Loving music and loving hifi

[Trefor Patten]

For what it is worth, I can enjoy a great song, or a great melody down a telephone line. But that is NOT music. It is SOUND. The sound reminds me of some beautiful music I once heard. It is a facsimile of the music. Just like a holiday photograph reminds me of a beautiful view. The best hi-fi, while only approximating a real symphony or rock concert, chamber recital or folk/jazz club session does bring MUSIC to my ears. i.e. some of the same ilk, but of a different order to mere SOUND.

 

[davedotco]

I enjoyed music when I listened to music on a mono record player[Ferguson I think, the speaker was in the lid]. I enjoyed music on a cheap stereo music centre. Then I purchased a BSR 8 track machine and played it through the music centre. I noticed a significant difference in quality and was on the slippery slope. There then followed @ 40 years of using music to evaluate hifi equipment and tweaks as much of the time as to just listening and enjoying the music for its own sake. When I made changes then for a time my enjoyment was heightened but then I would hear problems that 'needed attending to', so more tweaks and ultimately different gear. Then 30 months ago I purchased certain equipment, whose name I shall not mention lest we sink to needless sniping, and my musical world changed dramatically for the good. I don't think about the equipment for one second and just luxuriate in the astonishingly wonderful and enveloping music. I have found my nirvana and that is my music.

A familiar tale not limited to owners of equipment spawned by the devil. There are many people who 'downsize' to sensible inexpensive systems and forget about the hi-fi.

To be that is not really the point, that such people loose interest in hi-fi and effectively give it up is fair enough, no problems with that at all.

My point is that it is perfectly possible to 'downsize' exactly as you describe and retain an interest in hi-fi as a separate but related hobby.

I know that having an interest in hi-fi is not cool and this has been the case for a long time, but I don't have a problem with it, in fact I very much enjoy it but I keep the two things separate, primarily as to not fall into the trap of listening to the hi-fi when I should be listening to the music.

Mrs DDC has a take on this, she reckons that, even for a man, my ability to 'multi task' is appalling but I reply that I simply have a 'linear' mind such that I can concentrate fully on one activity (setting up my hi-fi, say) then stop and do something else (play some music, perhaps) with equal concentration.

Dave,

I don't understand how you have decided that I have lost interest in hifi from anything I have said.

I am still interested in hifi, I'm on here and another forum. I also keep up to date via other websites and media.

However, when I listen to music, that is all I am doing, the equipment has 'disappeared', it is only about the music and nothing to do with the gear. That, for me, is vastly different to the previous 40 years.

I trust that I have not confused you further?

Sorry relocated, your post prompted the thought, but i genuinely was not aiming my comment directly at you.

Like most of my posts on this thread I was talking generally about attitudes with a somewhat broad brush.

 

[busb]

I am very grateful I was brought up with classical music & can remember a red vinyl covered Garrard record player that you could stack singles on, it had 4 speeds IIRC.
It wasn't until I went to secondary school that I discovered decent rock music. Our music teacher didn't mind us bringing in "pop" music though he referred to classical music as "serious music" - elitist or what!
My brother also liked music enough to have a good stereo system. We went to many classical concerts in London at venues such as the Albert Hall, Fairfield & the RFH. What struck me was how poorly a Hi Fi system reproduced music in comparison to the real thing! To my ears, it was the unforced dynamics & the sound of brass instruments that sounded so much better live.
Pop music is different for me. The sound is often too loud, distorted etc. What you get instead is a great atmosphere that rather overrides SQ considerations.
What listening to live acoustic music gave me was a sense of what bass should sound like - only there when bass notes are being played, tight with little boom & tuneful. I don't want a decent recording to sound like the musicians are in my room - I want it sound like I'm at the venue!
I'm firmly in the camp who believe that stereo equipment gets better & better at less cost. I don't hanker after old gear at all. Speakers are very much better now than 30yrs ago, IMO.
As for being without HiFi - I can live without it - it only ices the cake - its a means only.

