Startup Error NAD M2 Amplifier

[PeterC_85]

Hello,
My old Amplifier from 2012 Nad M2 have some problems.
When starting up it says:

Startup Error, Power off.

I have left it to the distributor and they sent it to service with the Verdict: Mainboard broken, there is no spare parts.

I then tried to send it to another compane. They checked all the hardware and components, saying everything is fine. They think its something with the software but cant fix it.
Ive seen that others had the same issue with it.
Any tips on what to do?

 

[Gray]

Ive seen that others had the same issue with it.
Any tips on what to do?

The obvious question Peter is, did any of those others get a cure for the problem?

Have you been in contact with NAD themselves?
If not, tell them what you've told us about the verdicts of potential repairers - and see what they suggest.

 

[davidf]

You have one count of the physical board being faulty, and one count of the physical board being fine, and pointing to software. I would get a third opinion, as one of them are lying. If that agrees with the software, present that to the retailer/distributor. If NAD’s distributor can’t supply replacement parts after 10 years - which isn’t unreasonable for an amplifier - ask them what they’re going to do to help you out replacing the whole unit.

Class D amplifiers might seem desirable from various points of view, but do bear in mind that this tech is open to improvement and obsolescence. Class AB amplifiers use mostly standard, off-the-shelf, serviceable parts, which means 50 year old amplifiers can still be serviced. if a Class D amplifier can’t be repaired after 10 years, I would class that as “throwaway tech”. Landfill fodder.

 

[James105]

Hello,
My old Amplifier from 2012 Nad M2 have some problems.
When starting up it says:

Startup Error, Power off.

I have left it to the distributor and they sent it to service with the Verdict: Mainboard broken, there is no spare parts.

I then tried to send it to another compane. They checked all the hardware and components, saying everything is fine. They think its something with the software but cant fix it.
Ive seen that others had the same issue with it.
Any tips on what to do?

I think you need to find a decent repair tech, I had a similar issue with my NAD 390DD a relation of the M2 where it wouldn't fully power up. There are no boards available off the shelf but like the AB amps David mentioned the component parts are, in my case 9 caps and an LED total cost of parts £8.42. The postage cost as much as the repair did.

 

[Gray]

...if a Class D amplifier can’t be repaired after 10 years, I would class that as “throwaway tech”. Landfill fodder.

...and totally unacceptable - not least when taking into account the original purchase price of the amp in question.

It's bad enough that it needs to be repaired, let alone being told it can't be 🤨

 

[davidf]

...and totally unacceptable - not least when taking into account the original purchase price of the amp in question.

It's bad enough that it needs to be repaired, let alone being told it can't be 🤨

I’ve only just realised it’s a full size jobby, and the price I’ve just seen is £5k! I was thinking it was like the little all-in-one £2k type boxes. Even more so then - completely unacceptable. NAD should be offering a major discount to upgrade to a current model if they can’t repair the old one.

 

[James105]

I’ve only just realised it’s a full size jobby, and the price I’ve just seen is £5k! I was thinking it was like the little all-in-one £2k type boxes. Even more so then - completely unacceptable. NAD should be offering a major discount to upgrade to a current model if they can’t repair the old one.

I'd go easy there, I don't see anywhere that NAD have said it can't be repaired 7oaks repaired my 390DD ( the same amp without the bling) for just over £100, postage £50, labour £42.50, parts £8.42.

 

[davidf]

I'd go easy there, I don't see anywhere that NAD have said it can't be repaired 7oaks repaired my 390DD ( the same amp without the bling) for just over £100, postage £50, labour £42.50, parts £8.42.

Well, I believe there is a link between the retailer and the distributor, and one of them doesn't seem to be being honest with the OP lying to the OP.

The OP said the unit was with the distributor, and they’ve said it’s unrepairable. An independent company says the hardware is fine, which points to software. Who’s wrong? If nobody is wrong, then NAD’s software needs some work.

 

[James105]

Well, I believe there is a link between the retailer and the distributor, and one of them doesn't seem to be being honest with the OP lying to the OP.

The OP said the unit was with the distributor, and they’ve said it’s unrepairable. An independent company says the hardware is fine, which points to software. Who’s wrong? If nobody is wrong, then NAD’s software needs some work.

True, but the OP has been to two different repairers who have given two different diagnoses. I don't know but I've always had good support from dealers in the UK, even for stuff I've bought on ebay or old gear I didnt buy from them. (one of those is you btw ).

But on the more international forums I am kinda shocked sometimes.

 

[davidf]

True, but the OP has been to two different repairers who have given two different diagnoses. I don't know but I've always had good support from dealers in the UK, even for stuff I've bought on ebay or old gear I didnt buy from them. (one of those is you btw ).

But on the more international forums I am kinda shocked sometimes.

Speakers are relatively easy repairs that can be done by the retailer. Unless electronics are of a modular, plug-in type design, the retailer is in the hands of trained engineers. In this case, we have the manufacturer’s/distributor’s engineers and an independent engineer saying opposing things. I’m not taking a side here. I recommended (and still do) that the OP get a third opinion, which may point to who isn’t doing their job properly.

If I was to side with anyone at this point, with the knowledge we have, it’d be the independent engineers who can’t find anything wrong with the electronics. I know some engineers aren’t completely au fait with Class modules, but the pre-amp section should be fairly standard stuff. Maybe they’ve missed something, but testing circuits is what they do.

Of course, to make better judgements, we’d need all the info, and we’d need to know how competent both engineers are. We can only recommend a course of action to the given info.

 

[PeterC_85]

The obvious question Peter is, did any of those others get a cure for the problem?

