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Yaqin MS-23B Valve Phono Stage Pre-Amp
- Thread starter geoffreyc
- Start date
There is a very active and helpful group on Facebook if you search Yaqin. There is a chap on there that modifies the MS-22
Last upgrade for a long time... you sure Steve?! Yaqin seem to offer an excellent product that has a good following. tubestein168 on Ebay seems to have a great deal of respect as a seller of Yaqin.
I had been looking at the Yaqin amps as a compliment to the Leema, in part to your views on the Icon Audio.
However I think ive decided against Valve's and have been looking at Sugden A21SE and the Electrocompaniet ECI-3 with a possible move to Harbeth speakers.
I had been looking at the Yaqin amps as a compliment to the Leema, in part to your views on the Icon Audio.
However I think ive decided against Valve's and have been looking at Sugden A21SE and the Electrocompaniet ECI-3 with a possible move to Harbeth speakers.
Ordered one of these this morning.
Thinking of which valves to perhaps try in place of the stock ones, the JJ Electronic 12AX7 ECC83 have been recommended as well as the Electro Harmonix ones.
Any other suggestions?
Thinking of which valves to perhaps try in place of the stock ones, the JJ Electronic 12AX7 ECC83 have been recommended as well as the Electro Harmonix ones.
Any other suggestions?
Im currently at my mums house in Spain on my Hols - on ipad at min.
The day my Gyrodec arrived was the day I flew out - so its still at the dealers all set up and waitng for me when I get home another 10 days yet to get home, then I have the builders in - so I need to pick it up some point the weekend after next.
The day my Gyrodec arrived was the day I flew out - so its still at the dealers all set up and waitng for me when I get home another 10 days yet to get home, then I have the builders in - so I need to pick it up some point the weekend after next.
geoffreyc said:
well i was hoping you may do a little review on here and compare it to what you had before, also what cart will you use with it?
System at the moment is Rega RP6 c/w Nagaoka MP-200 (Which I believe your a fan of as well!) Rega Brio and RS5's
I know someone with a similar system (different speakers) that is using the Yaqin MS-22b (model that the 23b replaces) which did (some say) suffer from a bit of hum - although all valve amps can sometimes be prone to that I think- I see you have the Icon ST40 - really beautiful amp.
The newer MS-23b is supposed to be a lot better in this regard than its predecessor.
The MS-22b that I have heard had a really warm sound, beautiful low end and really emphasised all the qualities of good vinyl and quite an improvement over the Brio, but I'll be letting the MS-23b run in a few days and look at getting some new tubes next week hopefully.
Have a nice hol.
I know someone with a similar system (different speakers) that is using the Yaqin MS-22b (model that the 23b replaces) which did (some say) suffer from a bit of hum - although all valve amps can sometimes be prone to that I think- I see you have the Icon ST40 - really beautiful amp.
The newer MS-23b is supposed to be a lot better in this regard than its predecessor.
The MS-22b that I have heard had a really warm sound, beautiful low end and really emphasised all the qualities of good vinyl and quite an improvement over the Brio, but I'll be letting the MS-23b run in a few days and look at getting some new tubes next week hopefully.
Have a nice hol.
Received my Yaqin MS-23b earlier this morning.
First thing I did was to remove the aluminium structure over the tubes - used a 2mm 'ball head' hex key (after removing the screws put them back in the holes remembering not to lose the very small rubber washers!) next I removed the tube sleeves ( I like to see my tubes!) and I've let it warm up a couple of hours and have just listened to my first LP and WOW! - a really worthwhile improvement on the Rega Brio's and even on that of the Elicit -R I had a dem of the other day.
Will give it a week and start rolling those tubes!
First thing I did was to remove the aluminium structure over the tubes - used a 2mm 'ball head' hex key (after removing the screws put them back in the holes remembering not to lose the very small rubber washers!) next I removed the tube sleeves ( I like to see my tubes!) and I've let it warm up a couple of hours and have just listened to my first LP and WOW! - a really worthwhile improvement on the Rega Brio's and even on that of the Elicit -R I had a dem of the other day.
Will give it a week and start rolling those tubes!
boggit said:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/lez/Yaqin%20MS-22B/Putting%20%27Life%27%20into%20the%20Yaqin%20MS-22B.pdf
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/216979-yaqin-ms-22b-phono-amp-5.html#post3342427
IMO, If a person is safety conscious and somewhat competent with a soldering iron, I would strongly suggest doing Hi-Q's conversion of the Yaqin circuit before struggling with which tubes to use, comparatively, tube choice is irrelevant.geoffreyc said:
Hi, I have had a lot of experience with the yaqin ms22.
Very inexpensive, around US $160. Bought mine about a year ago and immediately upgraded the valves with NOS mullard Long plates. Fantastic result from the valve upgrade. The yaqin presents a lovely warm full sound. Loved it so much I have bought a yaqin MS23, which is just as good, with lower noise. Playing something like Talk Talk 'laughing stock' highlights the space between the notes.
See my blog on the Yaqin MS22 at dmillarblog.wordpress.com
Very inexpensive, around US $160. Bought mine about a year ago and immediately upgraded the valves with NOS mullard Long plates. Fantastic result from the valve upgrade. The yaqin presents a lovely warm full sound. Loved it so much I have bought a yaqin MS23, which is just as good, with lower noise. Playing something like Talk Talk 'laughing stock' highlights the space between the notes.
