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Cable lifters

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insider9

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2016
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lindsayt said:
Pedro said:
Mark Rose-Smith said:
Cable dressing is taken very seriously on the naim forum for those who have the higher end gear...300-500 series stuff.
 

And?
Well there's your answer then. Whatever the general consensus on the Naim forum is, do the opposite for best results. It's a guiding principle that has never let me down. So far.

 

 

Whenever I see lifted cables I think "Trip Hazard!!"
Excellent advice. Thank you, Lindsay.
 

Gazzip

New member
Jan 15, 2011
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Al ears said:
insider9 said:
Pedro said:
You're joking, right?
Seriously, I'm reading about it.

Apparently most beneficial on carpet with possibility of static.
If you're that concerned go wireless... :)
...and introduce two conversion stages by going wireless? No ta.

Why are the benefits of cable lifting so unbelievable to everybody who has posted so far? With the exception of DDC has anybody who has posted actually tried it/ DBX-ed it?

FYI I am not a cable lifter, but I am interested in how/why you have formulated your views.
 

andyjm

New member
Jul 20, 2012
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In the spirit of balance, worth pointing out that suspending cables in free air will alter their capacitance from cable to ground, and any vibration on the cable will result in a change in resitance.

Both of these effects will be measurable, tiny and inaudible.
 

Andrewjvt

New member
Jun 18, 2014
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andyjm said:
In the spirit of balance, worth pointing out that suspending cables in free air will alter their capacitance from cable to ground, and any vibration on the cable will result in a change in resitance. 

Both of these effects will be measurable, tiny and inaudible. 
However measurable
It will not be able to be heard and is just another way for shameless greedy sales people to extract money from already osd audiophile obsessed personality.

Did you see that video of the indulgence show if that guy playing music from the power conditioners
He came across so dodgy
And I could see he never even believed the bs that sprouted from his mouth.
 

Gazzip

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Wow. You guys crack me up. You bang on about ABX testing being the panacea of truth, and then disparage these ideas and products without having even tried them. You have zero point of reference. Nada. Zip. Nothing. Talk about the blind trying to lead the blind! Hilarious.
 

insider9

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2016
787
341
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Gazzip said:
Wow. You guys crack me up. You bang on about ABX testing being the panacea of truth, and then disparage these ideas and products without having even tried them. You have zero point of reference. Nada. Zip. Nothing. Talk about the blind trying to lead the blind! Hilarious.
Like with anything I'd be prepared to try it but would like to know the principles behind why it's supposed to work. I don't see this an expensive upgrade if upgrade at all.

Do know what it's supposed to do, please Gazzip?
 

insider9

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2016
787
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andyjm said:
In the spirit of balance, worth pointing out that suspending cables in free air will alter their capacitance from cable to ground, and any vibration on the cable will result in a change in resitance. 

Both of these effects will be measurable, tiny and inaudible. 
Interesting, thanks Andy!
 

Gazzip

New member
Jan 15, 2011
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insider9 said:
Gazzip said:
Wow. You guys crack me up. You bang on about ABX testing being the panacea of truth, and then disparage these ideas and products without having even tried them. You have zero point of reference. Nada. Zip. Nothing. Talk about the blind trying to lead the blind! Hilarious.
Like with anything I'd be prepared to try it but would like to know the principles behind why it's supposed to work. I don't see this an expensive upgrade if upgrade at all.

Do know what it's supposed to do, please Gazzip?
I suspect it is supposed to do what andyjm suggested.
 

Gazzip

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Jan 15, 2011
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I have seen people doing this for years. The cheapest version I have seen used is old style clothes pegs. These cost pennies.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Elliott-Beech-Wood-Dolly-Pegs/dp/B005838JMK
 

andyjm

New member
Jul 20, 2012
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Gazzip said:
Wow. You guys crack me up. You bang on about ABX testing being the panacea of truth, and then disparage these ideas and products without having even tried them. You have zero point of reference. Nada. Zip. Nothing. Talk about the blind trying to lead the blind! Hilarious.
Gazzip,

There is an old story about a guy who goes to a doctor, who examines him for 3 minutes, writes a prescription and then charges him £500. "I'm not paying you £500 for 3 minutes work", says the patient, "No" says the doctor, "You are paying me for 30 years experience".

Many of us on here have been at this for a while. Lets say there is a product which involves wearing a pair of special blue socks to improve the sound quality of your system. Most would dismiss that (rightly) as nonsense.

If you have been designing and using audio equipment for 30 years, then experience and knowledge would suggest that putting speaker cables on little supports is no different to putting on a pair of blue socks.

Now there is always the possibility of a 'Black Swan' event, but in this case, I am willing to bet my experience and knowledge that this isn't one of them.
 

insider9

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2016
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341
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All of a sudden it doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. I don't suppose these lifters will cost a lot (probably wrong).

In a hobby where we obsess about every detail I guess doing these tiny things may accumulate to something worthwhile. It is one of the last bits I'd go for but ill have to give it a try now :)
 

Gazzip

New member
Jan 15, 2011
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andyjm said:
Gazzip said:
Wow. You guys crack me up. You bang on about ABX testing being the panacea of truth, and then disparage these ideas and products without having even tried them. You have zero point of reference. Nada. Zip. Nothing. Talk about the blind trying to lead the blind! Hilarious.
Gazzip,

There is an old story about a guy who goes to a doctor, who examines him for 3 minutes, writes a prescription and then charges him £500. "I'm not paying you £500 for 3 minutes work", says the patient, "No" says the doctor, "You are paying me for 30 years experience".

Many of us on here have been at this for a while. Lets say there is a product which involves wearing a pair of special blue socks to improve the sound quality of your system. Most would dismiss that (rightly) as nonsense.

