Room Acoustics - Needs addressing, help wanted

[krish123]

Hi all,

i have been planning for a long time to address my room acoustics and want to address this now.

My room dimensions are as follows 16.8 F W X 6.9F H X 16.4 L.

I took the free room analysis from acoustic fields and it shows my RT60 times are high at over 3 seconds, i need to get this down to around 1 second.

he suggested 150Sq ft of foam around 50 squares. but with the brackets this came to 1450 dollars not including shipping.

This is quite a bit over my budget and wondered if there are any alternatives which would be cheaper.

I would prefer bigger panels around 6 of them in total to cover each wall, and would like them wrappen in wither a canvas or some sort of wood, i dont want just plain foam appearing all over the room. I want to make the room as neat as possible.

has anyone done anything similiar and could you advise of any products that do the job well that dont cost to much ?

 

[RobinKidderminster]

In one word - Rockwool. Search here and elsewhere for room acoustic advice.

 

[BigH]

You can get acoustic rockwool from DIY stores. Cover in canvas or similar material should work but wood I don't think would. You want it at the reflection points, use a mirror on the wall to find where these are. I don't think you will need 150sf. Do you have a carpet or rug on the floor?

 

[p_m_brown]

Check out GIK acoustics. Lots of info on their site and they are very helpful over the phone too.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

hi mate how are dali opticon 8s going i have just upgraded to the 8s myself but waitting for them to come from dali *smile*

you can buy bass traps of ebay but will cost or there is lots of utube video's showing you how to make your own bass traps

 

[iceman16]

Check out GIK acoustics. Lots of info on their site and they are very helpful over the phone too.

+1

I use GIK acoustic bass traps in my small listening room and they worked perfectly. Very helpfull and friendly staff and you can ask for customised size acoustic panels and bass traps too.

 

[krish123]

hi mate how are dali opticon 8s going i have just upgraded to the 8s myself but waitting for them to come from dali *smile*

you can buy bass traps of ebay but will cost or there is lots of utube video's showing you how to make your own bass traps

Yh great mate, fine speakers but my room is letting them down so they cannot show there true potential, cant wait to get the room sorted and see there real potential.

 

[krish123]

I have got in touch with GIK Acoustics, they seem to have the right products that can be implemented in my room and there panels arent to bad looking, im going to use the colours they offer to make the room look decent aswell.

I.e use a black panel next to a red one and the same on the opposite wall for instance, i think it will look quite nice.

Just need to plan with GIK where to place everything and which products to go for.

Anyone who has tried them, can you let me know wat you bought and the effect they had on the room ?

 

[Blacksabbath25]

I have got in touch with GIK Acoustics, they seem to have the right products that can be implemented in my room and there panels arent to bad looking, im going to use the colours they offer to make the room look decent aswell.

I.e use a black panel next to a red one and the same on the opposite wall for instance, i think it will look quite nice.

Just need to plan with GIK where to place everything and which products to go for.

Anyone who has tried them, can you let me know wat you bought and the effect they had on the room ?

I was looking at bass traps myself but with the opticon 8s do you get any bass boom coming from them ?

 

[emperor's new clothes]

Hi Krish123,

GIK are the RollsRoyce. I bought some accoustic foam bass traps for £40 - aesthetics not an issue as HiFi in an upstairs room. They were very effective behind Dynaudio standmounts and equally so behind the Opticons. The speakers are 80cm from the rear wall and front ported Ikons 28cm. Both benefit from as much free space as you can give them and for the 8s 30cm absolute minimum, IMHO. As the foam bass traps are easliy moved and self supporting, I've experimented with position and bass performance changes with quite small adjustments. There is no doubt that, depending on room, bass traps really work and I am as sceptical as any about "tweaks". My rooms have no HF reflective issues, so cannot comment. After 6 months of listening and given good source material, I cannot fault the Opticons. The speakers just disappear. All the best with the room and I'm sure that GIK will deliver as others have suggested.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Hi Krish123,

GIK are the RollsRoyce. I bought some accoustic foam bass traps for £40 - aesthetics not an issue as HiFi in an upstairs room. They were very effective behind Dynaudio standmounts and equally so behind the Opticons. The speakers are 80cm from the rear wall and front ported Ikons 28cm. Both benefit from as much free space as you can give them and for the 8s 30cm absolute minimum, IMHO. As the foam bass traps are easliy moved and self supporting, I've experimented with position and bass performance changes with quite small adjustments. There is no doubt that, depending on room, bass traps really work and I am as sceptical as any about "tweaks". After 6 months of listening and given good source material, I cannot fault the Opticons. The speakers just disappear. All the best with the room and I'm sure that GIK will deliver as others have suggested.

hi I just managed to upgrade my opticon 6s to the 8s richer sounds let me bring them back and let me upgrade without losing any money which I am shocked even though I really liked the opticon 6s I could not pass up the upgrade but I am just waiting on mine to come from Dali as they have no stock in the uk . So I am interested how krish123 8s are acting in his room given that they have much bigger bass drivers in them

 

[krish123]

I have got in touch with GIK Acoustics, they seem to have the right products that can be implemented in my room and there panels arent to bad looking, im going to use the colours they offer to make the room look decent aswell.

