Taken in Isolation.....

CnoEvil

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I believe that isolation and resonance control of hifi components is is a very important, and often overlooked part of a system. There are a plethora of products available, from cheap DIY solutions, to absurdly expensive platforms and racks. Solutions can come in the form of soft and spongey (eg.Sorbathane), to cones made of different materials, to expensive "floating" suspensions (Townsend Audio) and hi-tech pads (Black Ravioli). IMO The material used for the rack or platform, be it wood, glass, laminated glass, marble, granite or slate has an effect on the sound. Different solutions are needed depending on: (a) Which bit of gear is being targeted ie.TT (with/without suspension), CDP/Streamer, Amps (Pre/Power/Valves), Speakers/Sub. (b) The construction of the floor and walls. The idea of this thread is to share experiences as to what has or hasn't worked (for the benefit of others), especially under the electronics (as there has been a lot of coverage in the past about speakers and subs). Although, what I will say about speakers, is whether they should be coupled to the floor with spikes (concrete), or de-coupled Auralex Gramma/Townsend/Track Audio etc. (suspended).
 

altruistic.lemon

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Are you talking turntables? Separate wall shelf is what I used to recommend. If not, an Ikea table if you've got a concrete floor like most of suburban Australia has.

Bookshelf speakers I'd put on metal stands, but wouldn't be able to give a reason why.

The rest of the gear doesn't matter so much, though I avoid putting stuff on top of each other in case of electrical interference.

Also, most specialist stands and cabinets look so **** they're a disaster in the lounge.
 

Big Chris

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Slightly off topic I'm aware, but it did make me chuckle at the recent Yamaha receiver test that they made all this hoo-ha over a fifth, central foot (I think they even named it!). My old Arcam amps have a fifth central foot and I don't think it was even mentioned by Arcam, let alone trumpeted.
 

CnoEvil

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altruistic.lemon said:
Are you talking turntables? Separate wall shelf is what I used to recommend. If not, an Ikea table if you've got a concrete floor like most of suburban Australia has.

Bookshelf speakers I'd put on metal stands, but wouldn't be able to give a reason why.

The rest of the gear doesn't matter so much, though I avoid putting stuff on top of each other in case of electrical interference.

Also, most specialist stands and cabinets look so **** they're a disaster in the lounge.

Apologies, my paragraphing has vanished. |(

Absolutely; the idea is that it's an open discussion, where folks can pass on their experiences (good and bad), on any part of their system.

Once components have been chosen (hard enough in itself), this is about how to get the best from them. Resonance and vibration are nearly always detrimental to the sound being produced.
 

altruistic.lemon

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CnoEvil said:
Apologies, my paragraphing has vanished. |( Absolutely; the idea is that it's an open discussion, where folks can pass on their experiences (good and bad), on any part of their system. Once components have been chosen (hard enough in itself), this is about how to get the best from them. Resonance and vibration are nearly always detrimental to the sound being produced.
Nah, I don't bother with that stuff, life's too short. Grab yourself a decent Margaret River or NE Victorian wine and listen to the music, lots more fun.
 

CnoEvil

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altruistic.lemon said:
CnoEvil said:
Apologies, my paragraphing has vanished. |( Absolutely; the idea is that it's an open discussion, where folks can pass on their experiences (good and bad), on any part of their system. Once components have been chosen (hard enough in itself), this is about how to get the best from them. Resonance and vibration are nearly always detrimental to the sound being produced.
Nah, I don't bother with that stuff, life's too short. Grab yourself a decent Margaret River or NE Victorian wine and listen to the music, lots more fun.

You my friend, have the right idea. :cheers:

Ironically, Mrs. Cno is off for a girly weekend doing just that.....while I'm on "stay at home" duty, refereeing the kids and mopping up puppy piddle. :help:
 

CnoEvil

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Big Chris said:
Slightly off topic I'm aware, but it did make me chuckle at the recent Yamaha receiver test that they made all this hoo-ha over a fifth, central foot (I think they even named it!).

....."Jake" (the peg, with the extra leg)......deedle eedle eedle um. :(
 

Big Chris

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CnoEvil said:
altruistic.lemon said:
CnoEvil said:
Apologies, my paragraphing has vanished. |( Absolutely; the idea is that it's an open discussion, where folks can pass on their experiences (good and bad), on any part of their system. Once components have been chosen (hard enough in itself), this is about how to get the best from them. Resonance and vibration are nearly always detrimental to the sound being produced.
Nah, I don't bother with that stuff, life's too short. Grab yourself a decent Margaret River or NE Victorian wine and listen to the music, lots more fun.

