Would you pay for a demo

[drummerman]

Yes if there were some can-can dancers

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Sorry to have caused offence.

Hi Gazzip

None taken

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Deleted member 2457]

It's a business and they have overheads to cover. I'd be happy to pay for good service within reason. £5 per hour seems reasonable.

*smile*

 

[Deleted member 2457]

Pay for a demo of something you have no idea what it sounds like, you would be pretty pissed off if it sounded crap!

 

[steve_1979]

It's a business and they have overheads to cover. I'd be happy to pay for good service within reason. £5 per hour seems reasonable.

*smile*

£5 would only be a token amount which isn't too much to pay but it's still enough to separate the wheat from the chaff from the shops point of view to stop time wasters.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

It's a business and they have overheads to cover. I'd be happy to pay for good service within reason. £5 per hour seems reasonable.

*smile*

£5 would only be a token amount which isn't too much to pay but it's still enough to separate the wheat from the chaff from the shops point of view to stop time wasters.

True. Still sounded funny though.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

I suppose the cost of a magazine sounds fair.

 

[Gazzip]

Are demos not just part and parcel of selling hifi product in the same way that test drives are part and parcel of selling cars? I suppose hifi dealers could start to break down the overall service so that we pay pro rata for exactly what we use, but that is all getting a bit Ryanair-ish for my tastes.

One thing I would want to see if demos became chargeable would be a reduction in the price of the equipment to reflect the cost of the demo being recovered elsewhere. I suspect however that would not happen, prices would remain the same and that the dealer profit would increase. If that "saving" was passed on to the customer it would certainly create an interesting and more competitive hifi market for the consumer.

 

[Native_bon]

Actaully I think charging for a demo is a good deal. Its not easy in the HIFI retail world right now. Also will prevent people from doing a demo & then going to buy else were. If they do, at least the retailer has got something for their time. I will say £10 to £15.

 

[Paul.]

When I did wedding photography a few years back, I would charge for an engagement shoot then discount the cost of the engagement shoot off the wedding if they signed up. Perhaps something like that could work?

And to all those bemoaning "the regulars" in retail (the ones who come in for a chat and never seem to buy anything) they are usualy going around telling everyone who cares to listen what a wonderful shop you are, so try an be nice

 

[The_Lhc]

One thing I would want to see if demos became chargeable would be a reduction in the price of the equipment to reflect the cost of the demo being recovered elsewhere.

This is what a number of golf retailers do, clubs need to be fitted, measurements taken, results assessed and then passed to the manufacturer to supply the end product built to spec (which is slightly different from hi-fi sure). The nearest independant fitters to me charge £25 for a driver fitting (25 minutes) and £45 for a set of irons (45 minutes), but this price is then deducted from the price of the clubs when you order them, which neatly sidesteps the issue of people getting their custom fit measurements and then ordering the clubs online, you either get the profit margin or you effectively get £60/hour for your services.

I've been trying to explain this to the owner of one of my local golf clubs which has an excellent driving range but no shop at all, he could clean up on equipment sales in the area as there is nowhere else that has a proper driving range and the space to setup a proper custom fitting facility but he won't have it because he's convinced everyone would buy online. It's particularly irritating as the only other outfit with a custom fitting machine (but no "real" driving range) has just closed down and his son has re-opened it selling nothing but golf clothing (I know there's a huge margin in that but if there's no proper gear to look at I won't go in there).

 

[Gazzip]

Actaully I think charging for a demo is a good deal. Its not easy in the HIFI retail world right now. Also will prevent people from doing a demo & then going to buy else were. If they do, at least the retailer has got something for their time. I will say £10 to £15.

Yes, but you are already paying for this in the equipment price. It may not be explicitly broken down on your receipt as a cost but the demo is not currently "free" anymore than the guy selling it to you on the shop floor is doing it for free. You are already paying for it in the price of your equipment.

Like I say if demos were chargeable then I would like to see a reduction in the equipment price to reflect the dealers saving.

 

[Gazzip]

As the LHC neatly describes above.

 

[Jota180]

I've paid in full for demo equipment equipment. Had them at home for a week or so. When returned the money is credited back in my account. That sort of arrangement works ok.

tonky

Tha's what I'm about to do however I'd draw the line at paying to sit in someone's shop for the priviledge of listening.

 

[DaveyBoy1980]

In my recent experience of purchasing hifi equipment I have gone back to the same store every time due to how welcoming and accommodating they have been with me.

I am a very indecisive person and I know that when I have some money to spend I want to spend it well and be sure I've made the right decision.

I think I must have spent around 5 hours over 2 weekends in their demo room switching out multiple pairs of speakers and listening to some CDs I took in. I was then able to pay for the speakers I had liked the most and take them home to see if I liked them in my listening space. In the end, I wasn't too taken with them and returned them to the store and was then able to take another pair home. The 2nd pair I took were the Kef R500s which I wasn't too keen on in the store but wanted to hear them at home. And they blew me away at home, which shows how important it is to have a home demo and to take your time.

