Room acoustics

[RobinKidderminster]

I do believe that room acoustics have more effect on overall sound than maybe anything else yet it is so difficult to get advice on how to get the best from our given environment. I dont mean the technical stuff about bass traps etc qhich only apply to those qith bespoke home cinema rooms but for us average lounge setups. I guess there are too many variables or maybe it cant be said that a certain layout can benefit from a certain configuration.

Just a thought before doing a little gardening. Cheers.

 

[Frank Harvey]

There are some aspects that can be predicted, but it's largely dependent on the room. Bass issues due to tanding waves can be predicted, and it's obviously safe to say that corners collect bass, as do room boundaries. HF reflection can be minimised fairly easily too, but again, the odd room here and there can throw up surprises.

Its usually the case that there's not enough info about the room posted on a forum to be able to get adequate help. Just because a room has some big soft sofas and big heavy curtains doesn't mean it'll be an absorbing environment, as the actual layout itself can pretty much make those heavy furnishing null and void.

 

[RobinKidderminster]

Thanks Frank. Do you think then, based on a room layout and some detail of its furnishings, is it possible to recomend particular equipment or the best adjustments that can be made? Can you suggest adjustments when rooms are non symetrical for example. Guess most of our rooms are far from ideal but we aim to get the best we can from our systems.

Cheers

 

[Frank Harvey]

David

It can be attempted, and I suppose those with more experience of different types of rooms, and different systems within the same rooms will be in a better position to comment.

 

[RobinKidderminster]

Thanks David (not Frank as in Frank ... sorry)

Not sure I can comment further but I regard my system as quite resonable where lesser systems in different rooms can sound better. I guess its not discussed much because there are no easy answers except - get the best system (and advice) cuz you are stuck with your room.

thanks again for your comments.

 

[Anonymous]

There are few things as important as room acoustics, in my mind. And comparatively cheap, at that. And it does not have to be too complicated, either. Here´s a link to my Bible:

http://www.sofsci.com/hifi-home-cinema

From the Intro:

Here’s a short quiz...You have 1,000 Euros to spend on upgrading your stereo or home theater system, what do you buy to get the most bang for your buck in sound quality? 1.Premium speaker cables
2.A new receiver
3.Room acoustic treatments
4.Hi-definition DVD player

If you answered anything other than ‘room acoustic treatments’, you might achieve only an incremental improvement in sound quality. If you answered ‘room acoustic treatments’ you would be making a significant upgrade. The reason is simple: The listening room is a critical component in the sound reproduction chain, at least as important as speakers, electronics, sources and cables, yet the listening room is often the most neglected component. When sound waves leave a speaker they interact with the walls, ceiling, floors, furnishings and other surfaces in the room causing room resonances and reflections that color the sound you ultimately hear.

 

[visionary]

I found this book made very interesting reading. He has a lot to say about the effect of the room and it's layout/furnishing

 

[VoodooDoctor]

I've become a room acoustics evangelist over the weekend.

I've always felt that there was probably something that could be done to tighten up the room as it has a tiled floor and I could stand in the corners and hear a pronounced echo. This is despite some soft furnishings and canvases on the walls. I bought some Soffits and bass traps from GIK Acoustics after sending them pictures of my room and measurements. Their technical adviser suggested the best products for the budget that I gave them.

My amplifier has been away getting repaired after overheating just before the Bank Holiday but returned on Friday to be re-installed into my system. Both music and home cinema listening have been transformed. With 2-channel sound, there used to be a slight left channel dominance. This has now gone and the bass is far tighter revealing much more detail in the whole song. I now know what is meant by "muddy" bass.

We watched Green Lantern last night on Blu-ray. The film is fairly average but there were plenty of scenes to put the 5.1 through its paces. All I can say is "Wow!". The treatments have absolutely transformed the soundstage in the room. Clear dialogue, punchy explosions and masses of detail. We went to see Prometheus at the local cinema last week and it felt overly loud and there was a rattling speaker at the back of the auditorium. I'm happy that now my system sounds far better than what they have to offer.

So, in conclusion, I'd encourage anyone to seriously consider acoustic treatment in their listening room before changing components and certainly before changing cables to find the sound they want. It's been the single most-effective upgrade I've made in a very long time.

 

[BenLaw]

I've become a room acoustics evangelist over the weekend.

I've always felt that there was probably something that could be done to tighten up the room as it has a tiled floor and I could stand in the corners and hear a pronounced echo. This is despite some soft furnishings and canvases on the walls. I bought some Soffits and bass traps from GIK Acoustics after sending them pictures of my room and measurements. Their technical adviser suggested the best products for the budget that I gave them.

My amplifier has been away getting repaired after overheating just before the Bank Holiday but returned on Friday to be re-installed into my system. Both music and home cinema listening have been transformed. With 2-channel sound, there used to be a slight left channel dominance. This has now gone and the bass is far tighter revealing much more detail in the whole song. I now know what is meant by "muddy" bass.

We watched Green Lantern last night on Blu-ray. The film is fairly average but there were plenty of scenes to put the 5.1 through its paces. All I can say is "Wow!". The treatments have absolutely transformed the soundstage in the room. Clear dialogue, punchy explosions and masses of detail. We went to see Prometheus at the local cinema last week and it felt overly loud and there was a rattling speaker at the back of the auditorium. I'm happy that now my system sounds far better than what they have to offer.

