New Dac the FiiO K13 R2R: Early Impressions

[Jasonovich]

I am afraid all of those are probably above my pay grade but sounds an interesting proposition. At least I only have one system to listen to these days which is in my man cave and only use headphones.

That's why I am waiting to see if the K17 R2R has an improved R2R and Headphone amp in which case it would save a lot of space and mains leads/interconnects by replacing my four current units and the SSD I have in the Eversolo would transfer to a USB SSD caddy sitting behind. All theory at the moment!

I believe the K17 is already out but it isn't R2R, it uses AKM chipset, not unless they're bringing out an R2R version of the K17?
Now that would be interesting 🙂

 

[woodbar]

I believe the K17 is already out but it isn't R2R, it uses AKM chipset, not unless they're bringing out an R2R version of the K17?
Now that would be interesting 🙂

Yes, very interesting!

Apparently there will be an R2R version of the K17 due to be released in July I understand.

 

[woodbar]

@Jasonovich I meant to ask you before, I note from your diner set up you are using an LPS PL50 with your K11 R2R I assume? Did you detect any sonic differences with that?

 

[Jasonovich]

@Jasonovich I meant to ask you before, I note from your diner set up you are using an LPS PL50 with your K11 R2R I assume? Did you detect any sonic differences with that?

Good question.
Yes small incremental but noticeable improvements to the sound. The bass appears to have better body, vocals more solid. Some may argue it's placebo but my ears tell me otherwise.

I would advise any one using cheap 12v AC/DC generic power supply, switch to a decent linear one.
The FiiO PL50 power supply is puka, not sure if this is compatible with K13 R2R, worth checking their website.

 

[woodbar]

Good question.
Yes small incremental but noticeable improvements to the sound. The bass appears to have better body, vocals more solid. Some may argue it's placebo but my ears tell me otherwise.

I would advise any one using cheap 12v AC/DC generic power supply, switch to a decent linear one.
The FiiO PL50 power supply is pretty decent, not sure if this is compatible with K13 R2R, worth checking their website.

View attachment 11193

Yes, quite possible, but don't quote that on ASR😡🤐

Fiio have produced another LPSU in a case which exactly mimics the K13 R2R with selectable 12 or 15V output - called "The Darkside" 🤦‍♀️ A bit obtuse!

I will not think about that until I am able to investigate the forthcoming K17 R2R though, as that has a built in LPSU and the K13 R2R at least has it's own SMPSU in a tin box internally!

 

[Stuart.W.D]

I've had the K13 R2R for a month or so and really pleased with it.

I tried a Topping DX5 II first but it had too many bugs, tried to destroy my headphones/ears, and did not perform any different to any of my other DACs, so that was returned.

The K13 does sound different in a very pleasing way, more analogue and rounded without the sparkly harshness of the usual delta/sigma chips! Allows "non-defensive listening" - a quote I saw somewhere the other day, very apt I thought.

I do use it just as a DAC feeding my Topping L70 headphone amp via XLR out as I find this gives a little more dynamically compared to the onboard amp.

Eagerly awaiting the K17 R2R to be released, might be interesting/tempted especially as it is rumoured to have a more advanced R2R array, though this is not confirmed yet. I would love it if I was able to use just the single unit to replace my Eversolo DMP-A6, Topping L70/E70 stack and the K13 of course!

It's good to hear that you're really satisfied with your K13 R2R Dac. Incredible value, isn't it?

 

[woodbar]

It's good to hear that you're really satisfied with your K13 R2R Dac. Incredible value, isn't it?

Yes it would appear so and looks to be a very decent build quality.

The only omissions for me are individually selectable headphone ports, instead of both, and an analogue input would have been useful.

 

[woodbar]

I have not had a music session for about a week or so. Decided to have an extended one tonight.

Excellent, enjoying the music and did not have to tweak the volume down, or skip, on any of the former recordings I knew ( or thought I did) were harsh and very edgy ?

Why didn't someone tell me about R2R DACs a long time ago? 😀

 

[PieterG]

Why didn't someone tell me about R2R DACs a long time ago? 😀

Actually the resistor ladder architecture is fairly old. It was this type of DAC they put into cd players. The modern versions that have become so popular are much more accurate thanks to their state of the art "digital brain" (an FPGA).

I like the sound too. It simply didn't pair very well with my already darker headphones. At first i thought it lacked detail, but after a couple of weeks of focused listening i put it down to reduced brightness in combination with my headphones.

Definitely try the NOS mode if you haven't. That's where these DACs seem to shine.

 

[woodbar]

Actually the resistor ladder architecture is fairly old. It was this type of DAC they put into cd players. The modern versions that have become so popular are much more accurate thanks to their state of the art "digital brain" (an FPGA).

I like the sound too. It simply didn't pair very well with my already darker headphones. At first i thought it lacked detail, but after a couple of weeks of focused listening i put it down to reduced brightness in combination with my headphones.

Definitely try the NOS mode if you haven't. That's where these DACs seem to shine.

I was not aware of that, very interesting.

I was not sure about the detail myself originally but as you say this is probably down to being less bright and what I call "tinselly" compared to the DAC on a chip variety. I already use NOS most of the time, with the occasional flip back to OS on certain tracks, but that usually does not last too long 😀

It's a shame that R2R is classed by some "experts" and reviewers as lacking - relying solely on detailed measured performance as the arbiter of pure sound. Obviously that comes into the equation but that does not necessarily tell you how good or bad it may sound to your ears!

I remember very many years ago, when I first got into the HiFI "merry-go-round" and started listening to some setups at various dealers and shows to some quite expensive gear, very often my initial thoughts would be that's offensively loud, too in your face, very bright or not musical!

That's why I always take even well respected reviewers claims that something is the "best thing since sliced bread" as a pointer that I may just want to listen to it and let my ears decide - and unfortunately they, like the rest of me, are showing their advancing years 🙁

 

[RJW232]

That's why I always take even well respected reviewers claims that something is the "best thing since sliced bread" as a pointer that I may just want to listen to it and let my ears decide - and unfortunately they, like the rest of me, are showing their advancing years 🙁

Don't expect miracles from electronics. Year on year we may seen very small evolutions, if any... I recently compared the circuit diagrams of one of the latest Marantz amps with one of about 10..15 years ago. Almost identical. The main difference is in the housing of the amps. But lots of reviewers claim the new one sounds so much better. It would also be very strange if a reputable manufacturer suddenly knows how to develop better electronics when they are already doing that for decades....

And the same with DAC's. Every properly designed DAC should sound more or less the same. It shouldn't matter if you use R2R or delte-sigma of something else. If they clearly sound different than at least one of them has not been design in a correct way....

 

[The_Lecht_Rocks]

Speakers to suit room.
Amp to suit speakers.
Source to taste.

 

[twinkletoes]

Personally from my research and listening the k9 is pretty much the sweat spot and pretty much the best thing fiio make, I prefer the akm variant with my ft7s. The THX amps really get the planners moving. The extra 150-170 is worth I think over the k13.