The Apex Club

[ric71]

Nice one RickyDeg,

Ive just ordered another pair of A10's from Rick@ Musicraft to allow me to go 7.1, using my Radius R90HD's as front heights.

Enjoy

 

[RickyDeg]

Thanks for that one, Rick! I'm hoping the same, as this will my 5:th speaker set-up in the last 12 years, going from lifestyle systems to floorstanders and now back to lifestyle system again.

I know you've written a few posts about the APEX speakers - but might I ask for your personal take on having two subwoofers, especially these in particular (the AW12). They will be placed somewhat symmetrically (?) on the front wall of my listeningroom, something like this (apologies for the primitive drawing):

 

[RickyDeg]

Nice one RickyDeg,

Ive just ordered another pair of A10's from Rick@ Musicraft to allow me to go 7.1, using my Radius R90HD's as front heights.

Enjoy

Oi, I wish I had a possibility in my listening room to expant to two pairs of surroundspeakers. You are lucky there ric71. However, I do have the possibility to add another pair of A10's as front height (when I eventually get a newer DENON receiver). So I'd have a 7.2 system consisting of height-channels. I take it you enjoy the additional feeling of 'presence' that height gives you? I've experienced it at a friends place and it was interesting.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I also think this is why MA are so popular, not only do their speakers sound great, but they look nice too. If MK produced anything as remotely as pretty as MA and some others I'm sure they souls sell more.

You're right Mark. Most people don't have the luxury of a dedicated room, so need something to fit into their living rooms, which they spend most of their time in, and don't want speakers to take over the room, but if they must, they need to be visually acceptable. Some speaker manufacturers have a hard time realising this, and continue to produce speakers that are just plain ugly, or just aren't going to be acceptable in at least 50% of UK homes - that's halved their sales possibilities before it's even left the drawing board!

Luckily, a few manufacturers have made great steps forward recently in their designs, and can now give dedicated AV speakers a run for their money. Some may not quite be as good, but as far as £'s go, value for money definitely falls on their side. And in these recessional times, everyone's looking for value for money.

 

[RickyDeg]

....Some speaker manufacturers have a hard time realising this, and continue to produce speakers that are just plain ugly, or just aren't going to be acceptable in at least 50% of UK homes - that's halved their sales possibilities before it's even left the drawing board!...

It would seem to be a very common trait among THX speakers, for example - like M&K in other words

I've yet to lay my eyes on any THX system that looks delish and can easily melt into a "normal" livingroom environment. Well, maybe apart from the column speakers LT 6 THX Select from TEUFEL, perhaps. Then again, I assume most THX speakers are made for dedicated rooms in the first place. It's still ashame though.

 

[Anonymous]

I think the most attractive THX speakers I've seen / heard are the Jamo's D500 package in White. Just a shame they are not very good with music.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Seems to be a common trait with AV speakers. I've changed to hi-fi speakers less than half the price of my old AV speakers and they're more than twice as good with music. They're not bad for music - on many levels quite acceptable, but the difference is staggering.

 

[ric71]

One of the major reasons I went with the Apex is their ability to play music.

I do not have the room or finances for two systems as nor do most people ,so their needs to be a middle ground.

I demoed the Apex with an Arcam AVR600 and the Apex were fantastic with music. I did not feel there was a sonic compromise between them and dedicated small stand mounted speakers. Set the sub up correctly and superb musical reproduction is to be had.

Yes you either prefer a full range system or sub sat, two types of sound but I like the detail produced by good sub sat systems and I find them easier to live with ie placement,small children and fingers etc.

MK systems are fantastic and cant be beaten for movie veiwing. I have demoed some serious MK stuff over the years and yes I could live with their looks as I like them, used to have 2 MX V125THX subs and they were stunning with movies and music but the speakers just didnt handle music as well as more conventional designs.

ohhhh to win the lottery

 

[Deleted member 2457]

Hi

Just curious guys, which one is better:

Apex 5.1 vs Radius 270 fronts, Silver RX Centre, Radius 180 Rears and AW12 Sub - in terms of music and movies.

