A question to Cyrus amp users...

[Gray]

Cyrus has these very specific hidden terminals.

That's the BFA for you, a type of touchproof terminal. In fairness to Cyrus, there's not much room to use anything else.

Your problem remains a bit of a mystery though.

 

[Vladimir]

Give them all a good clean with isopropyl alcohol and tooth brush with the unit fully unplugged from mains. Should be as good as new.

Yeah. But just looked with a pocket lamp and after some reconnecting they seem to be clean...maybe you're right, I'll try this out. Now still there is a significant sound difference. By upper giving me fatigue after a few minutes , with lower it sounds simply right.

Ideally you want these cleaned with KONTAKT PRF and a brush. It evaporates without leaving residue. It's widely available in Germany I think.

Yes I have a kontakt spray...I thought about it too.

Great. As long as it has no oil in it. Thats for potentiometers and switches with low current. Speaker terminals are high energy and oily residue may create short circuit or even fire.

Just a general warning this.

 

[Vladimir]

Cyrus has these very specific hidden terminals.

That's the BFA for you, a type of touchproof terminal. In fairness to Cyrus, there's not much room to use anything else.

Your problem remains a bit of a mystery though.

Many ppl are staggered what improvement in clarity a new cable upgrade makes. The real upgrade sometimes actually is cleaning an oxidized connection by swapping the cables.

 

[stereoman]

Guys but I really believe it's not a problem with dirt etc. I think it might be a slight internal wiring bias ? Cyrus is no High End and has a bit of a faulty product history ( though Cyrus products sound great of course ). In this case Cyrus claims that both sets are always equal but actually in mine they are not. There is a slight sound difference and it would be ok if the upper terminals served a different but not worse sound. I'm listening to the same track all over again. With lower giving me no fatigue and upper definitive sound worse. I mean it sounds like the upper terminals cut off slightly certain frequency in my case...anyone who has a Cyrus amp please try out and see yourselves whether it makes a difference or it is just my problem.

To Vladimir - my Kontakt leaves a tiny film (residue)...I do not think it might be suitable although it says it does not change the sound frequency after cleaning. I need to think it over...

 

[Vladimir]

When in doubt just use isopropyl alcohol. Don't use that spray.

 

[Gray]

Many ppl are staggered what improvement in clarity a new cable upgrade makes. The real upgrade sometimes actually is cleaning an oxidized connection by swapping the cables.

That's for sure. The removal of oxidization and other finger grease etc. contamination at the contact point will be giving the greater beneficial effect.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

I think they are in parallel and the nail has been hit on the head in this thread. It’s nothing to do with which is better but it’s probably to do with oxidation of the speaker wires and cyrus pins. How long since you last removed? What cables? And predominantly which sets of plugs are used? These will all give a clue to which sound better, and a better connection can of course give a better sound!

Cyrus can be high end depending on which units you use. On my cyrus Mono x200 Signature power amps there are two sets of speaker terminals and it makes not a jot of difference to sound quality as they too are in parallel I think. I just use the top set. I have deltron plugs soldered onto chord epic reference cable.

I know it’s recommended that you use proprietary cleaners, as stated in this thread, to get a good connection. It could also be that if you’ve used the bottom ones and left the top ones the pins of the cyrus amp might be oxidised such the connection isn’t as good. It’s hard to get at them as they are enclosed in a red and black plastic sheaf, if you have the same ones as mine. The 8vs2 is an older model amp and this makes me think even more that it’s to do with this, as a newer amp means less oxidation and less issue in these regards. It could also be that your speaker cable needs restripping. Are you too using the cyrus plugs with screw connectors? Wouldn’t recommend these, get some 4mm soldered bfa plugs or deltron plugs. Hope helps.

 

[stereoman]

I think they are in parallel and the nail has been hit on the head in this thread. It’s nothing to do with which is better but it’s probably to do with oxidation of the speaker wires and cyrus pins. How long since you last removed? What cables? And predominantly which sets of plugs are used? These will all give a clue to which sound better, and a better connection can of course give a better sound!

Cyrus can be high end depending on which units you use. On my cyrus Mono x200 Signature power amps there are two sets of speaker terminals and it makes not a jot of difference to sound quality as they too are in parallel I think. I just use the top set. I have deltron plugs soldered onto chord epic reference cable.

