DENON VL12

[audioaddict]

Just found this on the web, and wondered if many had come across it. Being a direct drive fan and 1200 owner i,m obviusly quite partial to this type of deck as i feel theyre value for money, build quality and better sound than most people expect make them good hifi tables. It says that its not a hanpin model and looks very well built. From a proper hifi company like denon it might actually sound very good.

Have also read some people using the reloop 7000 and stanton st150s as hifi decks too. I,m sure theyres quite a few guys on here that are fans of these.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Just found this on the web, and wondered if many had come across it. Being a direct drive fan and 1200 owner i,m obviusly quite partial to this type of deck as i feel theyre value for money, build quality and better sound than most people expect make them good hifi tables. It says that its not a hanpin model and looks very well built. From a proper hifi company like denon it might actually sound very good.

Have also read some people using the reloop 7000 and stanton st150s as hifi decks too. I,m sure theyres quite a few guys on here that are fans of these.

Here's my 2p's worth:

I'm generally the first to knock these DJ inspired decks. However, when it comes down to basics they do what all other decks do, they spin a record at a set speed and can produce "hi-fi" quality sound. The only place where they fail is under closer inspection - generally QC issues. Put any of these up against a similarly priced turntable from Rega, Project, et al, and they don't perform as well as their "hi-fi" counterparts. As a note the PLX1000 is a re-boxed Reloop 7000, it would appear that the Denon is based on the Numark design, possibly the TT250.

Yes, they can do hi-fi, it all depends on what your definition of hi-fi sound is.

 

[audioaddict]

yeah do have to agree doug although just lately i do seem to be reading on various forums there are quite a few bel drive owners who are having qc issues, noisy motors etc. And also agree/know that all the decks are the same underneath just rebadged. On amazon reviews, a guy bought an audiotechnica lp1240 and said it sounded every bit as good as his carbon esprit debut. I guess its all swings and roundabouts.

 

[audioaddict]

I still think it comes down to preference of dd or belt drive and cant be that much difference in sound quality. Its been years since i had a belt drive though i do remember it sounded very fluid open and airy but also remember the build was so light weight and maybe thats what puts me off the modern belt drive decks. They do look smart mind you. I think i will pop into sevenoaks in norwich and richer sounds and try and listen to one or belts and see what i find .

 

[Deleted member 108165]

yeah do have to agree doug although just lately i do seem to be reading on various forums there are quite a few bel drive owners who are having qc issues, noisy motors etc. And also agree/know that all the decks are the same underneath just rebadged. On amazon reviews, a guy bought an audiotechnica lp1240 and said it sounded every bit as good as his carbon esprit debut. I guess its all swings and roundabouts.

The foibles of turntable ownership my friend *biggrin* (Marantz doesn't suffer from noise issues, thank god, and neither did the Pioneer or the Pro-ject before that). One thing you need to keep in mind is that these DJ inspired decks generally come without a cartridge, which can be a mixed blessing. Fitted with an equivalent level Ortofon this turns the LP1240 into a c£600 machine, making it £175 dearer than the Project.

I have friends who own the AT and have listened to some of their rips... they're very good. Swings and roundabouts it certainly is *smile*

 

[Deleted member 108165]

I still think it comes down to preference of dd or belt drive and cant be that much difference in sound quality. Its been years since i had a belt drive though i do remember it sounded very fluid open and airy but also remember the build was so light weight and maybe thats what puts me off the modern belt drive decks. They do look smart mind you. I think i will pop into sevenoaks in norwich and richer sounds and try and listen to one or belts and see what i find .

Personally, I adore the looks of the direct-drives and the principle of their engineering. The problem seems to be is that whilst there are plenty of belt-drives throughout the vast spectrum of prices the same can't be said of direct-drives. From the Chinese produced decks there is then a large gap to the next step on the ladder - the Technics 1200G at £3K, or maybe the VPI Classic Direct at a cool £27.5K *shok*

Nowt like a good listen to broaden your spectrum... Let us know how you get on *good*

 

[Al ears]

yeah do have to agree doug although just lately i do seem to be reading on various forums there are quite a few bel drive owners who are having qc issues, noisy motors etc. And also agree/know that all the decks are the same underneath just rebadged. On amazon reviews, a guy bought an audiotechnica lp1240 and said it sounded every bit as good as his carbon esprit debut. I guess its all swings and roundabouts.

