Ten Year Old Hi-Fi Question

[ESP2009]

Back in the late 20th Century I went through the angst-ridden process of upgrading my hi-fi system. I purchased, with What Hi-Fi’s guidance, the Marantz CD-63 II KI Signature CD-player, the Audiolab 8000S amplifier and a pair of TDL RTL2 speakers. To these I added what was, at the time, considered the appropriate level of interconnects. These items were installed in the room where I did most of my listening.

This new kit, I considered too good to be used in our living room where my previous set-up (also based on What Hi-Fi recommendations) resided, occasionally lending weight to our tele-visual experiences. This equipment being to this day the Kenwood 3020 SE Amp, Pioneer PD-S703, Mission 760i speakers on sand-filled Atacama stands, and Sony ST-S261 receiver (admittedly a later addition).

As a result of our trusty 32” CRT TV developing a fault, in a sudden rush of blood to the head, I leapt into the 21st century in the living room with the highly rated Sony KDL-40W4000 HD TV and Sony BDP-S350 Blu-ray player. Together with our Virgin Media V+ cable box, this technological leap forward is all HDMi linked…except, of course, the sound system (and the VCR).

Now, in this brave new century of fully-developed home cinema systems, I am wondering what my next step should be. To be honest, I doubt that we would get the full benefit of the all-singing, multi-speakered home cinema experience [certain people in the household don’t appreciate that kind of thing!], but even so I do wonder how the various components I have stand in comparison with what is available today, and if the Marantz, Audiolab and TDLs, etc, could have any place in association with the new TV, Blu-ray player and the cable box?

If not, how do they rate against the newer generation of equipment, even so? Does the Marantz compare favourably with its younger cousins? How much would I need to spend, ten years on, to equal or better what I already have? Is it time to put my 10-yr old equipment out to grass and move on? Is it time to consider a dedicated AV component? Or , with decent interconnects, am I just as well to stick with what I have?

I would be most interested to hear what you think.

 

[idc]

Your Marantz, Audiolab, TDL set up will still hold its own. If it ain't broke don't fix it. There is always the thought that there is something better out there, but if you are still happy with the sound I would be loathed to start messing about too much. My upgrades over the years have been to replace faulty items, or because I was not happy with the sound.

Now this is just a suggestion, please do not take offence! A friend has a similar system and it still sounds excellent. However, he has never cleaned it, it sits under layers of dust and the plug and interconnects have not been touched in more than 10 years. Have you given your set up a spring clean, brasso or detoxit on the plug and interconnects will make a surprising difference.

 

[the record spot]

This past year, I bought a new CD player to replace my elderly Linn Mimik. I also updated my (11 year old) Mission 733i floorstanders with a pair of Mission 752's (from 1994!). In the end, there haven't been too many leaps forward in the technology of 1999 and 2009. If you still enjoy what you hear, don't mess around with it too much.

 

[Anonymous]

I can't comment on the merits of putting your 2-channel hi-fi out to pasture and replacing it with a dedicated AV system as that is not my thing.

But I would say that 10-year old hi-fi, such as that you have, would still stand up well against brand new kit. 10 years is really not that old. If you were wanting to replace your 2-channel hi-fi with some more 2-channel hi-fi, you would not really get any benefit of buying brand new kit at the same price point as your old stuff.

I still have my Dad's 30 year old Technics amp in the attic because, IMO, it sounded better than some £250 new (in 1999) amps that I had demo'd.

 

[Anonymous]

I agree with what's being said here about 10 year old hifi being perfectly good. I have plenty of old gear (read my sig) and have got rid of much more besides. My only complaints are down to taste and this plays more of a part in hifi enjoyment (IMHO) unless you actually sit there analysing your "sound".

I think your Marantz/Audiolab setup will sound great today so dont be railroaded into changing. My main driver for change (like your has been) is to get the latest formats or HD, with which its instantly obvious you've made the upgrade.

However!
After saying all that, I woudl recommend you join the 5.1 revolution as in terms of upgrades you will notice, it really will be the same as going from DVD to Blu Ray! My wife was dead against "all those extra boxes and speakers" until after about 2 months of having our system she started asking me to put on the THX intro just to listen to it! After that she actually suggested we get new AV speakers, talk about a conversion.

So don't assume AV sound upgrades are just for certain types of people.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes I would agree with what has been said, after all a good sound is a good sound.
Well made Hi Fi 10-20 yrs old, provided it has been looked after and serviced once in a while, should still have the detail, presence and sparkle that made it an enjoyable listen.

Its the big revolution in AV 5:1 systems and sound formats that has been the change along with the value for money aspect of the sound you get for it.

Love watching TV and Films through it now.

 

[ESP2009]

My thanks to those of you who have taken the time to respond. The replies have been considered, sensible and reassuring.

I must admit that I have not listened to the prime set-up properly in what seems like ages. I think changes in lifestyle and such creep up on you before you know where you are. Suddenly, the good stuff is, just like the mentioned friend's, neglected, in need of some TLC and maybe should be brought into the living room out of the cold. But how to integrate?

OK, so I have perfectly fine hi-fi separates that have given me great listening pleasure, but is it possible to successfully combine these with AV? I don't want to say goodbye to decent components that have certainly addressed my listening needs in the not too distant past, but how do you combine this with the 'requirements' of the enhanced AV experience when watching films? Yes, it would be nice to gradually introduce the concept of 5:1 into the household, but are they mutually exclusive concepts without replacement/supplement?

More discussion to follow..?

 

[idc]

Generally speaking if you want the best of both worlds you would be better keeping your hifi as it is and getting a separate surround sound system for the AV.

