quality of your music, and your enjoyment, it's a no-brainer.

I remember commenting on this before on the forums and saying that I'd find it interesting to have WHF to have a piece on "tweaking a reader" - where they send people out to a reader's house and see how they can improve the sound (and vision) performance of said reader's existing system without replacing it - the sort of thing that ESP2009 has just had done. I think it would help us understand and appreciate our systems more.

 

[The_Lhc]

scene:Very interesting and just goes to show how pretty simple tweaks can improve a system's experience. I must admit, I've never thought of actually cleaning my mains plugs - but now I'll have to add it to the list - it makes sense.

But he also replaced the fuses (with lower power ones!), so there's no way of telling which actually made the most difference.

 

[scene]

the_lhc:scene:Very interesting and just goes to show how pretty simple tweaks can improve a system's experience. I must admit, I've never thought of actually cleaning my mains plugs - but now I'll have to add it to the list - it makes sense.

But he also replaced the fuses (with lower power ones!), so there's no way of telling which actually made the most difference.
Good point.

Maybe our furry friend would be prepared to don the latex gloves and restore the 13A fuses, to see what impact they have?

 

[chebby]

ESP2009:Alan suggested that I toe-in the Spendors more. I have had them toed-in a little, so they don't fire straight down the room, maybe at a 5ø angle from straight. With a touch of trepidation on my part we soon had them angled in at what looks to be more like 30ø away from straight. Suddenly, there was greater weight to Jennifer's voice - a better sense of presence and also of depth to the overall sound. Now that's interesting! I just hadn't realised how thin certain aspects of the music were...and just how caution can hold you back. Already the evening was bearing fruit.

They should be 'toed in' to the extent that the two axis cross in front of where you listen from...

Spendor S3E manual. (pdf)

Brasso'ing mains plug pins is a tweak I first saw suggested back in the early 1980s. Make sure all residue is cleaned off thoroughly afterwards. Use a clean piece of kitchen roll after the polishing to remove the Brasso from the pins and keep going until every last hint of black is gone and the kitchen roll is white after cleaning. (You do not want that residue getting into the socket connections.)

If you don't have 'fancy' mains cables then you might find investing in MK ToughPlugs worthwhile. (Similar MK plugs come as standard on all Naim gear.)

Get (at least) the amp off that Tacima. I have binned my Tacima recently and the system sounds much better.

 

[ESP2009]

chebby:

ESP2009:Alan suggested that I toe-in the Spendors more. I have had them toed-in a little, so they don't fire straight down the room, maybe at a 5ø angle from straight. With a touch of trepidation on my part we soon had them angled in at what looks to be more like 30ø away from straight. Suddenly, there was greater weight to Jennifer's voice - a better sense of presence and also of depth to the overall sound. Now that's interesting! I just hadn't realised how thin certain aspects of the music were...and just how caution can hold you back. Already the evening was bearing fruit.

They should be 'toed in' to the extent that the two axis cross in front of where you listen from...

Spendor S3E manual. (pdf)

Brasso'ing mains plug pins is a tweak I first saw suggested back in the early 1980s. Make sure all residue is cleaned off thoroughly afterwards. Use a clean piece of kitchen roll after the polishing to remove the Brasso from the pins and keep going until every last hint of black is gone and the kitchen roll is white after cleaning. (You do not want that residue getting into the socket connections.)

If you don't have 'fancy' mains cables then you might find investing in MK ToughPlugs worthwhile. (Similar MK plugs come as standard on all Naim gear.)

Get (at least) the amp off that Tacima. I have binned my Tacima recently and the system sounds much better.

Chebby, as ever, you make good points. Mind you, I have to admit that when I looked at the S3e manual first I thought the diagrams were exaggerated.

The amp is plugged back into the Tacima at present - previously, as per other threads, it had been kept separate. regarding this and the fuses - I will experiment at my leisure. Wearing full CSI PPE, naturally!

 

[Sorreltiger]

I moved my speakers back 3 or 4 inches closer to the wall the other day and everything sounds quite different. You are right in saying that this is an amazingly important factor in setting up a system and, I suppose, in selecting speakers in the first place.