Cheers

 

[Anonymous]

I would say the Apex, they will produce a more even and spacious soundstage than the mixed setup of the others. if you went the Radius route I would suggest the R250 or R225 as a centre not the RXC. I've just cancelled my R90HD rears I was due to collect tomorrow and decided to pay the extra for the A10's as I believe they are worth it, even though the rears only handle around 20% of the sound track.

 

[ric71]

markjaspi,

I have been running Radius R90HD's as rears with the Apex, they are great but as previuosly stated I have just ordered another pair of A10's for rear duties as they are much better.

If you listen to multi channel music the rears often take a good work out and it is better if poss to match all speakersas we know.

I will use the Radius as front heights as I believe they literally are used for ambience and will tell myself that that I will not replace them with A10's as I am saving for a new amp to really drive the Apex!!

 

[ric71]

Gel,

I will agree with markjaspi,

I have had the Radius and they are fantastic but I would go for the Apex if poss.

If you are going to use the Radius use the R225 or R250HD centre along side the R270HD's

R180 rears and the AW12 sub will be the icing on the cake.

It will be a superb package with both movies and music.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

Cheers guys, much appreciated.

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Thanks for that one, Rick! I'm hoping the same, as this will my 5:th speaker set-up in the last 12 years, going from lifestyle systems to floorstanders and now back to lifestyle system again.

I know you've written a few posts about the APEX speakers - but might I ask for your personal take on having two subwoofers, especially these in particular (the AW12). They will be placed somewhat symmetrically (?) on the front wall of my listeningroom, something like this (apologies for the primitive drawing):

Hi RickyDeg

Your welcome.

Two Apex AW12 subs will be great :bigsmile: On paper at least the placement for the subs should be fine and i hope this proves to be so later on today.

Btw, i've also got clients in Sweden

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[RickyDeg]

Btw, i've also got clients in Sweden

You do? Darn it, had I only known that.......lol

Just found out my delivery of the system is delayed over a week. Ugh.

And all the new furniture that is going to house it won't come til may.

But, no reason to complain. Sitting tight is in order.

Also, I were promised by my dealer that I could switch to 5 equal A40's should I not feel 100% about the integration since I'm incredibly sensitive to that. Using 5 identical speakers all-round is something I've now found to be pretty much essential. I didn't pick up on anything specific during my auditions of the system, but auditioning is one thing - living with them is another. What is your personal take on using A10's and one A40 in the "normal" package?

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Btw, i've also got clients in Sweden

You do? Darn it, had I only known that.......lol

Just found out my delivery of the system is delayed over a week. Ugh.

And all the new furniture that is going to house it won't come til may.

But, no reason to complain. Sitting tight is in order.

Also, I were promised by my dealer that I could switch to 5 equal A40's should I not feel 100% about the integration since I'm incredibly sensitive to that. Using 5 identical speakers all-round is something I've now found to be pretty much essential. I didn't pick up on anything specific during my auditions of the system, but auditioning is one thing - living with them is another. What is your personal take on using A10's and one A40 in the "normal" package?

Hi RickyDeg

Yes, i've got clients in Sweden. You were not to know. If you are feeling guilty i can send you an invoice though

Anyway using four A10's and one A40 is already an excellent configuration

However if you are prepared to have five A40's then what are you waiting for? The extra detail, scale, depth and dynamics a configuration five A40's is going to offer over the standard configuration is simply a no brainer. Even more so in your case as you're also having two AW-12's. Go for it :bigsmile:

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Anonymous]

I'm considering upgrading from the B&W MT-30 to the Apex and I have a few questions:

1. Is the Apex that much better than the MT-30? Please be honest

2. Is my Yamaha RX-V1800 a good match for the Apex?

3. What cable would be a good option to connect the amp to the speakers?

4. I have an offer to buy the 5.1 Apex with 4 stands for EUR 2,250 which I think is a good price. How much do you think I would be able to get for the B&W? Speakers are 3 years old and the PV1 is 1 year old. What's the best way to sell them? MA dealer will not take them for a discount.