 

[davedotco]

I am very grateful I was brought up with classical music & can remember a red vinyl covered Garrard record player that you could stack singles on, it had 4 speeds IIRC. It wasn't until I went to secondary school that I discovered decent rock music. Our music teacher didn't mind us bringing in "pop" music though he referred to classical music as "serious music" - elitist or what! My brother also liked music enough to have a good stereo system. We went to many classical concerts in London at venues such as the Albert Hall, Fairfield & the RFH. What struck me was how poorly a Hi Fi system reproduced music in comparison to the real thing! To my ears, it was the unforced dynamics & the sound of brass instruments that sounded so much better live. Pop music is different for me. The sound is often too loud, distorted etc. What you get instead is a great atmosphere that rather overrides SQ considerations. What listening to live acoustic music gave me was a sense of what bass should sound like - only there when bass notes are being played, tight with little boom & tuneful. I don't want a decent recording to sound like the musicians are in my room - I want it sound like I'm at the venue! I'm firmly in the camp who believe that stereo equipment gets better & better at less cost. I don't hanker after old gear at all. Speakers are very much better now than 30yrs ago, IMO. As for being without HiFi - I can live without it - it only ices the cake - its a means only.

This line is I think very interesting.

It really is all about scale, something I find very difficult in small (domestic) sized rooms.

 

[busb]

Perhaps I read too much into things but your quote-

"There are a lot more music lovers enjoying music on cheapo earphones - do they like music less than us who are vastly outnumbered by them? I think not."

-implies, to me at least, that those choosing to use better quality equipment are somehow misguided, we don't apparantly enjoy the music any more so why are we bothering? Reading that line again, in isolation, I guess I could be wrong but to me the whole tone of your posts tends to convey that message.

In isolation I certainly don't get that message, it simply appears to say that there's more people listen on "poor" equipment than there are those of us that don't. That seems pretty obvious when you look at the sales figures. It doesn't appear to suggest that either group are in the wrong for their choice of listening equipment.

I think the misunderstanding of the passage in bold arises from a slippage between "enjoy" and "like". The first statement concerning "cheapo headphones" is, as Lhc says, unexceptionable. The second statement is also fine by me, so long as the verb "like" isn't confused with the verb "enjoy" in the first statement. In other words, I take Busb to be saying not that music is just as enjoyable through cheapo headphones as through better ones, but that people who use cheapo headphones may have an equally strong preference ("like") for music in general as people who use expensive kit. This doesn't of course exclude the possibility that better quality kit provides more enjoyment.

Matt

Language eh, causes more disagreements than even religion or politics....... :hand:

I agree that in isolation that sentence can be taken in different ways, even saying so in my post (not quoted by Lhc), but 'in context' I thought it quite disparaging to those who choose to spend on better equipment.

It is this lack 'of empathy' for another persons interests that I find quite discouraging, you do not have to share those interests but to be so dismissive of them on a public forum that is supposedly about such interests is disappointing.

Dave, if any of us search hard enough we will find "offence" even in the way a total stranger crosses the road in front of us. If I state that I like the colour blue, does that imply I dislike red? No it doesn't - it means I like blue! You seem to take a contrary view at times because you can rather than through conviction. Why would someone who's spent £1000s on equipment then proceed to take a dim view on people doing so?

It's got jack to do with empathy or lack off - I simply point out that most people don't spend even modest amounts on equipment but enjoy music. That's does not imply that I'm a twit or anyone else here is for spending lots of money to enjoy music more. Many people given the oportunity to listen to a great system may ideed aspire to own a decent setup themselves. My use of word "cheapo" was me being very polite - most free in-ear phones sound objectionable to the extent that even Dr Dre[adfuls] sound good by comparison.

When I read forum posts that feel a little "edgy", I try to work out if I'm being over-sensitive or not - quite often its me rather than the intent of the poster to be offensive.

Most of us on this forum are pretty lucky & content to some degree. I dare suggest that few here have trouble feeding themselves or are being chased by utility companies. Although there will be some exceptions, we live reasonably priviledged lives. Every time I go into Reading, I see beggars - they remind me that I'm much better off than many & that I should not waste my money on toys I'm not going to use. I'm not the loan voice on this thread suggesting that to buy (mostly male) toys that go under-used is if not contemptable, is certainly conspicuous consumption.

 

[DandyCobalt]

Me too. Nothing comes close to live music - one of the reasons we've booked to see 3 of our favourite bands between now and Christmas.

Really? Been to a festival recently? There are loads of venues where the acoustics are awful. I've played in a few of them, and been a spectator in others.

