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Pathos InpolRemix 10 watt amplifier

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the record spot

Guest
steve_1979 said:
John Duncan said:
You've heard it distort then?
A 30 watt amp with 90dB speakers is barely capable of playing dynamic music at a sensible volume without clipping.

A 10 watt amp with 86dB speakers is going to clip unless it has somehow managed to alter the laws of physics.
My old Sansui AU-217 was a 30w amp and went with the Mission 752s I had comfortably; I played the music at sensible levels and only when I really turned it up, did the music distort and clip. Prior to that, it sounded comparable with more powerful amps I've had, including the current 100wpc Onkyo. We played a wide range of music through that setup too; rock, orchestral, etc.
 

John Duncan

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2008
2,027
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19,695
igglebert said:
Well it was quite an interesting discussion until it was turned, yet again, into another anti-AVI agenda. Why so defensive? What's the problem? Why not just have a discussion instead of the vitriol?
I see no vitriol. I've seen much worse on other forums, where people have been known to describe this website's parent magazine as "drivel". But hey ho. Live and let live, I say.
 

oldric_naubhoff

New member
Mar 11, 2011
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steve_1979 said:
A song may have a 0.1 second long drum beat that plays once every 2 seconds. This is only 5% of the overall time but you still need to have power in reserve for this large dynamic peak that happens once every 2 seconds.
I can't understand why you keep banging on about dynamic range and this amp alleged constant clipping playing Bolero. isn't it clear that efficient speakers should only be connected if you want to achieve realistic volume levels? for instance; 10W can easily yield 100dB at 3m (even more if we factor in room reverberations and thus sound reinforcement) from 100dB efficient speakers. I think 100dB peak volume is loud enough even for Bolero. if you look around you can easily find many speakers around 100dB efficient. mostly horns or fullrangers (BTW they have NO(!) crossover whatsoever, not even active one ;)). the world doesn't end on AVIs or ProAcs or Spendors or... (put here your favourite WHF brand of speakers). oh, or a pair of semi-active speakers would be a good opition too. the biggest chunk of power demand takes the bass so if that part gets its own amp 10W will give you all the dynamic range in mids/highs you can dream of.

one more thing about alleged profit margin from one of your first posts. for instance; you can get electrolytic caps for a few bucks or a few hundreds. as far as I know Inpol design depends hugely on passive components. not only caps. and Pathos is all about SQ so I would be very surprised if they used the cheap option.

and yes, I'm a Pathos fan (in case you wonder).
 
T

the record spot

Guest
igglebert said:
Well it was quite an interesting discussion until it was turned, yet again, into another anti-AVI agenda. Why so defensive? What's the problem? Why not just have a discussion instead of the vitriol?
Possibly because a lot of the stuff that's pointed out here eminates from a certain place which is hardly shy in i) belittling this place and some of the people who frequent it, often unreasonably and ii) there's more than one way to skin a cat; actives are but one way, not necessarily the way for all people. Like JD says, live and let live.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Yes, it was me that described the WHF magazine as drivel. It never used to be but things change I guess.

Live and let live, indeed, discuss and explore. Not what seems to be happening on this thread. Talk about pettiness.
 
T

the record spot

Guest
Hardly petty; as the new moderator at the other place has recently said, magazines are having a time of moving the readership over to new trends in entertainment sources. Having read plenty of titles over the years, WHFS&V seems to have done a better job than most at covering a broad base (sometimes too broad I think) of gear; certainly, it was on the page with MP3s back in the late 90s.

And if it seems like it's anti-AVI, that's possibly as a lot of AVI owners elsewhere on said "other place" spent a lot of time dishing out the kind of unsavoury stuff that you're feeling like you're getting here. That seems to have improved of late I think, but it's still there. As I frequent both places, I can understand both points of view, but have little time for the nonsense surrounding the hobby. I recognise the technical preference for active designs, though if you read back on some of the older posts elsewhere, that seems to appeal as much to the obsessively clutter-free as it does music lovers.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
That may be so about the mag, but it doesn't change my view. No big deal. Good luck to them. Anyway, off topic. Speaking of which, how did actives get into this discussion?
 
T

the record spot

Guest
Well, one thing usually leads to another on that score methinks...!
 

steve_1979

Well-known member
Jul 14, 2010
231
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18,795
the record spot said:
My old Sansui AU-217 was a 30w amp and went with the Mission 752s I had comfortably; I played the music at sensible levels and only when I really turned it up, did the music distort and clip. Prior to that, it sounded comparable with more powerful amps I've had, including the current 100wpc Onkyo. We played a wide range of music through that setup too; rock, orchestral, etc.
In my experience 30wpc is fine for dynamic music at sensible volume levels but I bet your 100wpc Onkyo would sound better.