I.e use a black panel next to a red one and the same on the opposite wall for instance, i think it will look quite nice.

Just need to plan with GIK where to place everything and which products to go for.

Anyone who has tried them, can you let me know wat you bought and the effect they had on the room ?

I was looking at bass traps myself but with the opticon 8s do you get any bass boom coming from them ?

I wudnt say boomy bass, its just not as defined or full as it should be and doesnt come fill out the room as you would expect.

Its not the speakers though its the lack of treatment in the room

 

[RobinKidderminster]

GIK will confirm that foam does not make good bass traps. Solid fiberglass (Rockwool) is far better.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

I have got in touch with GIK Acoustics, they seem to have the right products that can be implemented in my room and there panels arent to bad looking, im going to use the colours they offer to make the room look decent aswell.

I.e use a black panel next to a red one and the same on the opposite wall for instance, i think it will look quite nice.

Just need to plan with GIK where to place everything and which products to go for.

Anyone who has tried them, can you let me know wat you bought and the effect they had on the room ?

I was looking at bass traps myself but with the opticon 8s do you get any bass boom coming from them ?

I wudnt say boomy bass, its just not as defined or full as it should be and doesnt come fill out the room as you would expect.

Its not the speakers though its the lack of treatment in the room

have got them sitting on the floor on spikes or have you put the speakers on plinths ?

 

[krish123]

Hi Krish123,

GIK are the RollsRoyce. I bought some accoustic foam bass traps for £40 - aesthetics not an issue as HiFi in an upstairs room. They were very effective behind Dynaudio standmounts and equally so behind the Opticons. The speakers are 80cm from the rear wall and front ported Ikons 28cm. Both benefit from as much free space as you can give them and for the 8s 30cm absolute minimum, IMHO. As the foam bass traps are easliy moved and self supporting, I've experimented with position and bass performance changes with quite small adjustments. There is no doubt that, depending on room, bass traps really work and I am as sceptical as any about "tweaks". My rooms have no HF reflective issues, so cannot comment. After 6 months of listening and given good source material, I cannot fault the Opticons. The speakers just disappear. All the best with the room and I'm sure that GIK will deliver as others have suggested.

My speakers have plenty of room to breath from the side walls 1.1m but rear wall is an issue, i can only bring them out to 20-25CM max.

would panels directly behind the speakers help at all ?

 

[krish123]

I have got in touch with GIK Acoustics, they seem to have the right products that can be implemented in my room and there panels arent to bad looking, im going to use the colours they offer to make the room look decent aswell.

I.e use a black panel next to a red one and the same on the opposite wall for instance, i think it will look quite nice.

Just need to plan with GIK where to place everything and which products to go for.

Anyone who has tried them, can you let me know wat you bought and the effect they had on the room ?

I was looking at bass traps myself but with the opticon 8s do you get any bass boom coming from them ?

I wudnt say boomy bass, its just not as defined or full as it should be and doesnt come fill out the room as you would expect.

Its not the speakers though its the lack of treatment in the room

have got them sitting on the floor on spikes or have you put the speakers on plinths ?

They are on the floor with the spikes provided, there on top of 2 square sheets of carpet.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

I have got in touch with GIK Acoustics, they seem to have the right products that can be implemented in my room and there panels arent to bad looking, im going to use the colours they offer to make the room look decent aswell.

I.e use a black panel next to a red one and the same on the opposite wall for instance, i think it will look quite nice.

Just need to plan with GIK where to place everything and which products to go for.

Anyone who has tried them, can you let me know wat you bought and the effect they had on the room ?

I was looking at bass traps myself but with the opticon 8s do you get any bass boom coming from them ?

I wudnt say boomy bass, its just not as defined or full as it should be and doesnt come fill out the room as you would expect.

Its not the speakers though its the lack of treatment in the room

have got them sitting on the floor on spikes or have you put the speakers on plinths ?