You really have to know your venues, and avoid festivals completely, to get the most from live music (acoustically).

Entertainment-wise, perhaps a different story, but then you're separating music from entertainment. A clown doesn't have to make a sound to entertain.

 

[davedotco]

Me too. Nothing comes close to live music - one of the reasons we've booked to see 3 of our favourite bands between now and Christmas.

Really? Been to a festival recently? There are loads of venues where the acoustics are awful. I've played in a few of them, and been a spectator in others.

You really have to know your venues, and avoid festivals completely, to get the most from live music (acoustically).

Entertainment-wise, perhaps a different story, but then you're separating music from entertainment. A clown doesn't have to make a sound to entertain.

So, avoid real live music because the acoustics are not great, interesting that.

 

[davedotco]

Perhaps I read too much into things but your quote-

"There are a lot more music lovers enjoying music on cheapo earphones - do they like music less than us who are vastly outnumbered by them? I think not."

-implies, to me at least, that those choosing to use better quality equipment are somehow misguided, we don't apparantly enjoy the music any more so why are we bothering? Reading that line again, in isolation, I guess I could be wrong but to me the whole tone of your posts tends to convey that message.

In isolation I certainly don't get that message, it simply appears to say that there's more people listen on "poor" equipment than there are those of us that don't. That seems pretty obvious when you look at the sales figures. It doesn't appear to suggest that either group are in the wrong for their choice of listening equipment.

I think the misunderstanding of the passage in bold arises from a slippage between "enjoy" and "like". The first statement concerning "cheapo headphones" is, as Lhc says, unexceptionable. The second statement is also fine by me, so long as the verb "like" isn't confused with the verb "enjoy" in the first statement. In other words, I take Busb to be saying not that music is just as enjoyable through cheapo headphones as through better ones, but that people who use cheapo headphones may have an equally strong preference ("like") for music in general as people who use expensive kit. This doesn't of course exclude the possibility that better quality kit provides more enjoyment.

Matt

Language eh, causes more disagreements than even religion or politics....... :hand:

I agree that in isolation that sentence can be taken in different ways, even saying so in my post (not quoted by Lhc), but 'in context' I thought it quite disparaging to those who choose to spend on better equipment.

It is this lack 'of empathy' for another persons interests that I find quite discouraging, you do not have to share those interests but to be so dismissive of them on a public forum that is supposedly about such interests is disappointing.

Dave, if any of us search hard enough we will find "offence" even in the way a total stranger crosses the road in front of us. If I state that I like the colour blue, does that imply I dislike red? No it doesn't - it means I like blue! You seem to take a contrary view at times because you can rather than through conviction. Why would someone who's spent £1000s on equipment then proceed to take a dim view on people doing so?

It's got jack to do with empathy or lack off - I simply point out that most people don't spend even modest amounts on equipment but enjoy music. That's does not imply that I'm a twit or anyone else here is for spending lots of money to enjoy music more. Many people given the oportunity to listen to a great system may ideed aspire to own a decent setup themselves. My use of word "cheapo" was me being very polite - most free in-ear phones sound objectionable to the extent that even Dr Dre[adfuls] sound good by comparison.

When I read forum posts that feel a little "edgy", I try to work out if I'm being over-sensitive or not - quite often its me rather than the intent of the poster to be offensive.

Most of us on this forum are pretty lucky & content to some degree. I dare suggest that few here have trouble feeding themselves or are being chased by utility companies. Although there will be some exceptions, we live reasonably priviledged lives. Every time I go into Reading, I see beggars - they remind me that I'm much better off than many & that I should not waste my money on toys I'm not going to use. I'm not the loan voice on this thread suggesting that to buy (mostly male) toys that go under-used is if not contemptable, is certainly conspicuous consumption.

I really did not have to 'search hard' to find disparaging comments in your threads, your comments about the chap buying the expensive dac, the person buying an expensive instrument that he cant play are just two of the most obvious examples, and then describing one of them, as you do in the above thread, as 'toys i'm not going to use' really does say it all.

Who are you to say what people should or should not do in pursuit of their hobby? Are you some sort of a control freak, or even worse, a socialist?

I just don't see why you or others on this board should get away with such comments as this without being challenged.