But you can combine them; my mate started off with a surround amp with just the TDLs and then switched to floorstander Missions either side of the TV and the TDLs were used as the surround speakers. Then he added a REL subwoofer. But the last time I visited a tweeter had blown on the Missions, so he now has the TDLs blue tacked on top of them! It sounds very good, but is somewhat crude. But a surround amp using your TDLs as initially the main speakers either side of the TV (check whether they have magnetic shielding, my mate has a good 50cm gap between TV and speakers) would be a start. You then add surround speakers and a subwoofer and can mix and match as you want. He uses the Marantz amp for the CD player. It all sounds good, but he uses a lot of space, the wiring is very complicated and he uses an old TV, DVD and VHS along with playstations, Wii etc also pluged in. I dont think even he knows how it all manages to work!

You could try and put the speakers either side of the TV and move the hifi so you can use phono cables to connect the TV to spare inputs on the amp. I used to do that with a Panasonic TV into my Rega Mira amp and B&W speakers. But it is not and never will be surround sound.

 

[ESP2009]

Thanks idc for the further advice. I admit that at this point I am likely to go the 'Heath Robinson' route much as your friend has. I think the AV amp and dedicated system will come a bit later this year or next. At present, the lesser set-up of hi-fi components resides in the unit directly under the TV, and has offered a form of stereo facility to our TV audio for some time. The Mission speakers sit at least a metre away, on either side.

I am tempted to bring the 'good stuff' in and connect it up as you describe as a starting point. A proper upgrade can follow when I have replenished the cash reserves! ;o) And, yes, the spaghetti behind the unit on which the TV sits is already most daunting! Some labelling helps. )

 

[Anonymous]

As suggested you could just add your HiFi Gear to your TV for stereo music listening and an instant improvement to your TV/Film soundtracks (albeit stereo).

Next can come your 5.1 receiver (starting at £100 on ebay or a cheap Richer Sounds brand) this can pre-out to your HiFi amp to improve the front chanels and retain your HiFi listening. you need to check the AV amp supports pre-outs however but I think its common.

Then get a cheap pair of speakers for the rear off ebay (£20 for some Gale or old mission), you can run the amp in "phantom" mode so you dont even need a centre speaker to start with.

And this is where the snowball turns into an avalanche - trust me!

 

[ESP2009]

) I can already hear the distant sound of that avalanche! ;o) Thanks for the added advice. I'm sure it's all being followed by plenty of other interested readers.

I've just been sorting through my file of old manuals and receipts and such. It seems that I bought the Marantz and Audiolab in 1997 but, even so, the amp actually has a pre-power AV mode.

I haven't really read up on the whole set-up thing for the AV side of life, but imagine that I can bring in the Audiolab and Marantz CD-player (and give the connections a good clean!) In addition to the Marantz, I can add the Sony tuner, Virgin-Media V+, Sony Blu-ray and the Philips VCR. I imagine the Audiolab has enough 'grunt' to deal with the TDL speakers for the front, with the Mission 760i speakers for the rear.

Then, at some future date, I can add an AV amp with a little advice from someone who knows what they're doing. ;o)

Of course, further development is subject to discussion with the other decision-maker of the house. Maybe smaller rear speakers will be a more diplomatic solution.

Quite what I do with the Kenwood amp and the Pioneer CD-player is something for further consideration. Perhaps eBay beckons.

 

[Anonymous]

ESP2009:
) I can already hear the distant sound of that avalanche! ;o) Thanks for the added advice. I'm sure it's all being followed by plenty of other interested readers.

I've just been sorting through my file of old manuals and receipts and such. It seems that I bought the Marantz and Audiolab in 1997 but, even so, the amp actually has a pre-power AV mode.

I haven't really read up on the whole set-up thing for the AV side of life, but imagine that I can bring in the Audiolab and Marantz CD-player (and give the connections a good clean!) In addition to the Marantz, I can add the Sony tuner, Virgin-Media V+, Sony Blu-ray and the Philips VCR. I imagine the Audiolab has enough 'grunt' to deal with the TDL speakers for the front, with the Mission 760i speakers for the rear.

Then, at some future date, I can add an AV amp with a little advice from someone who knows what they're doing. ;o)

Almost.
If I understand your proposal you want to use the Audiolab to power the TDLs (front) and Missions (rear)?
You cant do this for two reasons, one the Audiolab is a stereo not 5.1 amp and secondly you dont have any surround sound processing. To do this you will need to buy a second AV/5.1 amp by someone like Sony/Yamaha/Onkyo.

My point was that you can still integrate your audiolab into this AV system by using the pre-outs on your new AV amp to input into the pre-ins on the Audiolab. You can then input all your stereo sources into the Audiolab amp and AV sources into the AV amp via HDMi or optical.

In the mean time however you can still start off integrating your stereo system as it will still sound great. The V+, BDP-S350, tuner, cd, etc can all connect to the Audiolab via good old phonos.

Hope this makes sense??

 

[ESP2009]

Yes, that makes plenty of sense, thanks AR. I had thought to use the Missions despite not having the 5.1 facility, but it is probably not worth it - I imagine it would not add to the sound. Might as well take your advice and wait for the true AV kit before adding further speakers. Unless someone knows better of course...

 

[Anonymous]

ESP2009:Yes, that makes plenty of sense, thanks AR. I had thought to use the Missions despite not having the 5.1 facility, but it is probably not worth it - I imagine it would not add to the sound. Might as well take your advice and wait for the true AV kit before adding further speakers. Unless someone knows better of course...

If you have two sets of speaker posts on the back of the Audiolab then in theory you could run two pairs of speakers provided the total impedance was supported by the amp. But its not really what its designed for, they are only to facilitate biwiring or two room listening i.e. kitchen and lounge. I think ti would sound worse in this set-up.

Stick to stereo output for now, it'll still sound great for films!