What`s the point in £1000 cd players!
- Thread starter chunky70
- Start date
matengawhat
Well-known member
Whats the point in owning a Ferrari when you could get a Skoda (no disrespect to Skoda).
If you are happy with your set up excellent.
If you are happy with your set up excellent.
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
The DAC is only one small part of a CDP. If you take the lid off one you will find a whole load of electronics, the more you spend, the higher the quality of the parts, the more R&D that's gone into the signal path, the less corners are cut etc.
The DAC is only one small part of a CDP. If you take the lid off one you will find a whole load of electronics, the more you spend, the higher the quality of the parts, the more R&D that's gone into the signal path, the less corners are cut etc.
jaxwired
Well-known member
Chunky, assuming the sound achieved is identical, then there is no point in £1000 cd players. However, the one thing HiFi enthusiasts agree on is that we don't agree.
Many people (including experts) report that:
1. A £20 dvd player feeding a DAC sounds different than a £200 CD player feeding a DAC and that sounds different than a £2000 CD player feeding a DAC.
2. A £1000 CD Player sounds different than a £1000 DAC.
3. An optical cable connecting the transport (£20 dvd player) to the DAC sounds different than a COAX cable doing the same job.
4. All digital cables connecting transports to DACs sound different.
5. A CD player with a digital input sounds different playing from a CD then playing from a digital input stream.
I could go on, since it is almost endless. So the answer is, some people only play CDs and they think a dedicated expensive CD player is superior.
Many people (including experts) report that:
1. A £20 dvd player feeding a DAC sounds different than a £200 CD player feeding a DAC and that sounds different than a £2000 CD player feeding a DAC.
2. A £1000 CD Player sounds different than a £1000 DAC.
3. An optical cable connecting the transport (£20 dvd player) to the DAC sounds different than a COAX cable doing the same job.
4. All digital cables connecting transports to DACs sound different.
5. A CD player with a digital input sounds different playing from a CD then playing from a digital input stream.
I could go on, since it is almost endless. So the answer is, some people only play CDs and they think a dedicated expensive CD player is superior.
I used to love my Linn Genki CDP, I just got fed up with getting up and down to change CD's after listening to 1 or 2 tracks from each CD. Lossless, jitter-free rips and on-the-fly playlists with Windows Media Centre were the answer for me and a good DAC. The Linn Genki may have just edged it on sound quality, but I'm listening to more music now.
chebby:
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Oh my goodness! I never thought of that.
I will sell my (£895) CD player and get a DAC and a DVD player.
Oh hang on, I have a DAC and a DVD player already. So why on earth did I get that CD player?
matengawhat:because they sound better!!!!!!!
Yep that was it. Thanks 'matengawhat'.
Brilliant, you are in fine fettle this afternoon Chebby
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Oh my goodness! I never thought of that.
I will sell my (£895) CD player and get a DAC and a DVD player.
Oh hang on, I have a DAC and a DVD player already. So why on earth did I get that CD player?
matengawhat:because they sound better!!!!!!!
Yep that was it. Thanks 'matengawhat'.
Brilliant, you are in fine fettle this afternoon Chebby
idc
Well-known member
pete321:....... The Linn Genki may have just edged it on sound quality, but I'm listening to more music now.
Which for me is why a £1000 CDP is not worth it. I refuse to get obsessed with extracting the nth degree of sound quality from my setup, particularly when that can get in the way of enjoying the music. If you are listening and thinking, that bass line is a bit bright or those cymbols sound muffled, how can you be enjoying the music? Give me more music anyday.
Which for me is why a £1000 CDP is not worth it. I refuse to get obsessed with extracting the nth degree of sound quality from my setup, particularly when that can get in the way of enjoying the music. If you are listening and thinking, that bass line is a bit bright or those cymbols sound muffled, how can you be enjoying the music? Give me more music anyday.
Messiah
Well-known member
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
Music is what it is all about but that Nth degree can be the difference between good and magic. To me (as a consumer rather than a dealer) that is worth chasing.
idc:
pete321:....... The Linn Genki may have just edged it on sound quality, but I'm listening to more music now.
Which for me is why a £1000 CDP is not worth it. I refuse to get obsessed with extracting the nth degree of sound quality from my setup, particularly when that can get in the way of enjoying the music. If you are listening and thinking, that bass line is a bit bright or those cymbols sound muffled, how can you be enjoying the music? Give me more music anyday.
i disagree, maybe the bass and treble problems would be what stops you enjoying the music, if the sound is fatiguing or flat in some way i don't see how that can be as enjoyable as music without those "problems". if the sound is "right", there won't be anything to detract from your enjoyment.
pete321:....... The Linn Genki may have just edged it on sound quality, but I'm listening to more music now.