They also allowed me to have a home demo of the M-dac which I then also purchased from them.

It is because of this type of customer service that over the past few years I have spend a good £2k-£3k with them.

Just my 2p worth. But because of the above they have me as a customer as long as they are in business.

 

[fr0g]

One thing I would want to see if demos became chargeable would be a reduction in the price of the equipment to reflect the cost of the demo being recovered elsewhere.

This is what a number of golf retailers do, clubs need to be fitted, measurements taken, results assessed and then passed to the manufacturer to supply the end product built to spec (which is slightly different from hi-fi sure). The nearest independant fitters to me charge £25 for a driver fitting (25 minutes) and £45 for a set of irons (45 minutes), but this price is then deducted from the price of the clubs when you order them, which neatly sidesteps the issue of people getting their custom fit measurements and then ordering the clubs online, you either get the profit margin or you effectively get £60/hour for your services.

I've been trying to explain this to the owner of one of my local golf clubs which has an excellent driving range but no shop at all, he could clean up on equipment sales in the area as there is nowhere else that has a proper driving range and the space to setup a proper custom fitting facility but he won't have it because he's convinced everyone would buy online. It's particularly irritating as the only other outfit with a custom fitting machine (but no "real" driving range) has just closed down and his son has re-opened it selling nothing but golf clothing (I know there's a huge margin in that but if there's no proper gear to look at I won't go in there).

This seems a quite reasonable practice. But it isn't applicable to Hi-Fi demos. One custom fit is all you will ever need. So it's fair that it is charged for.

But many people need to try many different places and do many different demos to find the Audio equipment that suits them. Could get costly quite quickly.

Not to mention that it is impossible to get a custom fit online!

As I said, I would never pay for a Hi-Fi demo. Especially with distance selling rules as they are. If all these places started charging, I would buy online and demo at home.

As it is, before I went over to the Active cult I used one of our local HifiKlubben shops. They allowed me to take home pretty much anything and try at home, as well as in the shop. No questions asked. And in the end I spent over (eqv) £2500 with them on my system.

I even got to play with the Hi End system set up in the posh room even though I obviously had no intention of spending anywhere near that! (Klasse, Lyngdorf, B&W 800 etc)

The way I see it, a good Hi-fi retailer will get repeat custom. The demo is an important part of the whole service and charging for it when the customer might have 2 or 3 more demos in the area, is a non-starter IMO.

 

[playback]

I would pay for an hour long session in a B&M store with time scheduling (reservations). No more than 20 eur for my location, but in the UK I would go up to 50 quid. I expect to get a dedicated employee, 60min to demo gear with no one else cueing and to leave with a goodie bag full of brochures and a coupon for some free B&W/KEF/Linn music download and such.

+1 has to be a goody bag or im not interested.

 

[playback]

Ive never been completed satisfied with an in store demo as generally there are too many variables that are different once you are in your own listening environment.

 

[iQ Speakers]

I think the issue here is times are a changing with generations, gone are the days when customers built up a relationship with a dealer who would lend them items. It seems in all retail customers take the p*** and abuse retailers returning stuff at the drop of a hat thats what they expect they have no morales about doing so, sombody on here is a good example. If this continues lots of retailers will go out of business and we will be faced with corporate shops like Currys where the staff no nothing can not scratch there own A*** with following a script and we call this good customer service! I think I'm getting old.

 

[Gazzip]

I think the issue here is times are a changing with generations, gone are the days when customers built up a relationship with a dealer who would lend them items. It seems in all retail customers take the p*** and abuse retailers returning stuff at the drop of a hat thats what they expect they have no morales about doing so, sombody on here is a good example. If this continues lots of retailers will go out of business and we will be faced with corporate shops like Currys where the staff no nothing can not scratch there own A*** with following a script and we call this good customer service! I think I'm getting old.

Which is EXACTLY why dealers should continue to offer the demo. Build relationships, ensure customers are happy with the sound before they leave the shop, take away excuses for the easy return of goods. Removing the free shop demo from the sales process would push many to exercise their rights under distance selling regulations. The cost of the demo to the retailer is then replaced by the cost of shipping the goods to the customer along with all the hassle of restocking a now used item.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Are demos not just part and parcel of selling hifi product in the same way that test drives are part and parcel of selling cars? I suppose hifi dealers could start to break down the overall service so that we pay pro rata for exactly what we use, but that is all getting a bit Ryanair-ish for my tastes.

The difference is though, that with a car, you're generally talking about £10k-50k or more a time. A bit different from a grand or so, or even a few hundred quid sometimes.