If that is taking a 'contrary view' then fine, guilty as charged.

Edit. If you are going to edit your posts after posting you should say so, common courtesy. My reply was to your original, not the 'watered down' version.

 

[busb]

Perhaps I read too much into things but your quote-

"There are a lot more music lovers enjoying music on cheapo earphones - do they like music less than us who are vastly outnumbered by them? I think not."

-implies, to me at least, that those choosing to use better quality equipment are somehow misguided, we don't apparantly enjoy the music any more so why are we bothering? Reading that line again, in isolation, I guess I could be wrong but to me the whole tone of your posts tends to convey that message.

In isolation I certainly don't get that message, it simply appears to say that there's more people listen on "poor" equipment than there are those of us that don't. That seems pretty obvious when you look at the sales figures. It doesn't appear to suggest that either group are in the wrong for their choice of listening equipment.

I think the misunderstanding of the passage in bold arises from a slippage between "enjoy" and "like". The first statement concerning "cheapo headphones" is, as Lhc says, unexceptionable. The second statement is also fine by me, so long as the verb "like" isn't confused with the verb "enjoy" in the first statement. In other words, I take Busb to be saying not that music is just as enjoyable through cheapo headphones as through better ones, but that people who use cheapo headphones may have an equally strong preference ("like") for music in general as people who use expensive kit. This doesn't of course exclude the possibility that better quality kit provides more enjoyment.

Matt

Language eh, causes more disagreements than even religion or politics....... :hand:

I agree that in isolation that sentence can be taken in different ways, even saying so in my post (not quoted by Lhc), but 'in context' I thought it quite disparaging to those who choose to spend on better equipment.

It is this lack 'of empathy' for another persons interests that I find quite discouraging, you do not have to share those interests but to be so dismissive of them on a public forum that is supposedly about such interests is disappointing.

Dave, if any of us search hard enough we will find "offence" even in the way a total stranger crosses the road in front of us. If I state that I like the colour blue, does that imply I dislike red? No it doesn't - it means I like blue! You seem to take a contrary view at times because you can rather than through conviction. Why would someone who's spent £1000s on equipment then proceed to take a dim view on people doing so?

It's got jack to do with empathy or lack off - I simply point out that most people don't spend even modest amounts on equipment but enjoy music. That's does not imply that I'm a twit or anyone else here is for spending lots of money to enjoy music more. Many people given the oportunity to listen to a great system may ideed aspire to own a decent setup themselves. My use of word "cheapo" was me being very polite - most free in-ear phones sound objectionable to the extent that even Dr Dre[adfuls] sound good by comparison.

When I read forum posts that feel a little "edgy", I try to work out if I'm being over-sensitive or not - quite often its me rather than the intent of the poster to be offensive.

Most of us on this forum are pretty lucky & content to some degree. I dare suggest that few here have trouble feeding themselves or are being chased by utility companies. Although there will be some exceptions, we live reasonably priviledged lives. Every time I go into Reading, I see beggars - they remind me that I'm much better off than many & that I should not waste my money on toys I'm not going to use. I'm not the loan voice on this thread suggesting that to buy (mostly male) toys that go under-used is if not contemptable, is certainly conspicuous consumption.

I really did not have to 'search hard' to find disparaging comments in your threads, your comments about the chap buying the expensive dac, the person buying an expensive instrument that he cant play are just two of the most obvious examples, and then describing one of them, as you do in the above thread, as 'toys i'm not going to use' really does say it all.

Who are you to say what people should or should not do in pursuit of their hobby? Are you some sort of a control freak, or even worse, a socialist?

I just don't see why you or others on this board should get away with such comments as this without being challenged.

If that is taking a 'contrary view' then fine, guilty as charged.

Oh dear - not having a good day? No Dave, I'm both a Control Freak & a Communist! Socialism is for teachers who wear leather elbow patches & read The Guardian. I don't know what planet you are on but it's not the same one as me. You seem to have trouble with the difference between conceptualisation & example - I said if I was to buy.. Never mind. Look Dave, I can see you're really upset about this. I honestly think you ought to sit down calmly, take a stress pill, and think things over.

 

[BenLaw]

Perhaps I read too much into things but your quote-

"There are a lot more music lovers enjoying music on cheapo earphones - do they like music less than us who are vastly outnumbered by them? I think not."

