Gazzip
Well-known member
Al ears
Well-known member
nopiano said:
Psst: Irony alert. I am 54 years old. It actually makes me very angry when so many anti Brexit people say that Brexit won because of old bigots who will soon be dead. Why do people caicature those they disagree with. The truth is that most people who voted for and against Brexit did so for honourable reasons. Although I vited for Brexit, I am sure most anti Brexit people are honest and decent and voted for decent reasons. Why can't we respect people we disagree with? The truth is that no-one knows what will happen, the way we voted was based on imperfect information, and we all voted for what we believed was the right choice. To caricature the Brexit voters as anti European racists who want to return to 1950 is deeply offensive. Is that so,heard to understand?
Gazzip
Well-known member
Leif said:
Most Brexit voters I saw interviewed before and since the vote didn't seem to realise that our borders aren't actually open, and thought that Brexit would somehow prevent Daesh from reaching our shores. I am sorry to say that I don't think the stereotype of the racist Brexitier with one foot in a past which hasn't existed since 1920 is particularly inaccurate on the whole. Frankly I'm sick of people pussyfooting around saying that. As for imperfect information it was entirely fabricated on the one side and exaggerated on the other, and their is a big difference between these two types of imperfection.
Al ears
Well-known member
nopiano
Well-known member
I didn't detect the irony and hope to be around a few more years yet! More worried about failing hearing...
I agree with sadness about the polarisation over Brexit that has upset so many, however they voted.
I agree with sadness about the polarisation over Brexit that has upset so many, however they voted.
Gazzip
Well-known member
Vladimir said:
You are right Vladimir!
The Daesh Infidel - "Brutally punishing of unfamiliar material, this mid range power chord from Daesh sits just below their Paradise range. Lacking any real dynamism, but with far too much attack, this cable has a tendency to cut off the upper end completely. A hopelessly outdated design which will destroy any classical material you may have in your collection. Avoid with your life.".
Al ears
Well-known member
Gazzip said:
Yours views do make me angry. There is a tendency of the BBC to portray Brexit voters falsely. Everyone I know who voted Brexit did so on the basis of sovereignty, a desire not to become a province of a European superstate. Nothing to do with racism, or other base views. Incidentally I've heard pro EU people say they liked the nice white Christian European immigrants, but not the brown Muslim non European ones. A minority view among pro EU people I am sure. I suspect you like to portray pro Brexit voters in an offensive manner to make yourself feel morally superior, or at least to make those you disagree with look distasteful. The truth is that it was not a black and white issue. Decent people voted on both sides, for good reasons, not base ones. Anti Brexit prople lied, they said there would be mayhem immediately after a Brexit vote, there wasn't. The Bank of England said it would be a disaster. Carney has since said we should be able to thrive. Mervyn King has said we should be fine. Quite an about turn. Both sides stretched the truth.
Gazzip
Well-known member
Leif said:
The 52% have spoken and don't want the status quo retained. Fine, let's change it then, but let's not drive our economy off a fecking cliff in the process. I think it is the negligent disregard of what Brexit might actually cost our country, our people and our way of life, which really pisses most remainers off. A BS we will work it out as we go along attitude is the reserve of heroes and/or the terminally thick. The kind of people who act on instinct, weigh up the risks and achieve great things on the one hand, and the kind of people who die every winter on Ben Nevis wearing only T-Shirts and jeans on the other. I am more of a risk assessment kinda guy myself, as I believe should be those who govern us. Unfortunately the current lot appear to be packing their jeans and T-Shirts and heading on up to Fort William...
Leif said:
I am a strong Remainer and haven't insulted, or made sweeping generalizations about Leave voters. The general breakdown of who voted leave and why, is public knowledge....but it may not cover every eventuality.
I am very cynical about the whole Soverignty issue....not least because the 6 out of 10 rules being made in Brussels was a lie. We Govern ourselves, with minimal interference from the EU, though they are responsible for protecting workers, consumers, travellors and the environment. There are also the rules that we need to comply with when selling into the EU, which are there for our safety and will have to be complied with if selling to them, when outside.
Ironically, we will also find, that FTAs are all about sacrificing bits of soverignty, to get what we want...eg. lowering our food safety standards to do Trade with the US, or giving extra Visas to India to trade with them.
The Remain side used exageration and bullying, but the Leave campaign was completely founded on lies (some of which were absolute whoppers).
When Osbourne announced the Punishment Budget, he at least was in Government and could have implemented it, if he hadn't been fired.
Gisela Stuart, the chairman of the Leave campaign, has now come out and said that the Referendum was a mistake and should never have happened - as there was no accountability and no means to implement the ludicrous promises. She has now left politics.
The predictions made by the Remain side are now coming true, they just brought them forward as part of the exaggeration and bullying campaign.
Our GDP is now below that of Greece; inflation has risen above wage growth, which has caused consumer spending to slow and since our economy is heavily relient on consumer spending, this is serious; consumer debt is rising to unsustainable levels and foreign investment has been drastically cut back due to the uncertainty; many of the large financial institutions are scoping new headquarters and moving staff into the EU...as financial centres in other EU countries, are making tempting offeres to lure them away. This is very worrying due to the contributions of the financial sector
This doesn't even get into the issues of the Irish Border and its implications, as well as the problems of not being in EURATOM or Open Skies.....and all with a Govt that hasn't the majority to get its way in Parliament.
We couldn't have been forced into further federalization, as we had opt outs and vetos....so no going into the Euro, no EU army and no bailing out other EU nations.
I am very happy to debate the issue in a grown up fashion, but don't want to derail this thread...so if you want further discussion, we can have it here (if not, no harm done): https://www.whathifi.com/forum/topic-and-miscellaneous/strapped-if-youre-out-there
QuestForThe13thNote said:
That is why I linked to a thread which is more suitable, if further discussion is wanted....as I know how this will go.
Gazzip
Well-known member
Al ears
Well-known member
CnoEvil said:
Yes,..... and no..
I do, however, think cable threads are more humerous to read. The political discusions can all s+d off to another forum as far as I am concerned.
Opinions are like assholes, everyone has got one but this isn't the place to discuss them.
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