Hello, I am quite new to this forum (not the magazine). But would you mind telling me where you can buy this set for that price? Is that in the Netherlands? The complete set here in Holland is way over 3K eur. Hope you still visit this forum so you can answer (if you like).

Went for a audition to listern to the MT-30, MA apex and KEF 9000. The MT-30 and KEF's wereblown away. The sound of MA apex is soo much more detailed. This will be my new system, that's for sure. Listened in combination with a Onkyo 3008. Sounded really really good. And that for such a small speaker. It's not as good as most floostanders but of looks and sound are important this is the speaker to buy.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm considering upgrading from the B&W MT-30 to the Apex and I have a few questions:

1. Is the Apex that much better than the MT-30? Please be honest

2. Is my Yamaha RX-V1800 a good match for the Apex?

3. What cable would be a good option to connect the amp to the speakers?

4. I have an offer to buy the 5.1 Apex with 4 stands for EUR 2,250 which I think is a good price. How much do you think I would be able to get for the B&W? Speakers are 3 years old and the PV1 is 1 year old. What's the best way to sell them? MA dealer will not take them for a discount.

Hello, I am quite new to this forum (not the magazine). But would you mind telling me where you can buy this set for that price? Is that in the Netherlands? The complete set here in Holland is way over 3K eur. Hope you still visit this forum so you can answer (if you like).

Went for a audition to listern to the MT-30, MA apex and KEF 9000. The MT-30 and KEF's wereblown away. The sound of MA apex is soo much more detailed. This will be my new system, that's for sure. Listened in combination with a Onkyo 3008. Sounded really really good. And that for such a small speaker. It's not as good as most floostanders but of looks and sound are important this is the speaker to buy.

Hello, well that price is from the Cyprus MA dealer. They said 2.650 is the price but with a discount 2.250. That was in January and I don't know if anything's changed now. I'm currently between this and a B&W CM8 system but I don't know if I want to go with big floorstanders. How do they compare with decent floorstanders in your opinion? And are they that much better than the MT-30? I wouldn't want to upgrade to a similar system only for a small improvement.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

So what cables are recommeded with these Apex then?, also how does QED Silver Anniversary XT fair with them and also Monitor Audio RX6 AV12 speaker package?

Cheers

 

[MUSICRAFT]

So what cables are recommeded with these Apex then?, also how does QED Silver Anniversary XT fair with them and also Monitor Audio RX6 AV12 speaker package?

Cheers

Hi gel

I would highly recommend using standard speaker cables with 79 - 500 strands of OFC for use with Apex and Silver RX6 AV12 speakers :bigsmile: If you can accomodate them then i feel the Silver RX6 AV12 is a better overall package then the Apex with music or movie soundtracks.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Frank Harvey]

So what cables are recommeded with these Apex then?, also how does QED Silver Anniversary XT fair with them and also Monitor Audio RX6 AV12 speaker package?
Cheers

If people want a slightly warmer sound, try QED's Original or Chord's Carnival Silver Screen. If more treble emphasis is required, use QED Silver Anniversary, or the Chord Rumour 2.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

Excellent, cheers guys.

 

[duaplex]

I will chip in here too.

Generally I has always believe that your system is only as good as your cable. Of course this depends on the AV you are using to Drive your apex, no ppoint spending £30 a meter if you are using a £500 etc. Carnival silver is great as David mentioned, and is WHF top pick of the cables on the best buy guide. Its reasonbale too.

Consider the QED Sub cable too, its really second to none!

 

[duaplex]

I'm considering upgrading from the B&W MT-30 to the Apex and I have a few questions:

1. Is the Apex that much better than the MT-30? Please be honest

2. Is my Yamaha RX-V1800 a good match for the Apex?

3. What cable would be a good option to connect the amp to the speakers?

4. I have an offer to buy the 5.1 Apex with 4 stands for EUR 2,250 which I think is a good price. How much do you think I would be able to get for the B&W? Speakers are 3 years old and the PV1 is 1 year old. What's the best way to sell them? MA dealer will not take them for a discount.