See my blog on the Yaqin MS22 at dmillarblog.wordpress.com
I have the model that goes by the Silk brand name here in the U.S. I am quite smitten with this pre for the $$. Regarding the HiQ modification that some talk about, that will make the unit more hi fi, but if you like more of a classic tube sound, put your money into a pair of Psvane Treasure II 12AX7 tubes. I know they are expensive, but in this application worth every penny.
I most certainly have heard it. He did a fine job. I will not take that away from him. My point is that if one is looking for CLASSIC tube sound as opposed to Hi Fi tube sound, the HiQ conversion is probably not the direction to go. I am a "name withheld" audio designer myself. Despite what I have read on some forums about the MS 23B's design being bad, it actually is not. It is actually a pretty solid design. I purchased it more out of morbid curiosity than need. I already have a phono pre. It is a built-from-scratch copy of the Marantz 7C and I built it with some of the finest parts you can obtain in the world.
Now, I am not implying that Yaqin knocked it out of the park. If the end user is wanting "classic" tube sound from their phono pre, the Yaqin is not a bad place to start. Signal path and feedback part substitutions plus better signal path wire would definitely refine this piece as it delivers it's classic tube sound; and different tubes are a must! I have experimented with several new production tubes and it seems that the Psvane Treasures work really good with Russian made Tung Sol coming in a close second.
What is interesting is that topologically, the Yaqin shares quite a bit with a 7C. Sure, the bias approach is different and the 7C used a tube instead of a transistor for the output buffer, but there are many similarities.
With $50 U.S. worth of part swaps and if the unit was made somewhere in Europe and cost $599 American, the audio press would go ga-ga over this thing.
If a person likes the basic character of this unit, then tube substitutions are relevant. They make quite a difference, even in it's stock form.
Now, I am not implying that Yaqin knocked it out of the park. If the end user is wanting "classic" tube sound from their phono pre, the Yaqin is not a bad place to start. Signal path and feedback part substitutions plus better signal path wire would definitely refine this piece as it delivers it's classic tube sound; and different tubes are a must! I have experimented with several new production tubes and it seems that the Psvane Treasures work really good with Russian made Tung Sol coming in a close second.
What is interesting is that topologically, the Yaqin shares quite a bit with a 7C. Sure, the bias approach is different and the 7C used a tube instead of a transistor for the output buffer, but there are many similarities.
With $50 U.S. worth of part swaps and if the unit was made somewhere in Europe and cost $599 American, the audio press would go ga-ga over this thing.
If a person likes the basic character of this unit, then tube substitutions are relevant. They make quite a difference, even in it's stock form.
In your initial post you mention that you have a Silk brand phono preamp, but I wasn't certain whether you were speaking from personal experience or otherwise, when you spoke of the Hi-Q converted unit.
I truly don't think I'm qualified to speak of "classic vs hifi" tube sound, and I don't disagree with your comment:
"If a person likes the basic character of this unit, then tube substitutions are relevant....."
My comment about tube choice being COMPARATIVELY irrelevant is based on my experience over the past two or three years with both the stock and converted phono unit and involves the use of a variety of 12ax7 tubes including: Shuguang, Winged C's, Psvane, RCA long BP's, NEC, Telefunken, Tungsram, Amperex (Herleen) along with Sylvania and RCA 5751's as well as numerous different coupling and RIAA capacitor types.
My findings (in my system) is that the converted Yaqin unit (LesBox), using even the lesser of the tubes I mentioned, provides more detail, soundstage, dynamics, life... than the stock unit.
As I said above, I honestly can't speak to "classic vs hifi" sound,
but apparently I have a preference for hifi tube sound. 😱)
I truly don't think I'm qualified to speak of "classic vs hifi" tube sound, and I don't disagree with your comment:
"If a person likes the basic character of this unit, then tube substitutions are relevant....."
My comment about tube choice being COMPARATIVELY irrelevant is based on my experience over the past two or three years with both the stock and converted phono unit and involves the use of a variety of 12ax7 tubes including: Shuguang, Winged C's, Psvane, RCA long BP's, NEC, Telefunken, Tungsram, Amperex (Herleen) along with Sylvania and RCA 5751's as well as numerous different coupling and RIAA capacitor types.
My findings (in my system) is that the converted Yaqin unit (LesBox), using even the lesser of the tubes I mentioned, provides more detail, soundstage, dynamics, life... than the stock unit.
As I said above, I honestly can't speak to "classic vs hifi" sound,
but apparently I have a preference for hifi tube sound. 😱)
geoffreyc said:
I have one of these and they are very good for the money. It sounds far better than my Pro-ject Phono Box SE that I was using. I was a bit sceptical at first, having never heard of Yaqin or having had a tube/valve amp before but I was very surprised. Build quality is very good and it sounds great straight out of the box, but will improve with burn in. Yes you can upgrade the valves to make it better, but at the moment very happy as it is. Well worth the money. My Vinyl system is an upgraded Pro-ject Debut Carbon Turntable, Audiolab 8200A amplifier and Tannoy DC Revolution Dual Concentric Speakers. Nowhere near high end but sounds great.
I also have one of the MS23Bs which I bought through Amazon. It blew the Project phono stage I was using out of the water. I replaced the valves with JJs and it improved even more.
I was using it with a Rega RP6 and Exact 2 cartridge.
I was using it with a Rega RP6 and Exact 2 cartridge.
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