The foibles of turntable ownership my friend *biggrin* (Marantz doesn't suffer from noise issues, thank god, and neither did the Pioneer or the Pro-ject before that). One thing you need to keep in mind is that these DJ inspired decks generally come without a cartridge, which can be a mixed blessing. Fitted with an equivalent level Ortofon this turns the LP1240 into a c£600 machine, making it £175 dearer than the Project.

I have friends who own the AT and have listened to some of their rips... they're very good. Swings and roundabouts it certainly is *smile*

I think you'll find there are a couple of Brinkmann turntables in that gap (well around £4 - £8k anyway) ;-)

However, rather limited below the price of the Technics.

 

[audioaddict]

yes i think its a shame as al said the design principles and my opinion the build quality (for the most part is superb) and its shame that the more established hifi brands didnt at least have a go at implementing a more affordable direct drive system. I,m glad i do own a technics sl1200 as i hope they are a cut above the hanpin models and give most belt drives up to 1k a good run for their money in some departments, but look back to the 70s and 80s and the major brands then , technics pioneer sony all had both designs in their catalogues. Why are they now so exclusive to the so called dj decks ?

 

[Al ears]

yes i think its a shame as al said the design principles and my opinion the build quality (for the most part is superb) and its shame that the more established hifi brands didnt at least have a go at implementing a more affordable direct drive system. I,m glad i do own a technics sl1200 as i hope they are a cut above the hanpin models and give most belt drives up to 1k a good run for their money in some departments, but look back to the 70s and 80s and the major brands then , technics pioneer sony all had both designs in their catalogues. Why are they now so exclusive to the so called dj decks ?

They aren't. Only the cheap Hanpin ones are referred to as such since they attempt to copy the 1200 which was (erroniously) referred to as a DJ deck in the past. Anyway the majority of so-called decks came as pairs.

More expensive makes are purely for the 'audiophile'.

 

[audioaddict]

When i said exclusive al i meant in the lower price bracket under 500 quid...which seem to be the hanpins...not exclusive in hifi full stop

 

[audioaddict]

I probably dont even mean exclusive . It just seems direct drives are more readily available and affordable in the form of the hanpins rather than in the form of more affordable so called audiophile turntables which is a shame...i think thats more of what i meant.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

When you look at the new 1200G there's an awful lot of R&D gone into the new design and this costs money. Turntables are a small market, audiophile turntables are a niche market. If one wants quality then you have to spend more cash for bespoke tech. I guess Hanpin and the like get away with cheapness as they are using very old technology in their decks, and inferior tonearms. Just my opinions *smile*

 

[Al ears]

When you look at the new 1200G there's an awful lot of R&D gone into the new design and this costs money. Turntables are a small market, audiophile turntables are a niche market. If one wants quality then you have to spend more cash for bespoke tech. I guess Hanpin and the like get away with cheapness as they are using very old technology in their decks, and inferior tonearms. Just my opinions *smile*

Quite so. I would like to see how many new Hanpins are still going in years to come like the original 1200's are doing now.

Ultimately you get what you pay for and, if you are only spending Hanpin type money, then I'd recommend you stick to a tried and trusted belt-drive.

 

[audioaddict]

Interestingly enough i saw an at lp5 with a rega arm on an auction site recently. I still think theres always going to be an argument for direct and belt drives.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Interestingly enough i saw an at lp5 with a rega arm on an auction site recently. I still think theres always going to be an argument for direct and belt drives.

No argument from me as I'm firmly in both camps. If both designs are executed correctly then they will be an ideal disc spinner.

 

[audioaddict]

well said mate