If you have been designing and using audio equipment for 30 years, then experience and knowledge would suggest that putting speaker cables on little supports is no different to putting on a pair of blue socks.

Now there is always the possibility of a 'Black Swan' event, but in this case, I am willing to bet my experience and knowledge that this isn't one of them.
This is something you can try at home in 5 minutes for £2 with some science to back it up. Why wouldn’t you give it a whirl and find out for yourself?
 

Andrewjvt

New member
Jun 18, 2014
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insider9 said:
All of a sudden it doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. I don't suppose these lifters will cost a lot (probably wrong).

In a hobby where we obsess about every detail I guess doing these tiny things may accumulate to something worthwhile. It is one of the last bits I'd go for but ill have to give it a try now :)
The word obsessing about these things

Show someone a really good quality system and they ask what purifier are you using?
What power lead are you using?
What cables are you using?
What standard oh no. The sound is not right. Now I've added all these things and oh wow now it sounds good. This is proof that it works or that my brain is now relaxed.
Like someone taking a sugar pill to feel well.

Then go over to a friend's house and hear how wonderful and clear it sounds now that you not obsessing anymore and it's just a sonus that is wireless.

People need these gimmicks to relax and I don't have a problem with that but I detest the slimey salesman that exploits this obsession
 

insider9

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2016
787
341
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Andrewjvt said:
insider9 said:
All of a sudden it doesn't sound like a bad idea at all. I don't suppose these lifters will cost a lot (probably wrong).

In a hobby where we obsess about every detail I guess doing these tiny things may accumulate to something worthwhile. It is one of the last bits I'd go for but ill have to give it a try now :)
The word obsessing about these things

Show someone a really good quality system and they ask what purifier are you using?
What power lead are you using?
What cables are you using?
What standard oh no. The sound is not right. Now I've added all these things and oh wow now it sounds good. This is proof that it works or that my brain is now relaxed.
Like someone taking a sugar pill to feel well.

Then go over to a friend's house and hear how wonderful and clear it sounds now that you not obsessing anymore and it's just a sinus that is wireless.

People need these gimmicks to relax and I don't have a problem with that but I detest the slimey salesman that exploits this obsession
I'd agree on some points but if the changes are measurable then it's different. And considering low cost not really that difficult to do.

I'm not trying to change room acoustics with it, got room treatment for that.

But if there's something cheap with a bit of science behind it, I'll go for it.

Of course I will make up my own mind about the results once I've tried it.
 

Andrewjvt

New member
Jun 18, 2014
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The problem in trying all this crap is it feeds the obsession and paronia.

Once you have it, it's hard to rehabilitate.

Resist the urge and enjoy the actual music and not the hardware
 

insider9

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2016
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I appreciate it Andrew. I've tried fancy speaker cables, interconnects even power cables. I've measured whatever I could, I assessed them, etc. including a blind test.

I'm still using cheap but functional stuff. If I will be able to tell difference apart with a small cost it will be worth it. If not no harm, no foil. I'm skeptical by nature. So unless I can justify the cost for a marked difference I won't be using it.

But it doesn't stop me trying stuff out and creating my own conclusions :)
 

ellisdj

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Dec 11, 2008
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With no offence intended there are people on this forum that have been at it for 30 years and yet dont know anything about room acoustics, sound in a room, measuring freq response et al.

So time is no indicator of anything in terms of knowing everything. I can appreciate there was a time of green pens all sorts of stuff. That would likely turn anyone into an extreme cynic but that wouldn't stop me pushing for better in every way shape and form possible.
 

Andrewjvt

New member
Jun 18, 2014
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insider9 said:
I appreciate it Andrew. I've tried fancy speaker cables, interconnects even power cables. I've measured whatever I could, I assessed them, etc. including a blind test.

I'm still using cheap but functional stuff. If I will be able to tell difference apart with a small cost it will be worth it. If not no harm, no foil. I'm skeptical by nature. So unless I can justify the cost for a marked difference I won't be using it.

But it doesn't stop me trying stuff out and creating my own conclusions :)
I actually wrote my last response not aimed at you but in general
 

Electro

Well-known member
Mar 30, 2011
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Oldphrt

New member
Oct 21, 2016
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insider9 said:
Just been looking at a pic of someone's system and they're using what I now know are called "Cable Lifters"

For those like me who didn't know are little bits of support that keep cables of the floor. The guy has a serious system worth circa £15k cables not included.

I know it wasn't done for cosmetic reasons so I'll ask you this. What sonic improvements would one expect from these? How are they suppose to work?
Do you honestly need to ask?
 

ellisdj

New member
Dec 11, 2008
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Electro said:
Andrewjvt said:
The problem in trying all this crap is it feeds the obsession and paronia.

Once you have it, it's hard to rehabilitate.

Resist the urge and enjoy the actual music and not the hardware
Well said ! *good*

Saying that I have recently bought one of these 1.8m x 1.2m beasties and hung it on my ceiling.

http://www.rpgeurope.com/products/product/arc.html

And these .

http://www.rpgeurope.com/products/product/bad.html

 
Electro how do these proper panels compare to your very much diy ones ;)
 

lindsayt

New member
Apr 8, 2011
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andyjm said:
In the spirit of balance, worth pointing out that suspending cables in free air will alter their capacitance from cable to ground, and any vibration on the cable will result in a change in resitance.

Both of these effects will be measurable, tiny and inaudible.
Measurable with what equipment?

My digital multimeter wouldn't be able to measure it.

I'm not convinced it would be measurable, even with the finest measuring equipment.

It's the sort of thing where the slightest difference in the connection to the measuring terminals would make more difference than the cable lifting.
 

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