 

[mitch65]

ESP2009:chebby:

ESP2009:Alan suggested that I toe-in the Spendors more. I have had them toed-in a little, so they don't fire straight down the room, maybe at a 5ø angle from straight. With a touch of trepidation on my part we soon had them angled in at what looks to be more like 30ø away from straight. Suddenly, there was greater weight to Jennifer's voice - a better sense of presence and also of depth to the overall sound. Now that's interesting! I just hadn't realised how thin certain aspects of the music were...and just how caution can hold you back. Already the evening was bearing fruit.

They should be 'toed in' to the extent that the two axis cross in front of where you listen from...

Spendor S3E manual. (pdf)

Brasso'ing mains plug pins is a tweak I first saw suggested back in the early 1980s. Make sure all residue is cleaned off thoroughly afterwards. Use a clean piece of kitchen roll after the polishing to remove the Brasso from the pins and keep going until every last hint of black is gone and the kitchen roll is white after cleaning. (You do not want that residue getting into the socket connections.)

If you don't have 'fancy' mains cables then you might find investing in MK ToughPlugs worthwhile. (Similar MK plugs come as standard on all Naim gear.)

Get (at least) the amp off that Tacima. I have binned my Tacima recently and the system sounds much better.

Chebby, as ever, you make good points. Mind you, I have to admit that when I looked at the S3e manual first I thought the diagrams were exaggerated.

Me too, I've been a little bit lazy with my Spendors so I'm going to give the 'big toe in' a go later

 

[ESP2009]

mitch65:ESP2009:chebby:

ESP2009:Alan suggested that I toe-in the Spendors more. I have had them toed-in a little, so they don't fire straight down the room, maybe at a 5ø angle from straight. With a touch of trepidation on my part we soon had them angled in at what looks to be more like 30ø away from straight. Suddenly, there was greater weight to Jennifer's voice - a better sense of presence and also of depth to the overall sound. Now that's interesting! I just hadn't realised how thin certain aspects of the music were...and just how caution can hold you back. Already the evening was bearing fruit.

They should be 'toed in' to the extent that the two axis cross in front of where you listen from...

Spendor S3E manual. (pdf)

Brasso'ing mains plug pins is a tweak I first saw suggested back in the early 1980s. Make sure all residue is cleaned off thoroughly afterwards. Use a clean piece of kitchen roll after the polishing to remove the Brasso from the pins and keep going until every last hint of black is gone and the kitchen roll is white after cleaning. (You do not want that residue getting into the socket connections.)

If you don't have 'fancy' mains cables then you might find investing in MK ToughPlugs worthwhile. (Similar MK plugs come as standard on all Naim gear.)

Get (at least) the amp off that Tacima. I have binned my Tacima recently and the system sounds much better.

Chebby, as ever, you make good points. Mind you, I have to admit that when I looked at the S3e manual first I thought the diagrams were exaggerated.

Me too, I've been a little bit lazy with my Spendors so I'm going to give the 'big toe in' a go later

We await your report...

 

[drummerman]

Good thread. Who says a little elbow grease doesn't reap rewards.

Personally, the only thing I'm anal about is the positioning of the speakers/stands. I have carpeted lounge. Stand spikes tend to come loose with time and it takes me ages to level the damn things so the way I do it now is ... speaker off the stands. Stands in both hands, move up a foot ... slamm down. Rock solid. Or so I thought. When a friends little darlings came over (I was at work) the Wii came out and one speaker was moved. Not happy.

Apart from that, I should renew/expose new cable ends, clean all the contacts, do the on/off test with the tacima I meant to do for the last two months, listen to Kef's, check out the new Denon Micro and and and ... little time and to be honest, I just enjoy listening to music as it is.

 

[Pete Shields]

One big system booster for me was to get my ears syringed.....cheapest upgrade ever

 

[Anonymous]

Forgive me for being negative, but that procedure is only sensible as a last resort to clear wax as it's damaging to some degree.

 

[drummerman]

... and if you already have a system that seems 'bright' it could make matters worse ...

