Adding stereo amp to Home Cinema setup.

[Caliscotsman]

(Is there not a sub forum for amplification?)

Anyway, I'm thinking of integrating a new stereo amp into my home cinema setup and to do this efficiently it seems I need an amp with a unity gain input.

Is anyone familiar with this and how to determine which amps may have it? Thinking of spending @ 1500 or so.

Cheers

 

[Al ears]

(Is there not a sub forum for amplification?)

Anyway, I'm thinking of integrating a new stereo amp into my home cinema setup and to do this efficiently it seems I need an amp with a unity gain input.

Is anyone familiar with this and how to determine which amps may have it? Thinking of spending @ 1500 or so.

Cheers

Can you amplify on exactly what you're current system is? Also 1500 what?

 

[Caliscotsman]

Currently using a Denon AVR-X2000 into KEF floorstanders and KEF egg satellites.

I'm considering a stereo amp in the $1500-$2000+ region. Considering Musical Fidelity, Audiolab, Arcam, Cyrus.

 

[Lost Angeles]

Why do you want to do this?

 

[Caliscotsman]

So that my stereo listening is via a higher quality amp mainly but it should also benefit my movie listening.

 

[Al ears]

So that my stereo listening is via a higher quality amp mainly but it should also benefit my movie listening.

This sort of setup can easily be done incorrectly and ends up detrimental. It might be easier on your budget cot keep the systems separate.

 

[Caliscotsman]

I have considered a seperate listening room just for stereo but this is why I'm researching the idea...

Or even just keep the receiver and stereo amp seperate and switch between them depending on what I'm listening to. I do like the speakers.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Marantz pm8005 has pre outs you can drive the front left & rights with the marantz and then the AV will do the rest of the speakers

 

[Caliscotsman]

Thanks..I'll check that out.

 

[Leeps]

Cambridge 851A - although it doesn't have a conventional HT bypass input, you can set the gain on a selected input to balance it with the other speakers from your AV receiver. Just a slightly different method of achieving the same result.

Roksan K3

Rega Elicit r (the Elex r and Brio r don't have HT bypass)

Wyred4Sound mINT (Mini Integrated).

I think some of the higher end Rotels have this facility too.

 

[Andrewjvt]

Most amps have them so you can wire up the stereo anp to the front speakers for music and also connect to the av amp for movies using the ht pass pass. Im considering doing this also

 

[Vaprak001]

...with my Onkyo 1010, via P3000 Pre into two M5000 Power amps for front left and right. The effect has been very pleasing, allowing good stereo listening and relieving some of the amplification duties of the 1010 for a more powerful overall surround sound. The obvious drawback is that this has been a very expensive way of doing things. My 1010 (and I assume your x2000) are quite capable of decent stereo on their own so to gain significant enough improvements with your budget it may be worth considering either selling the denon and going the 2.1 route with a very good stereo amp or getting an AV amp further up the range with better stereo capabilities (Marantz and Arcam seem to have good reputations for this). Just a thought.

 

[Esra]

As long as sources are connected to your AVR or integrated in your AVR (radio/DLNA/spotify etc.) and using AVR´s preamp and dac section i don´t see much benefit for the outlay just for amps.This won´t change much.

Better upgrade your AVR or go for something like an Audiolab CDQ/NAD m51(which has also HDMI in/out)/+amps where the CDQ/NAD is acting like a switch passing through audio signals from your AVR from pre-out.Connect all stereo sources to the "switch" and let AVR stay off when stereo listening.But I guess this would require more than 1500 if you don´t buy 2nd hand.That would be the most elegant way.

Other than that you can choose a integrated amp of your likes and connect AVR signals from pre-outs to a input of the new amp and mark volume position for surround sound if you don´t have a digital display for volume like with some Arcam and Creek amps.Then you can adjust your other AVR settings to the front speakers as reference.You still can use the new amp like described further above for stereo listening but have to reset volume for surround sound.This would be much cheaper but takes compromise with the volume settings and overall surround sound as you are now using the pre section of your new amp for the front signals from your AVR and not a pass through.

I think only few integrated amps are able to seperate pre section from the amp section by a switch for AV pass through.Some NAD amps can do this.

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

Naim inegrated amps also have av pass through,well the xs does so i'm assuming the xs2 and supernait would also have this feature.

 

[Lost Angeles]

Other than that you can choose a integrated amp of your likes and connect AVR signals from pre-outs to a input of the new amp and mark volume position for surround sound if you don´t have a digital display for volume like with some Arcam and Creek amps.

