amp current....

[admin_exported]

is there any way to determine what it is from the manufacturers specs? it appears that many of the more expensive stereo amps, well, lets say £700 and up often only have 45-50watts of power but apparently have more current?

take the naim nait 5i, 50 watts, list price of £770 and apparently able to drive relatively demanding speakers, like dynaudios, b&w's,etc. but no mention of current in the specs..

take a £300 yamaha as-500, rated at 85 watts, no mention of current in the specs either, which one has more?

what about a nad c326bee? similar money to the yam, rated at 50 watts but said to be able to drive demanding speakers, but again no mention of current in the specs?

is there some formula to apply that gives the current? how does one know whats actually more capable with demanding loads? is it only by trying them that one can find out? and why would an amp with a lower watt rating than another not have as much current? as is seemingly often the case?

ta...

 

[Sizzers]

A bit of light, late night reading for you here Max .

 

[raff]

Of course there are formula's. Volts x amps = Watts. And amps squared x R = watts.

So in fact there is no reason to quote current if the amp can drive a load of say 4 ohms with a power of 50 watts. It can be calculated. Use formula and you get 3.5 amps...

Is that what you are asking?

Let me just add, that I know that a lot of HiFi reviewers talk about amplifiers that can supply high currents - good psu etc. Well if the amplifier is specified to drive low impedance loads then the power supply will have to be designed to supply high currents. Particularly important if the speakers have low impedance dips at certain frequencies then you don't want the power supply struggling. So, to answer your question, why isn't the current specified, its because if the lowest impedance load is specified the current is implicit

 

[Anonymous]

hi raff..

what im basically trying to find out is if one can deduce from the specs of a given amplifier whether or not its likely to satisfactorily drive demanding speakers, like 4ohm dynaudios for example?

i had a look at the link sizzers kindly put up but to me its just like a foreign language, im not at all clued in to this technical side of things..

 

[Anonymous]

My B&W concept 90 speaker manual states that one possible measure of amplifier power is to compare the power into 8ohms and the power into 4 ohms. The closer this is to 0.5 the better.

This seems plausible as when I did the calculation for a few well known amps, the 'better' ones did best (about 0.6)

Phil

 

[Sizzers]

Was only having a joke with you Max. Don't understand it either! lol

 

[Anonymous]

i wonder guys.. could anyone try to apply their formulas to a few amps?

yamaha as-500

naim nait 5i

nad c326bee

roksan kandy k2

id love to know how each one would stack up, on paper?

ta...

 

[Anonymous]

Sizzers:Was only having a joke with you Max. Don't understand it either! lolyou had me wondering just what it is you do for a living there sizzers, perhaps a scientist

. it was kinda techy...

 

[SteveR750]

Max, I read as amp current, amp passed...

 

[tyranniux42]

That article makes me realise I actually learned something on my degree haha! good reading, although from the brief look I had at it, I couldnt quite figure its target audience. If its for people who arent electronics biased, then it doesnt go into too much explanation of why things are the way they are, and if its aimed at people who know a thing or two, it seems sort of pointless, as they will know most of this already... anywhooo just my .02

back onto the original thread topic, I can tell you that my Nait xs drives my B&W's much more easily than using 2 Cambridge audio amps in passive Bi-amp configuration, and the step up from a single amp to using 2 was a good margin. Then again the XS was 5 times the cost of one CA amp so I would hope it was that much better!

regards

Dan

 

[Anonymous]

SteveR750:Max, I read as amp current, amp passed...

you've lost me there steve.. congrats on the job btw

 

[plastic penguin]

maxflinn:

is there any way to determine what it is from the manufacturers specs? it appears that many of the more expensive stereo amps, well, lets say £700 and up often only have 45-50watts of power but apparently have more current?

take the naim nait 5i, 50 watts, list price of £770 and apparently able to drive relatively demanding speakers, like dynaudios, b&w's,etc. but no mention of current in the specs..

take a £300 yamaha as-500, rated at 85 watts, no mention of current in the specs either, which one has more?

what about a nad c326bee? similar money to the yam, rated at 50 watts but said to be able to drive demanding speakers, but again no mention of current in the specs?

is there some formula to apply that gives the current? how does one know whats actually more capable with demanding loads? is it only by trying them that one can find out? and why would an amp with a lower watt rating than another not have as much current? as is seemingly often the case?

ta...