-implies, to me at least, that those choosing to use better quality equipment are somehow misguided, we don't apparantly enjoy the music any more so why are we bothering? Reading that line again, in isolation, I guess I could be wrong but to me the whole tone of your posts tends to convey that message.

In isolation I certainly don't get that message, it simply appears to say that there's more people listen on "poor" equipment than there are those of us that don't. That seems pretty obvious when you look at the sales figures. It doesn't appear to suggest that either group are in the wrong for their choice of listening equipment.

I think the misunderstanding of the passage in bold arises from a slippage between "enjoy" and "like". The first statement concerning "cheapo headphones" is, as Lhc says, unexceptionable. The second statement is also fine by me, so long as the verb "like" isn't confused with the verb "enjoy" in the first statement. In other words, I take Busb to be saying not that music is just as enjoyable through cheapo headphones as through better ones, but that people who use cheapo headphones may have an equally strong preference ("like") for music in general as people who use expensive kit. This doesn't of course exclude the possibility that better quality kit provides more enjoyment.

Matt

Language eh, causes more disagreements than even religion or politics....... :hand:

I agree that in isolation that sentence can be taken in different ways, even saying so in my post (not quoted by Lhc), but 'in context' I thought it quite disparaging to those who choose to spend on better equipment.

It is this lack 'of empathy' for another persons interests that I find quite discouraging, you do not have to share those interests but to be so dismissive of them on a public forum that is supposedly about such interests is disappointing.

Dave, if any of us search hard enough we will find "offence" even in the way a total stranger crosses the road in front of us. If I state that I like the colour blue, does that imply I dislike red? No it doesn't - it means I like blue! You seem to take a contrary view at times because you can rather than through conviction. Why would someone who's spent £1000s on equipment then proceed to take a dim view on people doing so?

It's got jack to do with empathy or lack off - I simply point out that most people don't spend even modest amounts on equipment but enjoy music. That's does not imply that I'm a twit or anyone else here is for spending lots of money to enjoy music more. Many people given the oportunity to listen to a great system may ideed aspire to own a decent setup themselves. My use of word "cheapo" was me being very polite - most free in-ear phones sound objectionable to the extent that even Dr Dre[adfuls] sound good by comparison.

When I read forum posts that feel a little "edgy", I try to work out if I'm being over-sensitive or not - quite often its me rather than the intent of the poster to be offensive.

Most of us on this forum are pretty lucky & content to some degree. I dare suggest that few here have trouble feeding themselves or are being chased by utility companies. Although there will be some exceptions, we live reasonably priviledged lives. Every time I go into Reading, I see beggars - they remind me that I'm much better off than many & that I should not waste my money on toys I'm not going to use. I'm not the loan voice on this thread suggesting that to buy (mostly male) toys that go under-used is if not contemptable, is certainly conspicuous consumption.

I really did not have to 'search hard' to find disparaging comments in your threads, your comments about the chap buying the expensive dac, the person buying an expensive instrument that he cant play are just two of the most obvious examples, and then describing one of them, as you do in the above thread, as 'toys i'm not going to use' really does say it all.

Who are you to say what people should or should not do in pursuit of their hobby? Are you some sort of a control freak, or even worse, a socialist?

I just don't see why you or others on this board should get away with such comments as this without being challenged.

If that is taking a 'contrary view' then fine, guilty as charged.

Edit. If you are going to edit your posts after posting you should say so, common courtesy. My reply was to your original, not the 'watered down' version.

It's really nice of you to get so offended on behalf of a swathe of unidentified third parties, but here's what busb originally said:

'A friend talked himself into buying a £1500 DAC. That's fine with me - it's his money afterall but when he states that music that was unlistenable with his previous £600 M-DAC, sounds fine on his new one - I do wonder. It sounds like justification after the event to me!'

Where exactly did he say 'what people should or should not do in pursuit of their hobby'?

And sorry what was wrong with being a socialist? No doubt you will excuse that comment as a highly amusing joke that went over my head.

 

[davedotco]

Perhaps I read too much into things but your quote-

"There are a lot more music lovers enjoying music on cheapo earphones - do they like music less than us who are vastly outnumbered by them? I think not."