 

[john1000000boy]

scene:Very interesting and just goes to show how pretty simple tweaks can improve a system's experience. I must admit, I've never thought of actually cleaning my mains plugs - but now I'll have to add it to the list - it makes sense.
Also +1 on idc's comments. Of course, 2 - volume control, is quite often a bit of a non-starter for most of us. But the rest are relatively easy, though I would put 4 - vibration control, before replacing the speakers.
In these straitened times, what my grandmother used to say rings particularly true, make the most of what you've got. And if simply toeing in your speakers and cleaning some plugs can improve the quality of your music, and your enjoyment, it's a no-brainer.
I remember commenting on this before on the forums and saying that I'd find it interesting to have WHF to have a piece on "tweaking a reader" - where they send people out to a reader's house and see how they can improve the sound (and vision) performance of said reader's existing system without replacing it - the sort of thing that ESP2009 has just had done. I think it would help us understand and appreciate our systems more.

 

[ESP2009]

john1000000boy:

scene:Very interesting and just goes to show how pretty simple tweaks can improve a system's experience. I must admit, I've never thought of actually cleaning my mains plugs - but now I'll have to add it to the list - it makes sense.
Also +1 on idc's comments. Of course, 2 - volume control, is quite often a bit of a non-starter for most of us. But the rest are relatively easy, though I would put 4 - vibration control, before replacing the speakers.
In these straitened times, what my grandmother used to say rings particularly true, make the most of what you've got. And if simply toeing in your speakers and cleaning some plugs can improve the quality of your music, and your enjoyment, it's a no-brainer.
I remember commenting on this before on the forums and saying that I'd find it interesting to have WHF to have a piece on "tweaking a reader" - where they send people out to a reader's house and see how they can improve the sound (and vision) performance of said reader's existing system without replacing it - the sort of thing that ESP2009 has just had done. I think it would help us understand and appreciate our systems more.

Not a bad idea at all. There's many a forum reader out here who could do with a little guidance. Years ago, a very nice man from WHF came round to my place and entertained us with a selection of speakers. Ah, memories - I had to cancel a dentist appointment because we overran our time!

Times have changed, but surely it's worth a thought - maybe not a full van-load of separates, but maybe a selection of accessories and actual application of hints and tips by those more experienced than we are.

 

[chebby]

ESP2009:Years ago, a very nice man from WHF came round to my place and entertained us with a selection of speakers.

Sooo, let me get this right, Andrew & Clare* (for example) pull up outside the lucky reader's house in the WHF Transit and bring in a selection of choice review samples and do a sort of hifi version of a Tupperware evening punctuated with great sounds, witty banter and bon mots? (Who does the catering?)

*Knowing my luck i'd get JD with his old kitchen speakers and a guitar!

 

[scene]

chebby:
ESP2009:Years ago, a very nice man from WHF came round to my place and entertained us with a selection of speakers.

Sooo, let me get this right, Andrew & Clare* (for example) pull up outside the lucky reader's house in the WHF Transit and bring in a selection of choice review samples and do a sort of hifi version of a Tupperware evening punctuated with great sounds, witty banter and bon mots?

More thinking of them turning up with the SPL, brasso, blu-tak and a tape measure. The bon mots and witty banter would be de rigeur.
(Who does the catering?)
Probably Pizza Hut or Dominoes

*Knowing my luck i'd get JD with his old kitchen speakers and a guitar!

LOL

 

[ESP2009]

I reckon we got ourselves a new TV series...

 

[scene]

ESP2009:I reckon we got ourselves a new TV series...

The "What Hi*Fi Show", coming soon to Channel 5

 

[chebby]

And Brasso could be voted the 2011 WHFS&V Readers Award winner.

 

[ESP2009]

scene:ESP2009:I reckon we got ourselves a new TV series...

The "What Hi*Fi Show", coming soon to Channel 5

That or Bravo or maybe Dave.

 

[Anonymous]

chebby:And Brasso could be voted the 2011 WHFS&V Readers Award winner.

That's the most sensible thing I've heard all day. If you don't think the Brasso has made sonic improvements, fear not, you can polish your fender instead.

 

[John Duncan]

chebby:Knowing my luck i'd get JD with his old kitchen speakers

Hey! They were DB1+s for a while...

 

[scene]

ESP2009:
scene:ESP2009:I reckon we got ourselves a new TV series...

The "What Hi*Fi Show", coming soon to Channel 5

That or Bravo or maybe Dave.

or YouTube