I know it’s recommended that you use proprietary cleaners, as stated in this thread, to get a good connection. It could also be that if you’ve used the bottom ones and left the top ones the pins of the cyrus amp might be oxidised such the connection isn’t as good. It’s hard to get at them as they are enclosed in a red and black plastic sheaf, if you have the same ones as mine. The 8vs2 is an older model amp and this makes me think even more that it’s to do with this, as a newer amp means less oxidation and less issue in these regards. It could also be that your speaker cable needs restripping. Are you too using the cyrus plugs with screw connectors? Wouldn’t recommend these, get some 4mm soldered bfa plugs or deltron plugs. Hope helps.

Hi thanks. To be honest, I use Hyper 2.0 that itself has already "Z" plugs which are Cyrus compatible. Comes with original terminations. So cable is 100% clean. Secondly, yes it might be oxidization on upper terminals...but to be honest I think they are gold plated or sth like that - seem to be clean. The bullets are grey and also seem fine. Maybe indeed dirt has got into the inner parts of the terminals.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

Yes I had atlas hyper with z plugs which I think have a serrated edge with gaps in the plug. I’d recommend using the deltron plugs with Cyrus or a 4mm cylindrical bannana plug without the serrations and gaps, if you know what I mean. That way the hole of the cyrus pin is fully covered -no gaps in serrations and in the z plug itself. Which could be useful as the pin might not get oxidised in situ with the gaps etc.

I like the Deltron plugs with Cyrus as they are like a 4mm cyclinder banana plug in a right angled connector, so no gaps and exposed parts of the cyrus pins. Also they prevent possible damage to the pins as like the cyrus plugs they have an outer plastic casing which fits within the plastic casing of the cyrus speaker terminals. If you inadvertently pull on your speaker wire with z plugs you could bend or damage the cyrus pins. With the deltron plugs this can’t happen with the casing. Similarly if you use a cylinder 4mm banana plug, like the z plug, you could similarly damage the pin.

also using a deltron plug or banana plug you’ll get more metal in contact with the cyrus pins. Could have a sq effect?

the pins on my amps are not gold plated but black, maybe coated or some type of metal?

if you do damage it, it’s a £300 repair service assuming cyrus do it, so could be expensive so something to possibly bear in mind. Hope helps. Cheers.

 

[drummerman]

Does it really matter unless you need both sets of terminals? - A pragmatics' view.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

Sometimes it is a bit alarming when something works differently on a hi Fi which you think could be a fault etc. I think just a case of pacifying concerns.

 

[stereoman]

Thanks to all. I think you're pretty right. It looks like oxidation of the upper terminal bullets and pins. Gave it a bit of a cleanup and it has smoothed the sound a bit...pretty "listenable" now in comparison to lower terminals.

 

[MajorFubar]

Let's hope Quest, drummerman and the Major have some info for solving this mystery.

Sadly not be because my old Cyrus only has one set of terminals. Surely they're just wired together though.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

Let's hope Quest, drummerman and the Major have some info for solving this mystery.

Sadly not be because my old Cyrus only has one set of terminals. Surely they're just wired together though.

yes in parallel I think.

 

[MajorFubar]

Shame that cleaning the sockets is such a faff, if that's all the problem has been. My Cyrus 2 uses good old fashioned banana sockets: easy as pie to clean with a cotton-bud and isopropyl.

 

[stereoman]

Shame that cleaning the sockets is such a faff, if that's all the problem has been. My Cyrus 2 uses good old fashioned banana sockets: easy as pie to clean with a cotton-bud and isopropyl.

Have no clue why they have mounted these BFA sockets on some models. Unpractical, make matters worse with looking for proper "Z" open banana plugs. Cyrus claims that BFA is safer - come on...how many audiophiles had problems with proper connection to speaker terminals and made short circuit. Is this not a bit of exaggeration ?

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

I don’t see the problem, you just get whoever makes your cables up to fit the correct plugs or do it yourself if you solder your own cables. If you fit a close knitting plug it will probably take the oxidation off if you fit it on and off a few times.