Which for me is why a £1000 CDP is not worth it. I refuse to get obsessed with extracting the nth degree of sound quality from my setup, particularly when that can get in the way of enjoying the music. If you are listening and thinking, that bass line is a bit bright or those cymbols sound muffled, how can you be enjoying the music? Give me more music anyday.
i disagree, maybe the bass and treble problems would be what stops you enjoying the music, if the sound is fatiguing or flat in some way i don't see how that can be as enjoyable as music without those "problems". if the sound is "right", there won't be anything to detract from your enjoyment.
TheHomeCinemaCentre:
Music is what it is all about but that Nth degree can be the difference between good and magic. To me (as a consumer rather than a dealer) that is worth chasing.
Music is what it is all about but that Nth degree can be the difference between good and magic. To me (as a consumer rather than a dealer) that is worth chasing.
matengawhat
Well-known member
Messiah:
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
sorry should have prob said don't expect a dvd and a dac magic to sound like a £1000 cdp
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
sorry should have prob said don't expect a dvd and a dac magic to sound like a £1000 cdp
idc
Well-known member
Sorry, I'll add a bit of clarity to my comment about nth degree.
If I am happy with my sound, but I know it maybe lacks a bit of crisp treble compared with a mates setup, (the nth degree) then I dont worry and would not dream of spending £1000 to try and fix it, since something else would probably alter in the sound anyway.
But if I was unhappy with the sound of my setup and far preferred my mates, then I would act and if that meant looking at a £1000 spend, so be it.
If I am happy with my sound, but I know it maybe lacks a bit of crisp treble compared with a mates setup, (the nth degree) then I dont worry and would not dream of spending £1000 to try and fix it, since something else would probably alter in the sound anyway.
But if I was unhappy with the sound of my setup and far preferred my mates, then I would act and if that meant looking at a £1000 spend, so be it.
jaxwired
Well-known member
Messiah:
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
Agreed. People are pretty touchy about defending their choice of high end CD players. But the fact is that chunky's questions if totally valid and many people, including experts, think that a good DAC and a cheap transport is every bit the equal of the high priced CDP. I'm not saying one way or the other. The answer is obviously subjective and I personally can understand either side. I just don't think chunky's questions is worthy of contempt.
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
Agreed. People are pretty touchy about defending their choice of high end CD players. But the fact is that chunky's questions if totally valid and many people, including experts, think that a good DAC and a cheap transport is every bit the equal of the high priced CDP. I'm not saying one way or the other. The answer is obviously subjective and I personally can understand either side. I just don't think chunky's questions is worthy of contempt.
Like I said if you can enjoy your music and are totally satisfied with a £20 DVD player + a DAC I am happy for you and TBH very slightly jealous.
I could tell the difference between a £895 player and a £1271 player. Not being snobby just the more expensive one did sound better to my ears. Wish I could have saved a ton of money to achieve the same results!!
I could tell the difference between a £895 player and a £1271 player. Not being snobby just the more expensive one did sound better to my ears. Wish I could have saved a ton of money to achieve the same results!!
Much to my suprise, when I listened to the Chord Blu Transport and Dac at 8.5k (!) my dad loved it so much he bought one (Having tried various ones ranging from 3k to 10k)
I must admit the chord is one incredible cd player (Which youd pretty much expect for the price)
If anyone thinks a cheapie dvd/cd player and DAC will compare in the slightest id have to say theyre so wrong (I know it says 1k, im just giving my 2p worth)
I must admit the chord is one incredible cd player (Which youd pretty much expect for the price)
If anyone thinks a cheapie dvd/cd player and DAC will compare in the slightest id have to say theyre so wrong (I know it says 1k, im just giving my 2p worth)
Messiah:
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
Ditto that.
chunky70:When you can buy a dac and a £20 dvd player?
Seems a fair question. Chunky seems to have received some fairly sarcastic answers....
Ditto that.
TheHomeCinemaCentre:
Music is what it is all about but that Nth degree can be the difference between good and magic. To me (as a consumer rather than a dealer) that is worth chasing.
Ditto that as well!
Music is what it is all about but that Nth degree can be the difference between good and magic. To me (as a consumer rather than a dealer) that is worth chasing.
Ditto that as well!
idc
Well-known member
The answer lies within and if CDPs were opened up then we would get a real answer. They are, after all transports and DACs in a box.
I have seen some headphone amps opened up on other forums. One in particular was found to contain the innards of a much cheaper amp.
My understanding is that there are very few (a couple maybe) CD transports, so the choice is limited to that or use either DVD/PC or bespoke transports. So there is always the possibility that a £20 DVD player could have essentially the same transport as an expensive CDP. There is also the possibility that a DAC could essentially the same DAC as the expensive CDP.
So, if you fancy a £1000 CDP it would be worth your while to find out what transport and DAC it uses, as there may well be cheaper separate transport and DAC out there.
I have seen some headphone amps opened up on other forums. One in particular was found to contain the innards of a much cheaper amp.
