Blu Rays - Sub-standard releases

[admin_exported]

It is very frustrating that films released in the UK (region b) have the audio changed. Whats the point of spending loads of money, due to the film industry (blu rays, and now 3-D), only for them to short change us on the actual benefits on Blu Ray. I expect the same with 3D, with the US users getting the benefit.

Recently Gamer in the US is 7.1 DTS, however the version available here is only 5.1, I understand the demand for 7.1 maybe limited outside of the US, however there is still a huge demand for avid home cinema individuals across this region. Why can the publisher not provide a limited number of region b 7.1 audio versions, (maybe at a slightly higher price) to allow the customer the choice.

I spent a large amount of money to ensure my system is 7.1, mainly to be future proof, with the provision that studios will be releasing blu-rays with good audio. There is also no consistency between releases as some films such as Saw V are 7.1 region b...

I have read reviews that Gamer 7.1 DTS is reference quality, and I find it surprising that customers like myself in the UK are limited to lower quality 5.1 versions

What can we do?

 

[Frank Harvey]

I know it's extra expense, but you could pick up an American Bluray player so you then have the choice of any release you prefer. The Orphanage was released in 5.1 in this country, and 7.1 in the US. Pan's Labyrinth was even worse - Dolby Digital in this country, DTS-MA in the US (if I recall correctly).

 

[Anonymous]

I'm aware but we shouldn't have to when the industry should fully support the technology they expect us consumers to buy.

It's also a point of value for money, I'll pay for example up to £20 for a 5.1 version, when a 7.1 version is available.would you buy a car with 3 wheels? No exactly, we are getting rip off -ed in the UK.

I've got Black hawk down, Jumper, Leon, Old Boy, A couple of SAW films, Dragon Tiger Gate, Fearless, Rambo and some others in 7.1 DTS...simply blows the 5.1 versions out of the water! I had to pay almost double for each version, and they are all from different countries.

 

[Tonya]

Consider yourself lucky in the UK that the only difference is 5.1 versus 7.1 !!
As Scandinavia is considered a small market, all the DVD & BluRay releases here are Euoropeanly (is that a word?) sanatized.
A quick look on the back cover of most of the discs available here contain subtitles in up to twelve different languages as the same version of the disc is designed to be for sale in all those countries.
Problem is that one thing that is perfectly acceptable in one country may be clipped away to conform to censorship in another territory.
If the same version is available in, say, twelve countries, then all the twelve film censorship boards enforce their own cutlist, which are all gathered up and sent back to the company that is commisioning the disc run.
All the cuts are then performed and the poor editor has to somehow try and reassemble the film without too many obvious chops in sound and picture.
The financial advantage is huge as only one version has to be produced for all the relevant countries and only the artwork and packaging has to be changed locally.

Even then, some countries (such as Norway) will allow any amount of sexual imagary but come down hard on gratuitous violence, so much so that even some of the 007 movies had their post production soundtracks remixed to make the fight scenes less realistic (less impact on punches for example) before getting released here.

Some re-releases of old films do occasionally get reclassified, one instance being The Exorcist, the original release had all references to the Ouiji board removed as they are forbidden in Norway.

I'll check out our Gamer release later today and let you know which soundtrack we are blessed with!

As far as "what can we do", I suggest going online to find the version that you want and order accordingly.

 

[Peter Larsen]

Not all movies benefit from 7.1, but ex. My Bloody Valentine was released in scandinavia with 7.1 on blu-ray. Its not any more difficult for the author to make 7.1 DTS-HD or Dolby True audio tracks. It comes down to what is delivered to the authoring studio.

 

[Anonymous]

Thats a major problem, and I do feel very sorry for you, as your losing the expected expereince with the films. Apart from the language we are all in region B so you can get the versions the film companies intended to be globablly released without the censorship boards changing the content. Just expect to pay more for delivery from the UK, Zavvi.co.uk, and amazon.co.uk do have cheap shipping options.

At least you can view the films as intended by the studios.