 

[Vladimir]

I've used WD40 on pots, switches and relays where absolutely nothing else worked. It was WD40 or dissasembling all of them, which wasn't going to happen. It's formula is harder on oxidization than regular specialty sprays and rejuvenates phenolic PCBs, doesn't harm graphite. However, you must clean it after with isopropyl alcohol or it gunks up as it accumulates dust.

Maybe you should try your kontakt spray, but clean all oily residue after with alcohol and tissue paper.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

I remember the guy from cyrus yesterday talking about the fact the caps have a limited life. How old is your unit?

 

[stereoman]

And it seems now that the culprit has been found. I have yesterday turned the amp over to take a look inside a bit - in general crystal clean...but wait a sec, what have I found ? On both sides slight electrolyte leaking has stained both circuit board printings symetrically ! Took out my freshly bought 96% Isopropyl out and gave it a clean so almost no leakage stains are left now - and sound came back to life , came back to what it should have been like. I wonder why these good caps (made for Audio) leaked a bit...I mean no so gross nasty gunk but it seems like a tiny leakage from two caps spread evenly alongside printings, dried and left this nasty residues (brown layers) but untouched anything else in surround. Nonetheless electrolyte touched anothers two small capacitors. So Cyrus 8 users you can check this out too, just in case - if your machines are spotless clean inside or some caps are playing up a bit.

 

[Vladimir]

And it seems now that the culprit has been found. I have yesterday turned the amp over to take a look inside a bit - in general crystal clean...but wait a sec, what have I found ? On both sides slight electrolyte leaking has stained both circuit board printings symetrically ! Took out my freshly bought 96% Isopropyl out and gave it a clean so almost no leakage stains are left now - and sound came back to life , came back to what it should have been like. I wonder why these good caps (made for Audio) leaked a bit...I mean no so gross nasty gunk but it seems like a tiny leakage from two caps spread evenly alongside printings, dried and left this nasty residues (brown layers) but untouched anything else in surround. Nonetheless electrolyte touched anothers two small capacitors. So Cyrus 8 users you can check this out too, just in case - if your machines are spotless clean inside or some caps are playing up a bit.

Are you certain it's electrolite and not old glue that's gone conductive? I'm thinking it's likely the former since it cleaned off with alcohol and no hard scraping. Glue doesn't come off that easy.

The caps will need to be replaced, otherwise the amp is technically faulty, might get worse. If I had an amp with leaky caps I would definitely NOT use it untill fixed.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

Yes you can follow the cyrus fixed service price, if you wanted to go down that route, but might be more than economic cost of the amp

 

[stereoman]

I remember the guy from cyrus yesterday talking about the fact the caps have a limited life. How old is your unit?

That would make sense - 8 up to 10 years old max. Sth like that. Does it sound like I should exchange them now ? Or simply leave as the leakage was not so huge...

 

[Vladimir]

I remember the guy from cyrus yesterday talking about the fact the caps have a limited life. How old is your unit?

That would make sense - 8 up to 10 years old max. Sth like that. Does it sound like I should exchange them now ? Or simply leave as the leakage was not so huge...

Amplifier caps leaking electrolyte is like your car leaking pistons and cogs. Doesn't get any worse. So it's important you address this issue and preferably not use the amp untill then.

As for longevity, it's the luck of the draw. Depends how close they were to a source of heat. Were they used too close to their max operating voltage, or just how that particular batch of caps came out in the manufacturing process.

 

[Gray]

...leaked electrolyte has been cleaned off of the PCB / tracks and the sound has come back to normal.

But what about the fact that one set of parallel terminals only, had the faulty sound?

Bearing in mind that both those sets of terminals are fed from just the two pins attached to the PCB, I can't understand how any fault within the amp (before those two pins) could affect the (parallel) terminals differently.

Anyway, as has been said, the leaked electrolytic capacitors need to be replaced.

I've replaced them (only once) in my 33 year old Quad FM4 tuner ( no fault symptom - just found them to be leaking when changing its nicad backup battery after 10 years).

Always worth checking electrolytics, but if they have actually leaked in my 15 year old Cyrus 8 amp, then they certainly don't seem to be compromising its sound.