My understanding is that there are very few (a couple maybe) CD transports, so the choice is limited to that or use either DVD/PC or bespoke transports. So there is always the possibility that a £20 DVD player could have essentially the same transport as an expensive CDP. There is also the possibility that a DAC could essentially the same DAC as the expensive CDP.
So, if you fancy a £1000 CDP it would be worth your while to find out what transport and DAC it uses, as there may well be cheaper separate transport and DAC out there.
I think there is a point in the OP. To a growing audience there is less and less reason to buy an expensive high end CD player (although I second comments earlier about the Chord Blu etc') when you can use a suitable transport (you decide how suitable) with a good DAC and get very fine results.
Quite against my natural instincts I have junked my CD player in favour of a Mac Mini through a Chord QBD 76. I would never dream of spending the same amount of money on a CD player alone - why? Well firstly because I haven't heard a CD player that could compete sonically with the MM & 76 combo (not even close). Secondly, I found, once again contrary to instincts that I liked to listen via itunes and particularly Spotify which opens up a library of music a lot bigger than I could ever afford!
My initial motive was to find something that would make me want to listen to my 100's of CD's again! The Michell Gyrodec had made listening to CD's almost painful so they became obselete and literally gathered dust, however the Chord 76 has evened up the score, even if it can't match the Gyrodec for absolute listening pleasure.
Quite against my natural instincts I have junked my CD player in favour of a Mac Mini through a Chord QBD 76. I would never dream of spending the same amount of money on a CD player alone - why? Well firstly because I haven't heard a CD player that could compete sonically with the MM & 76 combo (not even close). Secondly, I found, once again contrary to instincts that I liked to listen via itunes and particularly Spotify which opens up a library of music a lot bigger than I could ever afford!
My initial motive was to find something that would make me want to listen to my 100's of CD's again! The Michell Gyrodec had made listening to CD's almost painful so they became obselete and literally gathered dust, however the Chord 76 has evened up the score, even if it can't match the Gyrodec for absolute listening pleasure.
matthewpiano
Well-known member
At the Manchester Show today I have heard CD players at several price levels that prove a good quality machine is still a very worthwhile investment:
Marantz CD6003 (through PM6003 and MS Aviano 2)
Sugden Mystro (through Sugden Mystro amp and some incredible Focals)
Unison Research Unico (through a fabulous Unison Research valve amp and some frighteningly good Opera floorstanders)
All three of these machines proved, with absolutely no doubt in my mind, that CD is capable of superb performance with the right player and that there are very capable players worthy of spending money across different budgets.
Marantz CD6003 (through PM6003 and MS Aviano 2)
Sugden Mystro (through Sugden Mystro amp and some incredible Focals)
Unison Research Unico (through a fabulous Unison Research valve amp and some frighteningly good Opera floorstanders)
All three of these machines proved, with absolutely no doubt in my mind, that CD is capable of superb performance with the right player and that there are very capable players worthy of spending money across different budgets.
matengawhat
Well-known member
crimsondonkey:
I think there is a point in the OP. To a growing audience there is less and less reason to buy an expensive high end CD player (although I second comments earlier about the Chord Blu etc') when you can use a suitable transport (you decide how suitable) with a good DAC and get very fine results.
Quite against my natural instincts I have junked my CD player in favour of a Mac Mini through a Chord QBD 76. I would never dream of spending the same amount of money on a CD player alone - why? Well firstly because I haven't heard a CD player that could compete sonically with the MM & 76 combo (not even close). Secondly, I found, once again contrary to instincts that I liked to listen via itunes and particularly Spotify which opens up a library of music a lot bigger than I could ever afford!
My initial motive was to find something that would make me want to listen to my 100's of CD's again! The Michell Gyrodec had made listening to CD's almost painful so they became obselete and literally gathered dust, however the Chord 76 has evened up the score, even if it can't match the Gyrodec for absolute listening pleasure.
interesting, although i suspect you wouldn't think that if your dac didn't do such a fine job of buffering and re-clocking the incoming signal.
I think there is a point in the OP. To a growing audience there is less and less reason to buy an expensive high end CD player (although I second comments earlier about the Chord Blu etc') when you can use a suitable transport (you decide how suitable) with a good DAC and get very fine results.
Quite against my natural instincts I have junked my CD player in favour of a Mac Mini through a Chord QBD 76. I would never dream of spending the same amount of money on a CD player alone - why? Well firstly because I haven't heard a CD player that could compete sonically with the MM & 76 combo (not even close). Secondly, I found, once again contrary to instincts that I liked to listen via itunes and particularly Spotify which opens up a library of music a lot bigger than I could ever afford!
My initial motive was to find something that would make me want to listen to my 100's of CD's again! The Michell Gyrodec had made listening to CD's almost painful so they became obselete and literally gathered dust, however the Chord 76 has evened up the score, even if it can't match the Gyrodec for absolute listening pleasure.
interesting, although i suspect you wouldn't think that if your dac didn't do such a fine job of buffering and re-clocking the incoming signal.
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