They are on the floor with the spikes provided, there on top of 2 square sheets of carpet.

try them without the carpet and see what they sound like

 

[emperor's new clothes]

Hi Krish123,

GIK are the RollsRoyce. I bought some accoustic foam bass traps for £40 - aesthetics not an issue as HiFi in an upstairs room. They were very effective behind Dynaudio standmounts and equally so behind the Opticons. The speakers are 80cm from the rear wall and front ported Ikons 28cm. Both benefit from as much free space as you can give them and for the 8s 30cm absolute minimum, IMHO. As the foam bass traps are easliy moved and self supporting, I've experimented with position and bass performance changes with quite small adjustments. There is no doubt that, depending on room, bass traps really work and I am as sceptical as any about "tweaks". My rooms have no HF reflective issues, so cannot comment. After 6 months of listening and given good source material, I cannot fault the Opticons. The speakers just disappear. All the best with the room and I'm sure that GIK will deliver as others have suggested.

My speakers have plenty of room to breath from the side walls 1.1m but rear wall is an issue, i can only bring them out to 20-25CM max.

would panels directly behind the speakers help at all ?

I suspect that is causing the problem. I know they are heavy beasts at 35Kg, but is there any chance of moving them out just to check? I found with previous B&Ws that any upper bass boom not only destroys definition in the bottom octave, but also muddies the mid range. Once eliminated, the soundstage opens up and might save you from expensive solutions treating the rest of the audio spectrum. Others might have knowledge regarding panels placed behind in close proximity. Maybe GIK can help.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

Hi mate I got my Dali opticon 8s today .

They are heavy and very big speakers I never demo them but I had the 6s so I kind of knew they would be good but I did worry that they would be over the top on the bass side of things but they are not over the top and know boom which I am surprised by still very clear and detailed but much bigger sound stage from the opticon 8s then I got with the opticon 6s I've only run them 3 hours but they sound good out of the box and my abrahamsen suits Dali well too . So I am please all in all a good buy

 

[krish123]

Hi mate I got my Dali opticon 8s today .

They are heavy and very big speakers I never demo them but I had the 6s so I kind of knew they would be good but I did worry that they would be over the top on the bass side of things but they are not over the top and know boom which I am surprised by still very clear and detailed but much bigger sound stage from the opticon 8s then I got with the opticon 6s I've only run them 3 hours but they sound good out of the box and my abrahamsen suits Dali well too . So I am please all in all a good buy

Glad your happy with them mate!

 

[krish123]

Hi all,

after discussions with GIK im looking at the following:

4 x 242 acoustic panels, 2 on each of the side walls for early reflections

1 or 2 depending on space monster bass traps for the rear wall behind listening position

2 polyfuser units (diffusion) not sure where these will be placed yet maybe rear wall ormaybe side wall, where do you think will be best?

i may also opt for 2x Soffit bass traps on the front ceiling but i dont think i will purchase this time as it all adds up to quite a bit, i may purchase these at a later date if required.

what do you guys think of the above? do you think it will make a decent difference?

My room isnt ideal as i have a snooker table placed in the centre of the room, theres nothing i can do about that but im hopeing the treatment will improve the sound quite a bit.

 

[ellisdj]

Welcome to the wolrd of room acoustic treatment - like the darklside once you venture in there is no going back

I think that is a very good start - acoustic treatments are more addictive than class a women so expect to want buy more in the future anyway.

The Polyfusers as you put it work better with a few coats of vinyl paint - they look better also. I would take the time to do this before you install them finally.

You could place these on the ceiling at the early reflection point there - adhesive velcro holds them up no problem or once you know where they are going 100% you can screw through them with a drywall screw straight into the ceiling plasterboard and that holds them upfine and a little flatter to the ceiling

Not the best picture but thats them on ceiling

Or you could use them on the front wall in between the speakers - a lot of people put diffusion here.

As you have 2 sets you have 8 to play with so you can do the ceiling and front wall.

Or front and rear wall or all 3

 

[Electro]

One thing I would add to all the good advise already given is to use the least amount of room treatment possible, in other words don't over do it.

The room can add good natural reflections that enhance the music positively, if you damp these too much the music will sound unnatural and two dimensional ime.

I have removed some of the panels from my room recently, but I think even the bare room is quite reasonable acoustically so I am lucky.

 

[Blacksabbath25]

I would Agee just start of with wall panels first and then see what the sounds doing then experiment with there placement before spending any unnecessary money . But you could try thicker curtains as well but just test as you go long an till you get things right

 

[ellisdj]

I disagree completely you cant overdo room treatments - you just need to use the right ones.

What treatment does is opens the window on what your system is really doing - back to the same old thing - just buying expensive boxes doesnt guarantee great sound

A speaker cannot image if its getting direct reflections off side walls and the ceiling - because your brain is capable of sensing these reflections

If you look at the B&O Beolab 90 its so over engineered to combat these reflections to allow for imaging.

However you can use reflections to your advantge - thats what diffusion does