I've already done the research for your country. Gamer published by Noble Entertainment, only 5.1, eitherway let me know what you find.

What makes me more angry is that I can illegally download a pirated US 7.1 blu ray from the internet, hopefully I shouldn't have to! I won't do it...

 

[nads]

so it was Norways fault.

been picking up a few disc for 99sek all with DTS HD 5.1 sound tracks recently.

Might have to get hurt locker sent over as i cant find it and it was sold out when i was back in the UK.

 

[Oldboy]

This is something that has annoyed me for some time as i also have a 7.1 system with bluray. There are some studio's that release ALL their movies region free and therefore you can import from the US without needing a US bluray player but the extra cost is ridiculous for a US disc with prices starting at £20 and an average cost of about £25 just to import exactly the same disc/movie but with a 7.1 soundtrack and i too can't help feeling a little cheated when you know the studios are releasing an inferior product here in the UK.

I would definately agree that they should release perhaps a limited number of discs with the option of the full 7.1 soundtrack for a slightly higher price but really there is little to no chance of that happening as the studios simply won't make enough money from a limited run of a discs that carry nothing extra other than a 7.1 soundtrack, the only way things may change is if 7.1 becomes more popular here in blighty.

It would seem for now our only choice is to import discs and/or players from different regions which in itself is extremley expensive and you can't help feeling ripped off when that is your only choice!

Perhaps it's time to start complaining to the makers of these blurays that we are getting small changed? I'm guessing it will take a large ammount of complaints for them to take any notice though

 

[Anonymous]

I'm with you old boy (hopefully you haven't lived the life of that guy in the film...LOL)....I do the same. BVA are on the case, and I have been writing to Lake Shore and Lionsgate.

Something has to change, I'm also going to make FACT aware, as they are forcing people like me to go down dodgy alternatives to get 7.1 versions.

Forget 3D as they don't support Blu ray fully...I may have to go back to VHS...at least I know where I'm at.

 

[Oldboy]

LOL! No i haven't lived the life of the movie although often when living in the UK it can feel like you are being imprisoned against your will...

If you have started writing then i will do the same, you are right something has to change! That's a good idea about contacting FACT i'm just not sure how much the subject will interest them? Perhaps there was a missed opportunity when the bluray format was being finalised, surely the current conundrum could have been avoided if the standard for HD sound had been better laid out in the first place? I beleive the current standard is that a disc needs only carry a Dolby True HD 5.1 or PCM 5.1 to be classified as having HD sound so perhaps thats where the blame should lie??

As for VHS....great argument, makes you wonder how it all got this complicated!

 

[Frank Harvey]

I have a copy of Se7en on it's way from Holland because their version is 2.35:1 1080p, whereas the current Canadian one is 1.85:1 1080i.

Looking forward to that one!!

 

[Anonymous]

LOL...its worth a shot with FACT. Hopefully with more pressure some can be done...

What is What Hifi stance? They are advocators of future technology so it would intresting to see if they can apply pressure.

Maybe although blu ray is all about high quality video and audio, only blu ray discs have the space to carry the extra channels....

I'll update this thread on any advancements

 

[Tonya]

Just checked the cover of Gamer (Scandinavian release) which simply states DTS Master Audio.
By the way, is the film worth picking up, or . . . . ?

 

[Clare Newsome]

We raise it at every opportunity with the studios and distributors - for example, last year we took EIV to task about its 1080i releases; that had a successful outcome.

I know we've got a cross-industry meet due with studios, manufacturers etc, so it'll get pushed again then.

However, so much of this comes down to plain old economics: European disc distributors maximise their costs by producing the same discs across as many countries as possible, which means sacrificing some bandwidth-hungry HD audio extras (ie those two extra channels; sometimes a superior mix/choice of HD options) so they can fit in all the other language versions. No such problem with the US release - which is often handled by a different distributor anyhow.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks Clare that makes sense, however only very few distributors are EU wide, nearly all cater for their own county. Either way US and UK speak English (correct me if I'm wrong LOL) so we should get the same version. I understand this is about money, but we should be given the option to buy a 7.1 version at a higher price. Entertainment in Video disturbed Gamer in the UK, so they should have kept the same audio version

Please let me know if you get any response during your meetings.