-implies, to me at least, that those choosing to use better quality equipment are somehow misguided, we don't apparantly enjoy the music any more so why are we bothering? Reading that line again, in isolation, I guess I could be wrong but to me the whole tone of your posts tends to convey that message.

In isolation I certainly don't get that message, it simply appears to say that there's more people listen on "poor" equipment than there are those of us that don't. That seems pretty obvious when you look at the sales figures. It doesn't appear to suggest that either group are in the wrong for their choice of listening equipment.

I think the misunderstanding of the passage in bold arises from a slippage between "enjoy" and "like". The first statement concerning "cheapo headphones" is, as Lhc says, unexceptionable. The second statement is also fine by me, so long as the verb "like" isn't confused with the verb "enjoy" in the first statement. In other words, I take Busb to be saying not that music is just as enjoyable through cheapo headphones as through better ones, but that people who use cheapo headphones may have an equally strong preference ("like") for music in general as people who use expensive kit. This doesn't of course exclude the possibility that better quality kit provides more enjoyment.

Matt

Language eh, causes more disagreements than even religion or politics....... :hand:

I agree that in isolation that sentence can be taken in different ways, even saying so in my post (not quoted by Lhc), but 'in context' I thought it quite disparaging to those who choose to spend on better equipment.

It is this lack 'of empathy' for another persons interests that I find quite discouraging, you do not have to share those interests but to be so dismissive of them on a public forum that is supposedly about such interests is disappointing.

Dave, if any of us search hard enough we will find "offence" even in the way a total stranger crosses the road in front of us. If I state that I like the colour blue, does that imply I dislike red? No it doesn't - it means I like blue! You seem to take a contrary view at times because you can rather than through conviction. Why would someone who's spent £1000s on equipment then proceed to take a dim view on people doing so?

It's got jack to do with empathy or lack off - I simply point out that most people don't spend even modest amounts on equipment but enjoy music. That's does not imply that I'm a twit or anyone else here is for spending lots of money to enjoy music more. Many people given the oportunity to listen to a great system may ideed aspire to own a decent setup themselves. My use of word "cheapo" was me being very polite - most free in-ear phones sound objectionable to the extent that even Dr Dre[adfuls] sound good by comparison.

When I read forum posts that feel a little "edgy", I try to work out if I'm being over-sensitive or not - quite often its me rather than the intent of the poster to be offensive.

Most of us on this forum are pretty lucky & content to some degree. I dare suggest that few here have trouble feeding themselves or are being chased by utility companies. Although there will be some exceptions, we live reasonably priviledged lives. Every time I go into Reading, I see beggars - they remind me that I'm much better off than many & that I should not waste my money on toys I'm not going to use. I'm not the loan voice on this thread suggesting that to buy (mostly male) toys that go under-used is if not contemptable, is certainly conspicuous consumption.

I really did not have to 'search hard' to find disparaging comments in your threads, your comments about the chap buying the expensive dac, the person buying an expensive instrument that he cant play are just two of the most obvious examples, and then describing one of them, as you do in the above thread, as 'toys i'm not going to use' really does say it all.

Who are you to say what people should or should not do in pursuit of their hobby? Are you some sort of a control freak, or even worse, a socialist?

I just don't see why you or others on this board should get away with such comments as this without being challenged.

If that is taking a 'contrary view' then fine, guilty as charged.

Oh dear - not having a good day? No Dave, I'm both a Control Freak & a Communist! Socialism is for teachers who wear leather elbow patches & read The Guardian. I don't know what planet you are on but it's not the same one as me. You seem to have trouble with the difference between conceptualisation & example - I said if I was to buy.. Never mind. Look Dave, I can see you're really upset about this. I honestly think you ought to sit down calmly, take a stress pill, and think things over.

Actually I'm having an excellent day and i'm not remotely stressed. Pleased to see that you took the 'socialist' jibe in the light hearted manner it was intended.

I know miss-understanding, reading things into posts, is easily done and I have absolutely no personal beef with you, you happenned to be the only one who stuck his head above the parapet and confronted my views head on, so it was your posts that I used to try and illustrate my position.

If I was to say that I feel there are a fair number of people on this forum who disparage (that word again) hi-fi entusiasts, pigeonholing them as non music lovers with such comments as 'counting the number of times your foot taps' or 'being too busy tweaking to listen to the music', would you agree with that? Genuine question.