I used to do this with my Caspian when I had an Onkyo for surround sound, The Caspian was set at 10 o'clock for surround, you just had to remember to adjust it before using on HiFi. The Caspian (integrated) acts as a power amp in this situation for the front speakers. I have seperated my systems since.

 

[Leeps]

Esra makes an interesting point. Only those amps specifically with an HT bypass facility change that particular input to a power amp only.

So although it's certainly possible to hook up the pre-outs from your AVR to any integrated amp and mark or remember the volume (or choose to set the volume as per the Cambridge 851A), if the stereo amp doesn't have HT bypass (most don't), then you're using two pre-amps in the chain when playing multi-channel sources. I have no idea how that affects sound in practice; in theory it could be detrimental.

So I go back to my previous list of amps that have HT bypass that change that input to a power amp:

Roksan K3

Rega Elicit R

Wyred4Sound mINT

and previously forgot to mention the Marantz PM8005

Another way of doing it that can remain reasonably discreet is having a sub/sat package for surround duties and a completely separate stereo system in the same room. Much depends on how you intend to use your sources and how many sources you have as to whether this is practical or not. But it needn't look as if your front room is rivalling a Richer Sounds shop. Personally I actually prefer sub/sat packages for surround duties anyway (if they're decent ones). I like the extra zip they can add to steering effects.

My Apex A10 speakers have excellent surround performance and are very small, so can be wall-mounted. And even on their stands they still look very discreet, so my room could easily swallow an extra set of traditional stereo speakers too. I've seen one or two people's systems on the forum look like this.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Two pre-amps in the signal path isn't a problem in itself - you already have two pre-amps between your source and subwoofer...care just needs to be taken setting up correctly.

The main thing to consider is exactly what you're looking to improve. Adding a high quality stereo amplifier will improve the quality you will get from your left and right speakers. This can be a massive improvement for music listening, though will only be a partial improvement for movie viewing, although if this is secondary or occasional to music, it won't be an issue. The left and right speakers usually deal with music, left/right effects, and back up the centre when there's a lot going on, so these aspects will be improved. Care is needed if the AV receiver is vastly different in quality to the stereo amplifier being used, as the centre will be using the AV receiver's pre-amp so it's quality isn't changing at all. The centre channel is probably outputting more sound than the rest of the speakers put together, so it is this channel that it the most important.

If you're into older movies that are only in stereo, or mono where the single channel has been shared by the front left and right (2.0), and you are the type of person who listens to these movies in their native audio, then these movies will greatly improved!

Adding dedicated power amps will improve power delivery and control - general quality won't be improved as you're still being held back by the pre-amp section.

 

[Esra]

The cheapest solution to OP seems to be the NAD 326Bee(Main in) besides the Marantz PM8005(Direct in).Both are pretty capable integrated amps.I would have a closer look at the 326bee and try at home if it delivers what you are looking for.

 

[Andrewjvt]

Two pre-amps in the signal path isn't a problem in itself - you already have two pre-amps between your source and subwoofer...care just needs to be taken setting up correctly.

The main thing to consider is exactly what you're looking to improve. Adding a high quality stereo amplifier will improve the quality you will get from your left and right speakers. This can be a massive improvement for music listening, though will only be a partial improvement for movie viewing, although if this is secondary or occasional to music, it won't be an issue. The left and right speakers usually deal with music, left/right effects, and back up the centre when there's a lot going on, so these aspects will be improved. Care is needed if the AV receiver is vastly different in quality to the stereo amplifier being used, as the centre will be using the AV receiver's pre-amp so it's quality isn't changing at all. The centre channel is probably outputting more sound than the rest of the speakers put together, so it is this channel that it the most important.?

If you're into older movies that are only in stereo, or mono where the single channel has been shared by the front left and right (2.0), and you are the type of person who listens to these movies in their native audio, then these movies will greatly improved!?

Adding dedicated power amps will improve power delivery and control - general quality won't be improved as you're still being held back by the pre-amp section.

Ive been thinking about what youve mentioned. Is there an av amp that you can assign 2 channels to bi amp the center speaker to 'match or compete' with the superior stereo amp acting as power amp using the ht bypass.

I actually raised this question on another post but dont think the members understood but the point tou made is exactly what i was getting at as the surround speakers wont be as important in my opinion but just the center.

 

[Caliscotsman]

Thank you all...