One thing I would want to see if demos became chargeable would be a reduction in the price of the equipment to reflect the cost of the demo being recovered elsewhere. I suspect however that would not happen, prices would remain the same and that the dealer profit would increase. If that "saving" was passed on to the customer it would certainly create an interesting and more competitive hifi market for the consumer.

It is competitive enough as it is, although it depends which section of the market the retailer chooses to participate in. The example you have mentioned above is fine if you're talking rrps, but if you're talking matched prices or "street prices, then margins are small enough already.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Tha's what I'm about to do however I'd draw the line at paying to sit in someone's shop for the priviledge of listening.

I know everyone is different, but many people when they're considering hi-fi end up with a fairly large shortlist. Due to the choice most dealers choose to provide, it's either a case of whittling down that shortlist, or travelling between a number of dealers to hear everything. We fine many people will travel long distances to hear various products under one roof (and in the same room), which overall probably ends up being a shorter distance than visiting three dealers. At least comparing in one (albeit unfamiliar) place, allows the differences between the products to be appreciated. The home loan would be considered the 'confirmation'.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I think the issue here is times are a changing with generations, gone are the days when customers built up a relationship with a dealer who would lend them items. It seems in all retail customers take the p*** and abuse retailers returning stuff at the drop of a hat thats what they expect they have no morales about doing so, sombody on here is a good example.

This is more of an issue with online purchasing rather than in store purcahsing. With the latter, the customer has tried the option, maybe had a home demo, so know what they're getting. Mail order is just crazy - turntable's are returned because "I didn't know I needed an amp and speakers". This is what happens when there's no communication, and quite frequently (for online purchasing of any type of product) buyers don't read the product's details - they'll look at the picture, make presumptions, order, then realise it's wrong. The law makes it too easy to return stuff that has been purchased in this way. but that's online retailing I suppose - you take the rough with the smooth. I'd rather talk to the customer first to make sure the item is exactly what they need, and will do what they want it to do.

 

[Gazzip]

Are demos not just part and parcel of selling hifi product in the same way that test drives are part and parcel of selling cars? I suppose hifi dealers could start to break down the overall service so that we pay pro rata for exactly what we use, but that is all getting a bit Ryanair-ish for my tastes.

The difference is though, that with a car, you're generally talking about £10k-50k or more a time. A bit different from a grand or so, or even a few hundred quid sometimes.

One thing I would want to see if demos became chargeable would be a reduction in the price of the equipment to reflect the cost of the demo being recovered elsewhere. I suspect however that would not happen, prices would remain the same and that the dealer profit would increase. If that "saving" was passed on to the customer it would certainly create an interesting and more competitive hifi market for the consumer.

It is competitive enough as it is, although it depends which section of the market the retailer chooses to participate in. The example you have mentioned above is fine if you're talking rrps, but if you're talking matched prices or "street prices, then margins are small enough already.

Yes but David surely if dealers do not offer demos then they/you will have to deal with a lot more used returns due to distance selling regulations? Is it not better just to demo in store?

I also think you have to look at all of those smaller sales as potential larger sales further down the line where perhaps the margins are much, much larger. Sure, some people stop after their first purchase and will use that hifi until it/they die. Quite a lot of customers will however keep coming back, especially if upgradeitis sets in.

With the odd exception I have stuck with my dealer in Hull since 1995 even though I have lived in London since 1999. Why? He is no cheaper than anybody else? It is because he provides me with a proper service a large part of which is always offering me either a home demo or a shop demo. The home demo stuff he always ships at his cost even though he does not always make a sale. For this reason I will stick with him even though it does limit my range of products. Although he did piddle me off yesterday if he is reading this.....

In my business we call those small jobs that make no money "the churn". The money comes in and then it goes out. No profit. What it does do however is enable us to continue trading, paying our staff etc. so that when the bigger and more profitable jobs come in we can make some money ourselves. That's just business!

 

[dim_span]

I'm busy setting up a new system at home ... I am keen on an old Yamaha or Luxman Receiver and would love to hear them through a pair of Harbeth P3ESR ( My current speakers are B&W DM2 transmissions (the very 1st edition)

I have owned them for 12 years, and I will keep them in the loft for later. (They have served me well, and I enjoy the sound of them ... they were connected to a Pioneer SA-9800 amp and Marantz CD63 MKII K1 sig CDP) ... Sadly, they are too big for my current lounge, and from reading forums, I think the Harbeth P3ESR might just be what I am looking for.

If someone in or near Cambridge owns a pair of P3ESR, I'd happily pay for a demo on my system in my lounge in a few weeks time (once I have sorted my amp/receiver...)

could make a day of it (BBQ etc) ... I have Tom Evans tweaked stuff aswell which I'm going to box upo and keep in the loft for my teenage son ... (amp/cdp aswell as tuner) ... if the harbeths sound good on those, might use the Harbeth and pass them onto him when i upgrade/change ... I have a feeling that the Harbeth might suit this sytem very well