Where's Rick and David when you need them?

 

[Anonymous]

or mr miles, or mr field

 

[plastic penguin]

maxflinn:or mr miles, or mr field

Max, are you having doubts about how the Yam is driving the Dyns?

 

[Anonymous]

plastic penguin:
maxflinn:or mr miles, or mr field

Max, are you having doubts about how the Yam is driving the Dyns?

no no, not at all pp, if i was i would say so, the yamaha is more than good enough for these speakers imo..

where im coming from is that it seems a given amongst many on here that certain speakers need high current, and most reccomend amps that tend to be more on the expensive side to provide it, im just trying to get a handle on why more expensive amps apparently have what the budget ones (my own aside) dont in that respect.

and if there is indeed a formula that can be applied to specs to give an indication of the ability of an amp to drive demanding loads id like to see how it pans out on amps of varying price/power etc

 

[plastic penguin]

maxflinn:plastic penguin:

maxflinn:or mr miles, or mr field

Max, are you having doubts about how the Yam is driving the Dyns?

no no, not at all pp, if i was i would say so, the yamaha is more than good enough for these speakers imo..

where im coming from is that it seems a given amongst many on here that certain speakers need high current, and most reccomend amps that tend to be more on the expensive side to provide it, im just trying to get a handle on why more expensive amps apparently have what the budget ones (my own aside) dont in that respect.

and if there is indeed a formula that can be applied to specs to give an indication of the ability of an amp to drive demanding loads id like to see how it pans out on amps of varying price/power etc

Understand where you're coming from. However, I firmly believe that we can all (including myself) get too tied up with technicalities, when what is more important, is how an amp, CDP, speakers etc. fits into your own environment.

For example I could buy a pair of ATCs with my old 40 watt Arcam and live with it happily for years. If you listen to music at wall-shaking levels and/or have a large room then current is important. Otherwise, it's a stat that should be confined to the manual. Nothing more nothing less....

 

[Anonymous]

agreed pp, everything is relative, im sure if i got to hear my speakers with a naim xs or something similarly exotic id probably have less mass on my yammy, but that wont be happening, im over the moon with what ive got, its plenty good enough for me in my room..

id still love to know whats what currentwise between budget and more pricier amps though, im on a mission

 

[plastic penguin]

maxflinn:

agreed pp, everything is relative, im sure if i got to hear my speakers with a naim xs or something similarly exotic id probably have less mass on my yammy, but that wont be happening, im over the moon with what ive got, its plenty good enough for me in my room..

id still love to know whats what currentwise between budget and more pricier amps though, im on a mission

"I'm on a mission" to what?

 

[grdunn123]

Max,an amp or receiver which can supply a high sustained current allows it to cope with sudden transients such as a piece of classical music which goes from a single violin solo to a whole orchestra crescendo or a blu ray in full HD surround sound where a sudden series of loud explosions or the like occurs. The higher the sustained current the better the amp's ability to cope with sudden lows/highs

 

[chebby]

Remember that - in the case of Dave and Rick - they are dealers. Nice guys, no doubt of it, but they are here to sell stuff and if they can sow just a little, itsy-bitsy bit of insecurity about something (like the amount of current needed to drive your speakers) then they will.

It will gnaw away at your confidence in what you are actually hearing little by little until one day you will wake up, look at your Yamaha with contempt and hiss... "you call yourself a real amp with your tone controls? You don't even have a toroidal power supply!" ...and come on here and start asking about Naim and ATC amps.

Then they have you.... "Oh yes, the Nait XS/ATC integrated will be fine but you will only find true bliss with a seperate pre and power amp."

