Near field listening with Dali Zensor 1

[maxpain123]

Hello to everyone,

I am kinda new to this hobby and I still learn things about hifi world so I would appreciate some input on something.

My system is Speakers : Dali zensor 1 , apm : Nad d3020 playing from my laptop as a source. Mostly Tidal and Spotify.

I had to move my system to a small room and I have to use it as a desktop system cause there is literally no other way. Do you think that the zensors would preform well in a desktop setup? Listening distance from 1 meter or less?

Would I be hearing everything or would I be loosing sound quality? I mean ok I am aware I will loose some imaging but I can leave with that.

I would appreciate any help.

Best of health during the quarantine.

 

[Al ears]

They should be fine but as you already have them perhaps you could tell us....
Seriously, I would look at getting some wedge shaped supports that are made to place under desktop speakers, this will angle them upwards and improve the soundstage.

 

[maxpain123]

Thank you for your response!

Well I have put them one some hard books so the tweeter would be close to my ear level. They are booming a little but I am planing on buying some dedicated desktop stands...


I have tried them in listening positions 1meter, 1,5 meter and less than 1 meter .

Well obviously image and soundstage is better at 1.5 meters. But I need to punch up the amp witch is not very powerfull so I have to crank up the volume to propably -20...(80%).

The only problem is that at 1 meter the stereo imaging is completely destroyed i mean there is no blending at all...I should mention that the speakers distance from each other is 1 meter also.

 

[Gray]

Bass can sometimes be a bit lumpy (boomy at certain frequencies) when rear-ported speakers are backed up close to a wall.
I notice the keyhole mount on yours though, suggesting that they may have been designed to take wall mounting into account.
Did they supply port bungs with them?

 

[maxpain123]

Dali suggests that they can be wall mounted. Also that they don't need any rotation.

I suspect that booming is due to the fact that they are not on any stands?

 

[insider9]

If at all possible try to eliminate any reflections. Having more direct sound should improve sound quality but potential early reflection may ruin it.

 

[maxpain123]

How can I do that? By adding sound correction pads behind the speakers on the front wall? or the side walls?

 

[Al ears]

Possibly headphones might be a better option rather than trying to use speakers that are not designed to be used like this.

 

[insider9]

How can I do that? By adding sound correction pads behind the speakers on the front wall? or the side walls?

Difficult without understanding your setup e.g. any furniture, etc. and how you placed speakers. Consider directivity of the speakers and their placement. Without mentioning acoustic treatment there are a number of things you could do to the environment. Proper stands are a must. With near field listening you can look at angling (or not) the speakers to avoid reflections yet remaining in a sweetspot.

 

[maxpain123]

I do have headphones...I use senns hd 650 with micro idsd dac/amp.

But I do have the hifi system also so I want to use it as well. Thats what I was asking...if those speakers are designed to be used from 1 meter or 1.5-2 meters?

And if there is a right way to use hifi speakers as near field.

 

[insider9]

Not all speakers are good at distances you mention. Must admit Zensor 1 is the only Dali speaker I would not buy but that's just me and I like Dali speakers as a whole. Ideal scenario for near field listening would be full range or coaxial drivers or speakers meant to be use in near field applications.

 

[maxpain123]

When I purchased the Zensors was not meant to be used for nearfield listening.

You don't prefer their sound signiture or is something wrong with their built in comparison to Spektors for example?

I could always go for studio monitors but now its not the time spend the money for lets say a pair of active focals.

In the end...what is the optimal distance to listen to speakers like zensor1?

 

[Al ears]

I do have headphones...I use senns hd 650 with micro idsd dac/amp.

But I do have the hifi system also so I want to use it as well. Thats what I was asking...if those speakers are designed to be used from 1 meter or 1.5-2 meters?

And if there is a right way to use hifi speakers as near field.

As far as I am aware no hifi speakers are designed to work from this distance unless they are described as near field monitors along with the old BBC LS/5a designs

 

[gasolin]

Bass can sometimes be a bit lumpy (boomy at certain frequencies) when rear-ported speakers are backed up close to a wall.
I notice the keyhole mount on yours though, suggesting that they may have been designed to take wall mounting into account.
Did they supply port bungs with them?

Not with dali zensor 1

 

[maxpain123]

As far as I am aware no hifi speakers are designed to work from this distance unless they are described as near field monitors along with the old BBC LS/5a designs

Then what is the proper distance to listen to speakers like zesnor 1?