You my friend, have the right idea. :cheers: Ironically, Mrs. Cno is off for a girly weekend doing just that.....while I'm on "stay at home" duty, refereeing the kids and mopping up puppy piddle. :help:

Funnily enough, The Wife is away visiting her cousin in Brighton leaving me home alone too.

I was gonna go to Blockbuster and rent a couple of movies and maybe pop into Dominoes and pick up something spicy for my dinner.:)
 

CnoEvil

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Big Chris said:
Funnily enough, The Wife is away visiting her cousin in Brighton leaving me home alone too.

I was gonna go to Blockbuster and rent a couple of movies and maybe pop into Dominoes and pick up something spicy for my dinner.:)

If you haven't already seen it, try "Inception".
 

Big Chris

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CnoEvil said:
Big Chris said:
Funnily enough, The Wife is away visiting her cousin in Brighton leaving me home alone too.

I was gonna go to Blockbuster and rent a couple of movies and maybe pop into Dominoes and pick up something spicy for my dinner.:)

If you haven't already seen it, try "Inception".

Seen it (at the cinema), bought it (BD) and even bought the soundtrack (CD). Excellent film.

I rented a couple of trashy movies I know she wouldn't like. 'Drive Angry' & 'The Mechanic'. Currently watching 'Drive Angry'...

I know I must be getting old when the groans of unattainable pleasure are aimed not at Amber Heard, but at the matt black '69 Charger.:D
 

chebby

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Not fair!

Just finished 5 evening shifts at 11pm yesterday and now i'm on two 12 hour night shifts (7pm - 7am) over the weekend*.

Although I do start a 13 day break at 7am on Tuesday :)

*Not so bad really. I work from home, nothing has 'kicked-off' yet, and right now I am about 15 minutes away from tucking into a home-cooked goulash. (Also I get to watch the Grand Prix, live, in the morning).
 

CnoEvil

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Big Chris said:
I know I must be getting old when the groans of unattainable pleasure are aimed not at Amber Heard, but at the matt black '69 Charger.:D

I hear you.....I'm like the old bloke, that when offered "super sex" said, "I think I'll just have the soup". :D

I think your trashy movies might just be better than the X Factor. :(
 

Overdose

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altruistic.lemon said:
CnoEvil said:
Apologies, my paragraphing has vanished. |( Absolutely; the idea is that it's an open discussion, where folks can pass on their experiences (good and bad), on any part of their system. Once components have been chosen (hard enough in itself), this is about how to get the best from them. Resonance and vibration are nearly always detrimental to the sound being produced.
Nah, I don't bother with that stuff, life's too short. Grab yourself a decent Margaret River or NE Victorian wine and listen to the music, lots more fun.

More of a Marlborough man myself. ;)

Back to the OP, I have been down this route, particulary on the DIY front. I tried various means to 'damp' a CD player. It was a Cambridge CD500 SE and eventually had a billet aluminium base plate bonded on, with vibration dampening material stuck here there and everywhere. Looked impressive, but I'm not so sure it did anything to the sound.

I'm now of the belief, after various attempts to improve SQ, that the only components that benefit to any degree with dampening or vibration isolation, are the turntable and CD player, but even then, no normal household vibrations are going to put a CD player off stride, a turntable on wonky floorboards maybe.

For a belt and braces approach though, you'd do worse than go for a soildly built rack, table, stand, or whatever you are going to use, that is sturdy, non resonant and stable.

I now use whatever furniture fits in with my room decor, or what is available regarding table or sideboard real estate, not really having a traditional hifi set up any more, a rack seems a bit pointless.
 

CnoEvil

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Thx OD for the insight.

FWIW The biggest improvement that I've heard came from Black Ravioli. It's fairly expensive, but it works....it appears to drain resonance from the component its under, as well as isolating it - this enhances the sound without changing it.
 

Overdose

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CnoEvil said:
Thx OD for the insight. FWIW The biggest improvement that I've heard came from Black Ravioli. It's fairly expensive, but it works....it appears to drain resonance from the component its under, as well as isolating it - this enhances the sound without changing it.

As a matter of interest, which components have you tried it under and how would you describe the enhancement in sound?
 

CnoEvil

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Overdose said:
As a matter of interest, which components have you tried it under and how would you describe the enhancement in sound?

I started a thread about my findings here:
http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/black-ravioli

I would like to thoroughly test some "Big Feet" under my amp, but I'm all spent out at the moment.
 

nopiano

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Hi Cno, I certainly believe most of this stuff makes a difference, even when I wish it didn't.