Then they tell you about 'seperate power supplies' and your world shrinks to obsessing about something with a name like a HICAP or NICNAC or somesuch and you find you have lost all your friends and your money and your family think you are mad.

Stop the madness here Max. Be happy. At least let the speakers run-in and enjoy what you have before they take away your sanity. (Ok possibly a bit late on that one

)

 

[SteveR750]

chebby:
Remember that - in the case of Dave and Rick - they are dealers. Nice guys, no doubt of it, but they are here to sell stuff and if they can sow just a little, itsy-bitsy bit of insecurity about something (like the amount of current needed to drive your speakers) then they will.

It will gnaw away at your confidence in what you are actually hearing little by little until one day you will wake up, look at your Yamaha with contempt and hiss... "you call yourself a real amp with your tone controls? You don't even have a toroidal power supply!" ...and come on here and start asking about Naim and ATC amps.

Then they have you.... "Oh yes, the Nait XS/ATC integrated will be fine but you will only find true bliss with a seperate pre and power amp."

Then they tell you about 'seperate power supplies' and your world shrinks to obsessing about something with a name like a HICAP or NICNAC or somesuch and you find you have lost all your friends and your money and your family think you are mad.

Stop the madness here Max. Be happy. At least let the speakers run-in and enjoy what you have before they take away your sanity. (Ok possibly a bit late on that one

)

Good point Chebby, and it's not just the retailers, the manufacturers are even worse....

maxflinn: you've lost me there steve.. congrats on the job btw

as in current (now) and passed ( sometime previously) sorry, random I know.

and thanks

 

[Anonymous]

lordy lord

..

i love this yam dyn combo, ive no intention of changing whatsoever..

rick assured me that it works a treat, that the yammy has ample power to drive the dyns, and i completely, unreservedly, agree with him, music has never sounded so good, its fantastic, its perfect for me, its all i expected it to be and more, now i hope thats clear

what id like to ascertain is why many others think that 4ohm speakers, like mine, need expensive amplification? and why an expensive amp should/would.could.is.or may be better? the budget amps dont know how much they cost, why should some of them at least, as is the case with mine, not be perfectly adequate for 4ohm speakers?

and can any indication of the potential for a budget amp to drive 4ohm speakers be found from its specifications?

i think thats all

 

[chebby]

By the way Max.

Do you have the impedance switch on the back of the Yamaha set correctly?...

http://www.yamaha.com/YECDealerMedia/adgraphs/products/as500rear.jpg

There is a selector for 4 ohm and 8 ohm (your Dynaudios are 4 ohm.)

Only flick the switch after powering off.

 

[Anonymous]

chebby:
By the way Max.

Do you have the impedance switch on the back of the Yamaha set correctly?...

http://www.yamaha.com/YECDealerMedia/adgraphs/products/as500rear.jpg

There is a selector for 4 ohm and 8 ohm (your Dynaudios are 4 ohm.)

Only flick the switch after powering off.

yup, cheers chebby

 

[plastic penguin]

maxflinn:

lordy lord

..

i love this yam dyn combo, ive no intention of changing whatsoever..

rick assured me that it works a treat, that the yammy has ample power to drive the dyns, and i completely, unreservedly, agree with him, music has never sounded so good, its fantastic, its perfect for me, its all i expected it to be and more, now i hope thats clear

what id like to ascertain is why many others think that 4ohm speakers, like mine, need expensive amplification? and why an expensive amp should/would.could.is.or may be better? the budget amps dont know how much they cost, why should some of them at least, as is the case with mine, not be perfectly adequate for 4ohm speakers?

and can any indication of the potential for a budget amp to drive 4ohm speakers be found from its specifications?

i think thats all

I'm with Chebby on this, not out of spite you understand. It seems strange you use words and phrases such as "Rick assured me it works a treat..." Never mind what Rick says, what did your ears tell you? Does Rick know your living room and/or acoustics?