So, in conclusion, I'd encourage anyone to seriously consider acoustic treatment in their listening room before changing components and certainly before changing cables to find the sound they want. It's been the single most-effective upgrade I've made in a very long time.

Sounds great Any chance of some pics?

 

[VoodooDoctor]

I will do later. Just need to get them off the camera.

 

[kinda]

I agree wholeheartedly on the room acoustics.

An entry level Sony amp and budget Tannoy style speakers in a French cottage sounded at least as good to me as my mid-range Marantz Tannoy setup. The French room had no special treatments, was odd-shaped with spiral staircase stuck through it, lots of hard surfaces, and wouldn't be what you'd think is ideal, but it sounded good.

Also, having recently moved house my system sounds better than before, despite again non-ideal surroundings.

Floyd Toole's book The Acoustics and Psychoacoustics of Sound would be a good read. It looks at the theory of sound and why rooms might sound better / worse, then looks at ways to address issues and some common good practice. It would give a good background on the general topic, what kind of things to take into consideration and things to try to improve any room.

 

[VoodooDoctor]

I'm lucky to have a dedicated room so I get away with a bit more than if it was the family living room.

 

[CnoEvil]

Wow......I can see why the acoustic treatment makes such a difference!

Great job.

Cno

 

[BenLaw]

Nice! Thanks for the pics.

 

[RobinKidderminster]

Can I pop round for a cup of sugar?

What sort of cost please for those panels?

 

[VoodooDoctor]

These are on the back wall:

http://www.gikacoustics.co.uk/gik-acoustics-monster-bass-trap-8800-each-sold-1-per-box-8800-exc-vat10560-inc-vat-6-p.asp

Sides:

http://www.gikacoustics.co.uk/gik-acoustics-244-bass-trap-5600-each-sold-2-per-box-11200-exc-vat13440-inc-vat-5-p.asp

Soffits:

http://www.gikacoustics.co.uk/gik-acoustics-soffit-trap-17000-sold-1-ber-box-sold-1-per-box-17000-exc-vat20100-inc-vat-18-p.asp

Can't recommend enough using the form here: http://www.gikacoustics.com/uk_room_setup.php to get bespoke advice.

 

[Chewy]

I found this book made very interesting reading. He has a lot to say about the effect of the room and it's layout/furnishing

Thanks for the heads up Visionary, that looks interesting, I've ordered myself a copy!

To echo the comments made above, I agree that, from what I have read, treating the room adds far more value than virtually any other upgrade. My own voyage of discovery with room treatments will begin next year when I get to have a dedicated room at long last (after 10 years of dreaming of one!).

Given how effective room treatments appear to be, not only on an absolute basis, but in terms of bang for buck, it amazes me how frequently they are overlooked. Perhaps similar issues apply to others as they do to myself in that they wouldn't pass the WAF for a dual purpose room, but even so I frequently see dedicated rooms with no treatment at all.

I have also found these books worth while reads (if a little technical):

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/0240520092/ref=mp_s_a_1?qid=1340733784&sr=8-1

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/0071603328/ref=mp_s_a_5?qid=1340733784&sr=8-5

The latter is frequently quoted as being the bible for acoustic design of listening rooms, but as I have said its possibly not for those looking for a Dummies Guide.

Finally @ VoodooDoctor - that is a great looking room and great to see someone who has fully utilised proper acoustic treatments.

 

[WishTree]

What sort of cost please for those panels?

Please let us know the damage on the wallet to have a ballpark number before I write that e-mail

BTW, great set up!

 

[sheggs]

:dance:

Wow, these pictures look great. Could I use them for my facebook page?

 

[sheggs]

:dance:

Wow, these pictures look great. Could I use them for my facebook page?

 

[VoodooDoctor]

What sort of cost please for those panels?

Please let us know the damage on the wallet to have a ballpark number before I write that e-mail

BTW, great set up!

~£1300 all in. The Soffits being the most expensive items.

@sheggs - what's your Facebook page?

 

[Chewy]

What sort of cost please for those panels?

Please let us know the damage on the wallet to have a ballpark number before I write that e-mail

BTW, great set up!

I believe GIK quote all their prices on their UK website, so you can work out the cost from there.

That said it is much more cost effective to make your own if you are open to a bit if DIY - GIK make no secret of the fact that they use a similar high density rockwool to that commonly available from most DIY stores.

 

[sheggs]

Hi Voodoo doctor - GIK Acoustics Facebook page. We sometimes post nice lookig set ups on there

You can find it here - https://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/GIK-Acoustics/166729010031089

 

[VoodooDoctor]

Yes, no problem Sheggs. Post away. Bryan advised on the set up.

You should probably have a look at the Forum Rules about manufacturers posting on here, the Mods like you to declare it.

 

[ric71]

I think room acoustics play a huge role in the listening experience but if you can't treat your room a decent room EQ is the way to go. I use Anthems MRX 300 for its ARC EQ and it has transformed my listening experience in my room. Bass is now deep and tight and the soundstage is spot on. I would never go back to non EQ'd as I can't add treatments to my room.