I should also mention that when an amp is clipping very badly the distorted sound is obvious to hear but when an amp is only clipping a bit it doesn't sound distorted but it does sound harder and not as nice. This is what I have found happens with 30 watt amps.

John Duncan said:
Actually, here's a question for you Steve; what sounds worse - this amp or passive crossovers (like the ones in, say, Neutron Vs)?

I'll leave that one with you while I go and tie some buttered toast to a cat and drop it from a height...
An underpowered amp sounds far worse than a passive crossover IMO (he says pretending not to notice the sarcasm in the question).

Using amplifiers with plenty of headroom and an active crossover sounds best though.
 

The_Lhc

New member
Oct 16, 2008
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igglebert said:
Yes, it was me that described the WHF magazine as drivel. It never used to be but things change I guess.
I don't understand, if that's your view, why are you here? If I felt that way about the mag this is the last place I'd hang out, purely on principal. I've left more than one forum because I thought the people running it were idiots.
 

Helmut80

New member
Jan 8, 2011
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I have googled various combinations of igglebert + other forums to find out what this mysterious other place is
 
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Anonymous

Guest
The_Lhc said:
igglebert said:
Yes, it was me that described the WHF magazine as drivel. It never used to be but things change I guess.
I don't understand, if that's your view, why are you here? If I felt that way about the mag this is the last place I'd hang out, purely on principal. I've left more than one forum because I thought the people running it were idiots.
I guess that's a personal view. I've read the mag for years and years since the early nineties and thoroughly enjoyed it. Unfortunately I don't any more. I don't see this forum as being one and the same as the mag so don't treat the usership in the same way. If the forum users must read the mag then I suspect many more would be out. Sorry if you don't like my view.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
John Duncan said:
http://hddaudio.net/

Although in the words of King Arthur in Holy Grail...
Wow. I'm amazed to see that link here. Very different theme of topics to this site, and some amazingly interesting contributors. Best for photography though I think.
 

John Duncan

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2008
2,027
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19,695
igglebert said:
Wow. I'm amazed to see that link here.
Well since they must have *totally* messed up their search rankings by hiding 90% of their content behind a membership access wall, I thought I'd help them out with a link or two.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
John Duncan said:
igglebert said:
Wow. I'm amazed to see that link here.
Well since they must have *totally* messed up their search rankings by hiding 90% of their content behind a membership access wall, I thought I'd help them out with a link or two.
Interesting, didn't know that. Putting the photography stuff behind a "membership wall" is reasonable due to the nature of some content and the sheer openness of the Web.
 

moon

New member
Nov 10, 2011
47
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igglebert said:
Well it was quite an interesting discussion until it was turned, yet again, into another anti-AVI agenda. Why so defensive? What's the problem? Why not just have a discussion instead of the vitriol?
I think the point is Iggle, is that it's not anti AVI. Steve has learnt much of what he is writing from the AVI Hdd forum members, having just converted into an active setup from his previous Q Acosutics 5.1 system. Now he is trying to use this newly gained knowledge to put a view across on a forum where not every on agrees with him.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
moon said:
igglebert said:
Well it was quite an interesting discussion until it was turned, yet again, into another anti-AVI agenda. Why so defensive? What's the problem? Why not just have a discussion instead of the vitriol?
I think the point is Iggle, is that it's not anti AVI. Steve has learnt much of what he is writing from the AVI Hdd forum members, having just converted into an active setup from his previous Q Acosutics 5.1 system. Now he is trying to use this newly gained knowledge to put a view across on a forum where not every on agrees with him.
Hi Moon,

Yes I understand, (for the record he hasn't got an active set up). It just seems like some of the responses aren't in good spirit of discussion but rather a bit attacking. Maybe I'm being oversensitive, not unlikely seeing as my newborn has had us up most of the week. :cry:
 

moon

New member
Nov 10, 2011
47
0
0
igglebert said:
moon said:
igglebert said:
Well it was quite an interesting discussion until it was turned, yet again, into another anti-AVI agenda. Why so defensive? What's the problem? Why not just have a discussion instead of the vitriol?
I think the point is Iggle, is that it's not anti AVI. Steve has learnt much of what he is writing from the AVI Hdd forum members, having just converted into an active setup from his previous Q Acosutics 5.1 system. Now he is trying to use this newly gained knowledge to put a view across on a forum where not every on agrees with him.
Hi Moon,

Yes I understand, (for the record he hasn't got an active set up). It just seems like some of the responses aren't in good spirit of discussion but rather a bit attacking. Maybe I'm being oversensitive, not unlikely seeing as my newborn has had us up most of the week. :cry:
yeah stuff this hi Fi lark, many congrats on the baby, this newborn period will pass and it just gets better and better. :)
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Indeed! Thank you. Blinking hard work. A smart phone is a mixed blessing of a distraction.

:type:
 

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