Have you been in contact with NAD themselves?
If not, tell them what you've told us about the verdicts of potential repairers - and see what they suggest.

Yes, i ve been in contact with NAD. But they tell me to leave it onbe more time to Hifiklubben in Sweden and then send it to Denmark NAD Service. Which i already have done. They just tell me to make them check the amplifier one more time.

 

[PeterC_85]

As you mention can try and fint a third company make a statement about the amplifier. Do you have any contact close to Sweden i can take contact with? Maybe in UK or something. I can just send the amplifier there and wait for the verdict from them.

 

[PeterC_85]

This is the from the mail back and forth with Hifiklubben and NAD.

Hi,
I spoke with Hifiklubben today and told them that your advise was to bring back the amplifier and take a second look at it.

Their response was:
Hello,

Ive been in contact with our service department in Denmark. They can not get a hold of a new mainboard so we can not help you. (NAD doesn’t build new spareparts to this amplifier)”
Sorry but we can not fix your M2.

Tony W. (NAD Electronics) HI Peter In Sweden, when dealing with Hi-Fi Klubben, you are dealing with NAD Electronics. They are not just a retail outlet for us, but their parent company is our representative in the region and have direct contact with us. Yes, please continue to work with them. Thank you Tony

Peter Is it possible to buy a new mainboard to And M2 from you? Peter

Peter Hello, So the recommendation is to return it to HIFklubben and make them have a second look? When searching online this seems to be a common issue for the Amplifier. Can you tell us anything about this issue which can help us solve it? Peter

Tony W. (NAD Electronics) Jul 20, 2023, 4:51 PM EDT Hi Peter Thank you for contacting NAD Electronics. In Sweden, I recommend you return to your local Hi-Fi Klubben as they are our long-standing partner and are best equipped to make a recommendation. Please have them take a second look again. All Hi-Fi Klubben locations are NAD Electronics Authorized Service Centers and they will be happy to assist you with a copy of this support request. We apologize for the inconvenience, but again thank you for your patience. Thank you for choosing NAD Electronics, HEART+SOUL You Can Hear. Tony

 

[Gray]

Thank you for choosing NAD Electronics, HEART+SOUL You Can Hear.

Advise them that you can hear neither the heart nor soul of your amp.
Tell them you've been patient, but now require a prompt resolution to the issue.

If necessary, show them this thread so that they can see the sort of publicity they're getting.

 

[JDL]

Advise them that you can hear neither the heart nor soul of your amp.
Tell them you've been patient, but now require a prompt resolution to the issue.

If necessary, show them this thread so that they can see the sort of publicity they're getting.

I sympathise with you honestly, which I know is no help. In my opinion NAD Electronics' attitude to this, including their seeming indifference towards you and others is unacceptable considering their own boasts about this product when it was brought to market and it's retail price.

 

[Al ears]

Whilst I can understand your frustration with NAD there's a possibility that any potential repairs might prove costly even in it can be done.
That said I would expect an amplifier to last more than 11 years.

 

[JDL]

Even if it proves costly, given that these amps were pretty expensive when new, and that they sound fantastic, even a costly repair would probably be worthwhile for some owners if they could as a result keep going for another 11 years? Besides that there's a principal involved. Is it fair to charge the sort of money that Nad did charge for these and then treat them as a throw away product. They should have ordered the parts necessary to keep them going for owners. Or is this an acceptable 'cost' or outcome for new and experimental designs?

 

[Al ears]

Even if it proves costly, given that these amps were pretty expensive when new, and that they sound fantastic, even a costly repair would probably be worthwhile for some owners if they could as a result keep going for another 11 years? Besides that there's a principal involved. Is it fair to charge the sort of money that Nad did charge for these and then treat them as a throw away product. They should have ordered the parts necessary to keep them going for owners. Or is this an acceptable 'cost' or outcome for new and experimental designs?

unfortunately companies cannot be expected to stock spare parts forever and simply don't.
It is obvious that this Class of amplifier cannot be easily repaired by your typical electronics technician.

 

[aversaurus]

11 years is not old at all for a amplifier it really isn't they should be good for 20+

 

[JDL]

11 years is not old at all for a amplifier it really isn't they should be good for 20+

Not this type of amp it seems.

 

[PeterC_85]

Thanks for your answers and support. I have come to conclusion that i need to buy a new amplifier. I will try to look and find a sparepart Nad M2 if its out there and then in the future try and repair it.
Any recommendations for a good amplifier to my BW 702 S2?

 

[Al ears]

Thanks for your answers and support. I have come to conclusion that i need to buy a new amplifier. I will try to look and find a sparepart Nad M2 if its out there and then in the future try and repair it.
Any recommendations for a good amplifier to my BW 702 S2?

New or used?
Budget?
What can you audition locally??
Rotel amps tend to go well with B&W but it also depends on what facilities you need in the amplifier.

 

[JDL]

I'm sure there's many different opinions but I've been using a pair of B&W 601 S3 speakers since 2007. First they were partnered with a Marantz PM7200 amp and I loved the sound. That amp is still perfect. Recently I bought a second hand 9 year old Marantz PM8500 amplifier as an upgrade (and it is sound wise) and new B&W 707 S2 speakers.
I'm a fan of Marantz amplifiers. I think they partner well with B&W speakers. I think they sound excellent, look excellent they're reliable and long lasting and they generally don't cost the earth.
I guess we all like what we get used to, especially if we like the sound, looks and price of the amp, and it has the correct inputs, outputs, power and ohms capability for our intended use.
Other people will definitely have different opinions.
However, my experience of Marantz so far has been favourable.