Hello, I am quite new to this forum (not the magazine). But would you mind telling me where you can buy this set for that price? Is that in the Netherlands? The complete set here in Holland is way over 3K eur. Hope you still visit this forum so you can answer (if you like).

Went for a audition to listern to the MT-30, MA apex and KEF 9000. The MT-30 and KEF's wereblown away. The sound of MA apex is soo much more detailed. This will be my new system, that's for sure. Listened in combination with a Onkyo 3008. Sounded really really good. And that for such a small speaker. It's not as good as most floostanders but of looks and sound are important this is the speaker to buy.

Hello, well that price is from the Cyprus MA dealer. They said 2.650 is the price but with a discount 2.250. That was in January and I don't know if anything's changed now. I'm currently between this and a B&W CM8 system but I don't know if I want to go with big floorstanders. How do they compare with decent floorstanders in your opinion? And are they that much better than the MT-30? I wouldn't want to upgrade to a similar system only for a small improvement.

Is it possible for you to test these speakers and have a demo?

To answer your question, the MT-30 is no where near as good as the Apex and the upgrade is warrented. The Apex is a stunning sat/sub combination in that field and has not been topped, certainly not by anything I have heard in that price range. You would need to look at some really expensive MK speakers at £900 a pair to really beat it!

Now in comparision to floorstands, again this is going to be a personal choice. If you ask me I will tell you that the Apex has no chance against the CM8 and its a no brainer. A floorstand will always deliver a mid range sound that the Apex will not and for me thats were sub/sat lacks... while its beautiful and clear there is that middle part missing for me and I can hear it! But and this is a big BUT, you may prefer the Apex sound over the floorstanding speaker. Tihs is only one opinion im giving you.

Then you need to ask yourself, how big is your room? Can you love with floorstands?, Are the acoustics correct? Do you want it for Music, films or both?

You need to demo it! Also what AV are you going to use? I would suggest at least an LX73 pioneer for the APex, and LX83 is possible and if you go for the CM8 and LX83 is a big must!

 

[Anonymous]

Is it possible for you to test these speakers and have a demo?

To answer your question, the MT-30 is no where near as good as the Apex and the upgrade is warrented. The Apex is a stunning sat/sub combination in that field and has not been topped, certainly not by anything I have heard in that price range. You would need to look at some really expensive MK speakers at £900 a pair to really beat it!

Now in comparision to floorstands, again this is going to be a personal choice. If you ask me I will tell you that the Apex has no chance against the CM8 and its a no brainer. A floorstand will always deliver a mid range sound that the Apex will not and for me thats were sub/sat lacks... while its beautiful and clear there is that middle part missing for me and I can hear it! But and this is a big BUT, you may prefer the Apex sound over the floorstanding speaker. Tihs is only one opinion im giving you.

Then you need to ask yourself, how big is your room? Can you love with floorstands?, Are the acoustics correct? Do you want it for Music, films or both?

You need to demo it! Also what AV are you going to use? I would suggest at least an LX73 pioneer for the APex, and LX83 is possible and if you go for the CM8 and LX83 is a big must!

I live in Cyprus and it's kind of hard to test both in the same environment with the same electronics. The Yamaha RX-V1800 is my amplifier and it's not going to change. No budget for that. The setup is 100% for movies and my room's dimensions are 4,5*3,5m. TV and seating are set at the longest 2 walls and distance between them is 2,5m.

The thing is I have to make the best possible decision without demoing because even if I demo it's going to be in 2 different shops with different cables electronics environment etc. Should I trust 2 demos with so many different factors affecting performance? And i'm afraid floorstanders are too much for my room. Do bigger speakers mean necessarily bigger sound? There are thick curtains and soft cushions in my room which I've been said can affect performance.

So what do you think? Would the Apex give me what I've been missing from the MT-30 or should I go for the CM8?