 

[Anonymous]

Its not a great film, although its quite fun if you enjoy playing FPS on consoles.

 

[Big Aura]

does it actually cost the distributor more to encode the full spec version of a film, especially if they're doing it for one geographic zone already?

 

[Tonya]

Good point Clare, but then again that's what dual layer BD is supposed to be for!
I understand that the soundtracks that are dubbed can't all be in HD audio but I think it's a shame that the original language soundtrack isn't always afforded the luxury of full HD sonics.
On a slightly different tangent, seeing I've got my "complaining hat" on, I think it's a worrying trend that instead of the FBI warnings on European releases of both DVD & BD, where the fast forward controls are disabled, more and more companies are selling that as ad space so you have no option to scan or advance through this rubbish.

I would have thought it would be in the film companies interest to offer the "ultimate quality" release to purchasers of the disc format (1080p + 7.1 when available) and sell more units before the title eventually hits HD subscription channels?
If not, what's the point of collecting the film in the first place when it will be stored on your Sky HD anyway a few months after?

Methinks it's the wrong time for film companies to get complacent about their product and target group.

As the eminent Mr.Lucas quite rightly states, "the audience IS listening!"

Finally, I'd like to point out that this damn "complaining hat" is too tight, grrrrrrr!

 

[Anonymous]

Only if the encode pushs the blu ray disc beyond 25 Gbs storage capacity. The standard cheaper Blu ray disc is 25 GB, and adding 2 extra channels of sound shouldn't push the requirment to use 50Gb disc. Although adding 2 extra channels of sound should warrent this push to a larger capacity blu ray.

Eitherway we pay a lot of money for Blu rays, and its time that we get the same standard as the US users. Why should we even bother...?

 

[Anonymous]

7.1 surround sound? I only have 2 speakers that I listen to music through, and have linked to my TV. Sounds peachy enough to me. Why would you want 7 of the things?

 

[Anonymous]

LOL...LOL If you ever get the chance to hear LTJ Bukem Planet Earth in DTS ES, give it a go. You have never heard anything like it, it feels like you sitting in a studio, with different instruments in 7 places around you....complete musical experience.

It gives you the best surround you can get when watching films and playing games.

You do know its 2010...LOL

 

[Clare Newsome]

ajutley:
Thanks Clare that makes sense, however only very few distributors are EU wide, nearly all cater for their own county. Either way US and UK speak English (correct me if I'm wrong LOL) so we should get the same version. I understand this is about money, but we should be given the option to buy a 7.1 version at a higher price. Entertainment in Video disturbed Gamer in the UK, so they should have kept the same audio version

Please let me know if you get any response during your meetings.

Sadly, it's not that simple. As mentioned, often it's a completely different distributor in UK to US, plus there are frequently issues of different film-edits between the two (the US cuts out the sex, we cut the violence

)

And re cost of different encodes; yes, there's an extra cost for that, PLUS extra costs incurred for each different mastering of a disc - the less versions of a disc a distributor has to create, the greater their profit. Hence so many Blu-rays/DVDs when the first screen you see asks you what country you're in - from then on in, you get your version of the film.

Incidentally re 7.1 mixes - really enjoyed the DIrector's Cut Blu-ray of Dark City over the weekend, complete with incredibly involving 7.1 DTS MA HD soundtrack

 

[Anonymous]

Hopefully if we can get the audio sorted the rest may follow one day. Dark City is my next purchase! Its the whole experience HD sound I'm after...

 

[Oldboy]

Any chance we can swap ideas on the best 7.1 discs out there for purchase in the UK and US? Would be great to see if there are any 7.1 discs i may have missed!

 

[Clare Newsome]

Why not start a new thread on exactly that topic? Sure it'd be a popular one