 

[knaithrover]

At low volumes I'm sure with that amp and on stands the Zensor 1's will sound absolutely fine at 1.5 to 2m

 

[maxpain123]

At low volumes I'm sure with that amp and on stands the Zensor 1's will sound absolutely fine at 1.5 to 2m

I have to say that with the d3020 my optimal volume for listening to music is at 60-80%...I don't know if it can be considered as low volume...

Then again the amp is not very powerful I think it measures 30watt at 8ohms and 100watts peak at 4 ohms. Zesnors are 6 ohms so I guess amp can feed them with 40-50 watts or something? I think Dali recommends 25-100 watts. Maby they do need a more powerful amplifier for over 1.5 meters?

 

[knaithrover]

I drove Zensor 3's comfortably with a D3020 a few years back at both high and low volumes

 

[Al ears]

Then what is the proper distance to listen to speakers like zesnor 1?

Ignore my last remark. The idea of near field was in my head and didn't see 2 metres which is not near field

 

[rainsoothe]

I think ISOacoustics stands will sort the bass boom and help on the imaging too.

 

[maxpain123]

I drove Zensor 3's comfortably with a D3020 a few years back at both high and low volumes

Zensors 3 must be more difficult to drive than zesnors1. Do you remember if you would crank up the volume at -40 or -20 to have a decent volume?

I usually I have it on -20 If I want a little higher volume.

 

[maxpain123]

I think ISOacoustics stands will sort the bass boom and help on the imaging too.

You mean desktop stands or floor stands?

 

[Deleted member 116933]

Then what is the proper distance to listen to speakers like zesnor 1?

Max! i wouldn't worry mate, i dont know why people are telling you its not going to sound great im sure aware its not going to sound optimal but it doesn't matter, its what you have to deal with.

I lived with pair of mission 700's in a room no wider than 1.5m wide and probably sitting around 90cm away from me for years. You can make it work and it can sound awesome its just a lot of fine tweaking needed.

Things to try to tame the bass.

DON'T toe them in you want need to as they're so close.

If they're on the desk try some blue tak under them (maybe white tak as the blue can stain) this will isolate them and control the bass and also stop them from moving

Or try some squash balls can in half, anything to separate them from the desk, NOT books

You could try some desk specific stands can't remember the brand off the top of head though, theres also some slanted foam pads on the market with can help, again cant remember the brand.

If you can and have some room try some stands

Little movements go along when sitting so close.

If not try and find some sealed speakers to try and see what that does.

After all that and IF! IF! your still not happy with the sound, sell the lot (or put it into storage) and consider some headphones which will arguably give you far better sound and the room is taken out of the equation all together. Audio quest dragon fly or chord mojo with any headphone/iem of your choice bam done

 

[maxpain123]

Max! i wouldn't worry mate, i dont know why people are telling you its not going to sound great im sure aware its not going to sound optimal but it doesn't matter, its what you have to deal with.

I lived with pair of mission 700's in a room no wider than 1.5m wide and probably sitting around 90cm away from me for years. You can make it work and it can sound awesome its just a lot of fine tweaking needed.

Things to try to tame the bass.

DON'T toe them in you want need to as they're so close.

If they're on the desk try some blue tak under them (maybe white tak as the blue can stain) this will isolate them and control the bass and also stop them from moving

Or try some squash balls can in half, anything to separate them from the desk, NOT books

You could try some desk specific stands can't remember the brand off the top of head though, theres also some slanted foam pads on the market with can help, again cant remember the brand.

If you can and have some room try some stands

Little movements go along when sitting so close.

If not try and find some sealed speakers to try and see what that does.

After all that and IF! IF! your still not happy with the sound, sell the lot (or put it into storage) and consider some headphones which will arguably give you far better sound and the room is taken out of the equation all together. Audio quest dragon fly or chord mojo with any headphone/iem of your choice bam done

I do have headphones that I use but I also want to find a way to listen to the hifi system.

I think best thing is to try stands fists...desktop or floodstands.

 

[rainsoothe]

You mean desktop stands or floor stands?

They are desktop stands. The pads do close to nothing, imo, and your book idea shows that you read around a bit, since it's better than pads. The ISOacoustics are not cheap, especially considering their build quality (if you assemble them wrong, you might actually not be able to pull them apart). But they work VERY well. For the Zensor 1, probably the L8R 130 is the right size (the other one being 155 - the number is the width of the stand).