Personally I think comments of this kind, both explicit and implicit are commonplace and I think they are, at best lazy stereotypes and at worst deliberate attempts to 'put in their place' those dissenters who hold different views. Not pointing my finger at you here at all, really just making a general point.

Having been on this for forum for a good few months now, I felt it was time these views were challenged.

Thanks for engaging in the debate, i find such things useful if only as an excersise in getting my thoughts across to others, which I always find more interesting than pontificating at length, which I am prone to do.

Anyway, I'm off to be a different kind of idiot today, a few hours mucking about on the river in some stupid race, now where's my wetsuit.

 

[BenLaw]

That response bears no relation to what you said to busb last night. You may be kidding yourself, but I doubt if you're kidding many other people.

 

[npoguy]

Having been on this for forum for a good few months now,

funny, I read that line and thought "that corresponds to the time I wrote a comment about how much I enjoy this site", but I really haven't felt the same since then. I'm still trying to get over your attempt at humor with the woman who came on here a month or so ago looking for advice...unlike most of us, once you offended her, she apparently had the common sense to leave.

 

[davedotco]

Having been on this for forum for a good few months now,

funny, I read that line and thought "that corresponds to the time I wrote a comment about how much I enjoy this site", but I really haven't felt the same since then. I'm still trying to get over your attempt at humor with the woman who came on here a month or so ago looking for advice...unlike most of us, once you offended her, she apparently had the common sense to leave.

Back from splashing about in the water.

That is actually fair comment, an attempt at (I thought) gentle humour appeared to backfire badly, though in reality we have no idea why she did not return, but I genuinely felt bad that her leaving the forum might have been down to me.

 

[npoguy]

Having been on this for forum for a good few months now,

funny, I read that line and thought "that corresponds to the time I wrote a comment about how much I enjoy this site", but I really haven't felt the same since then. I'm still trying to get over your attempt at humor with the woman who came on here a month or so ago looking for advice...unlike most of us, once you offended her, she apparently had the common sense to leave.

Back from splashing about in the water.

That is actually fair comment, an attempt at (I thought) gentle humour appeared to backfire badly, though in reality we have no idea why she did not return, but I genuinely felt bad that her leaving the forum might have been down to me.

DDC

Candidly...that wasn't the response I was expecting. Whether it matters to you or not, I appreciate your honesty.

 

[davedotco]

DDC

Candidly...that wasn't the response I was expecting. Whether it matters to you or not, I appreciate your honesty.

[/quote]

I try to be honest in what I say on here, sometimes people disagree and sometimes I stand my ground with some vigour, but it is rarely if ever personal.

The debate last night with Busb was rather like that, he was the only individual who confronted my views so became the focus of my argument, it is always easier to try and argue specifics rather than generalisations.

Recognising, in retrospect, that I might have gone over the top, I posted a somewhat calmer post earlier today, sure I still think my arguments have some merit, but not to the point of making 'enemies'.

 

[matthewpiano]

Me too. Nothing comes close to live music - one of the reasons we've booked to see 3 of our favourite bands between now and Christmas.

Really? Been to a festival recently? There are loads of venues where the acoustics are awful. I've played in a few of them, and been a spectator in others.

You really have to know your venues, and avoid festivals completely, to get the most from live music (acoustically).

Entertainment-wise, perhaps a different story, but then you're separating music from entertainment. A clown doesn't have to make a sound to entertain.

I don't do festivals or outside gigs. When I go to concerts it is mostly either bands or artists who play smaller venues, or for classical music the Bridgewater Hall and the RNCM. I've experienced some fantastic live sound in places like The Platform in Morecambe, Wulfrun Hall in Wolverhampton, Buxton Opera House, Holmfirth Picturedrome, The Lowry, and Blackpool Opera House amongst others.

When it comes to larger venues I've heard the MEN Arena in Manchester sound both terrible and (in the case of the Eagles and Crosby Stills & Nash) quite superb. The sound for Bob Dylan at the Sheffield Hallam FM arena was absolutey dire and I'd think very carefully before going back there again.

 

[lumarkst9999]

I also love music

 

[Al ears]

I also love music

This thread is 10 years old.