A local bespoke dealer, The Right Note, seems to sell more products that handle mains, vibration and so on than gear at the moment. Customers see it is better value to buy a mains product for a grand than a new CDP for three times that. Vertex AQ is his leading range.

I recently heard a home system with Finite Elemente pagode stands and Cerapod supports everywhere, which I reckon cost about the same as my entire system. But was probably only about 15% of the cost of the system it was in. Unable to hear without, so hard to say what contributes what, but the owner is clearly a convert!

To the disbelievers, I'd direct them to your answer in the recent Hi Fi Doctor thread and try something that costs a few pence, before deciding.
 

nopiano

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PS. Looking back at the Black Ravioli thread, did you ever get those Myrtle Blocks, because I saw these recently:-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AYRE-MYRTLE-BLOCKS-QTY-3-GREAT-VALUE-ISOLATORS-/120791891815?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_EquipmentStands_SM&hash=item1c1fc1ff67#ht_827wt_1141
 

CnoEvil

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nopiano said:
PS. Looking back at the Black Ravioli thread, did you ever get those Myrtle Blocks, because I saw these recently:-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AYRE-MYRTLE-BLOCKS-QTY-3-GREAT-VALUE-ISOLATORS-/120791891815?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_EquipmentStands_SM&hash=item1c1fc1ff67#ht_827wt_1141

Hmmm. I haven't as yet come up with a way to tell Mrs Cno, that my system needs to have the S/C liffted off the floor, on little wooden blocks (with a V cut in them). Not only that, it has to be Myrtle wood!! :?

Any suggestions?
 

CJSF

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CnoEvil said:
nopiano said:
PS. Looking back at the Black Ravioli thread, did you ever get those Myrtle Blocks, because I saw these recently:-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AYRE-MYRTLE-BLOCKS-QTY-3-GREAT-VALUE-ISOLATORS-/120791891815?pt=UK_ConsumerElectronics_EquipmentStands_SM&hash=item1c1fc1ff67#ht_827wt_1141

Hmmm. I haven't as yet come up with a way to tell Mrs Cno, that my system needs to have the S/C liffted off the floor, on little wooden blocks (with a V cut in them). Not only that, it has to be Myrtle wood!! :? Any suggestions?

I know certain forms of isolation are a good thing, but . . . 'Who is kidding who' . . . ? By the way the sound will be 'different' . . . :?

CJSF
 

nopiano

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CnoEvil said:
Hmmm. I haven't as yet come up with a way to tell Mrs Cno, that my system needs to have the S/C liffted off the floor, on little wooden blocks (with a V cut in them). Not only that, it has to be Myrtle wood!! :? Any suggestions?

Well, either say it protects the house from lightening, or use old eggboxes like I do. Mine are hidden behind a cabinet though, otherwise we'd be worrying if the Tesco box sounded worse than the Waitrose one!!
 

CnoEvil

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CJSF said:
I know certain forms of isolation are a good thing, but . . . 'Who is kidding who' . . . ? By the way the sound will be 'different' . . . :?

CJSF

I handle the dubious honour of "eccentric crackpot" with aplomb.....but this could just be pushing it! 8)
 

Overdose

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nopiano said:
Well, either say it protects the house from lightening, or use old eggboxes like I do. Mine are hidden behind a cabinet though, otherwise we'd be worrying if the Tesco box sounded worse than the Waitrose one!!

Tescos egg boxes! Now that's just silly.

Everyone knows the Asda boxes are best. ;)

I have tried squash balls by the way. Cut in half, they work quite well, but then you have the added complication of dot choice. :grin:
 

CnoEvil

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nopiano said:
CnoEvil said:
Hmmm. I haven't as yet come up with a way to tell Mrs Cno, that my system needs to have the S/C liffted off the floor, on little wooden blocks (with a V cut in them). Not only that, it has to be Myrtle wood!! :? Any suggestions?

Well, either say it protects the house from lightening, or use old eggboxes like I do. Mine are hidden behind a cabinet though, otherwise we'd be worrying if the Tesco box sounded worse than the Waitrose one!!

I should have said "eggcentric crackpot", and that would have been "boxing clever!" :(
 

CnoEvil

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Overdose said:
I have tried squash balls by the way. Cut in half, they work quite well, but then you have the added complication of dot choice. :grin:

It all depends on the dynamic level of bounce you want from the music (Blue for Rock and Orange for Ballads)....though the Orange does take longer to warm up! :grin:
 

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