Is there such thing as too much power?

[inbox4]

I currently have a pair of KEF R500s which I'm considering partnering with a Musical Fidelity M6si.

The M6si is a 220w amplifer but the specs for my speakers recommend amps rated between 25w and 150w.

Is this likely to cause any issues or damage my speakers (at reasonable to high volumes)? I know the M5si is rated at 150w so falls within the speaker specs but I would prefer to have the M6si if possible.

Does anyone have any experience of the M6si paired with R500s?

 

[TrevC]

I currently have a pair of KEF R500s which I'm considering partnering with a Musical Fidelity M6si.

The M6si is a 220w amplifer but the specs for my speakers recommend amps rated between 25w and 150w.

Is this likely to cause any issues or damage my speakers (at reasonable to high volumes)? I know the M5si is rated at 150w so falls within the speaker specs but I would prefer to have the M6si if possible.

Does anyone have any experience of the M6si paired with R500s?

It will be fine.

 

[Andrewjvt]

I currently have a pair of KEF R500s which I'm considering partnering with a Musical Fidelity M6si.

The M6si is a 220w amplifer but the specs for my speakers recommend amps rated between 25w and 150w.

Is this likely to cause any issues or damage my speakers (at reasonable to high volumes)? I know the M5si is rated at 150w so falls within the speaker specs but I would prefer to have the M6si if possible.

Does anyone have any experience of the M6si paired with R500s?

No problem with power
Only problem you might have is see the limitations of the speakers

 

[davedotco]

I currently have a pair of KEF R500s which I'm considering partnering with a Musical Fidelity M6si.

The M6si is a 220w amplifer but the specs for my speakers recommend amps rated between 25w and 150w.

Is this likely to cause any issues or damage my speakers (at reasonable to high volumes)? I know the M5si is rated at 150w so falls within the speaker specs but I would prefer to have the M6si if possible.

Does anyone have any experience of the M6si paired with R500s?

It will be fine.

+1

Remember, you are (hopefully) going to play music, which has a dynamic range.

A half decent (or better) recording will have a dynamic range of at least 20dB, so the peaks will be about 10dB above the average power. So your chosen amplifier should be able to produce unclipped peaks of around 300 watts (√2 x 220watts). Average power will be 10dB below that, so 30 watts which I would imagine the Kefs to handle with ease.

You would have to be abusing the system quite severly to have any issues though party situations, where power requirements can rise hugely, should be approached with care.

 

[inbox4]

Thanks for all the input so far.

I'm not interested in the amp from a volume perspective. My current 50w amp is sufficent volume wise.

It appeals to me because I've loved every Musical Fidelity product I've heard in the past and also because I've read that KEF's current speakers (R Series and LS50 etc) benefit from a lot of current/ power.

I've not heard the M6si yet so I'd be very interested in hearing anyone else's experiences of it.

 

[nopiano]

Agreeing with the trend of the comments so far, I'd add that underpowered amps cause far more speaker damage than ones with slightly too much (on paper). You'd have to go crazy to over drive those KEFs.

Regret as to the matching I've not heard this generation of MF ( though I once owned a Studio T power amp - that was a monster), but I wondered if the 5si would actually make more sense. It's just had a fine write-up in 'hifi news'. What especially draws you to the 6?

 

[inbox4]

Being the higher, more expensive model, I'm assuming it is going to sound superior to the M5si. It also appeals because of the greater flexibility it offers in terms of future speakers and having balanced inputs too.

Does anyone know what amp class the M6si uses? I'm assuming class A/B?

 

[CnoEvil]

I'm assuming class A/B?

Yup.

IMO While the M6si is an excellent amp, you should check out other amps around that price, to make sure you have made the best choice. Eg. Ayre, Pathos, Primare, Electrocompaniet and Bel Canto.

 

[inbox4]

Thanks for the alternative suggestions CNO.

I have two further questions:

1) Does anyone think an amp such as the M6 would be too powerful for a small room? Would the volume needed for the amp to be in full stride (rather than ticking over) be too much and overpower a small space?

(I know less power would be fine in a small room but the M6 appeals as I like MF stuff and the effortless authority and grip it would assert over my KEFs appeals to me)

2) Would a powerful amp like the M6 with huge power supplies take ages to run in.? If so, what would that running in period sound like?

 

[davedotco]

1) No.

2) Again no. A few days work for the PSU caps should do it. Might or might not be best when nicely warmed up, not familier with the model so can't say for certain. Most amps of my aquaintance sound better warm, personally I would leave it powered up, use the volume or an unused input to mute the amp when not in use.

Note. Amplifiers that have an 'distinctive' sound require a period of time to run in your ears, so you adjust to the amps 'qualities', the amp does not improve.

 

[inbox4]

personally I would leave it powered up, use the volume or an unused input to mute the amp when not in use.

Thanks for your comments.

Are you suggesting in your comment above that this is different to just leaving the amp on with every other source off. i.e. no signal going to the amp. Surely this wouldn't give the poweramps a work out/ bedding in?

 

[drummerman]

Thanks for the alternative suggestions CNO.

I have two further questions:

1) Does anyone think an amp such as the M6 would be too powerful for a small room? Would the volume needed for the amp to be in full stride (rather than ticking over) be too much and overpower a small space?

(I know less power would be fine in a small room but the M6 appeals as I like MF stuff and the effortless authority and grip it would assert over my KEFs appeals to me)

2) Would a powerful amp like the M6 with huge power supplies take ages to run in.? If so, what would that running in period sound like?

As to your first point ... perhaps.

You are never going to use 200 watts into reasonably sensitive speakers in a small space so you have to ask yourself why you would want that much power.

Depending on your speakers, that 'grip and effortless authority' as you quoted could, in a worst case match, end up as a stilted and mechanical sound, lacking fluidity and 'get-up-and-go'.

I really don't know if the M6i falls into this category and your speakers play an important part in this.

An amplifier with high damping driving a speaker with high inherant, mechanical damping is probably not a good combination unless you like 'dry' bass.

Borrow one and you'll know.

 

[davedotco]

personally I would leave it powered up, use the volume or an unused input to mute the amp when not in use.

Thanks for your comments.

Are you suggesting in your comment above that this is different to just leaving the amp on with every other source off. i.e. no signal going to the amp. Surely this wouldn't give the poweramps a work out/ bedding in?

I was not clear.

Running the power supply caps through a few cycles is probably a good thing, the can behave slightly differently from new, but a few days use will sort that out.

As a separate matter, many amplifiers (of whatever age) sound better when warm, so in normal use I leave my amplifier on at all times, ie when not actually playing. To avoid accidents I make a habit of turning the volume all the way down or switching to an unused input, just being tidy really.

 

[Benedict_Arnold]

You should always turn the volume right down before switching your amp off. This avoids the risk of sparking occurring across the volume knob when you turn it back on, which can over time lead to bad spots on the dial.

Older, transistor and valve based amps benefitted from being left on all the time due to the reduced thermal cycling from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold etc. Modern chip based amps don't benefit as much but it's not a bad thing to do so long as you're prepared to pay for the electricity. Like most TVs these days, some have a standby setting where they stay "warm" without drawing full power and without drawing zero power as if they were unplugged from the wall.

As for amps "running in" I can see that old valve amps might have, and I can see that things like capacitors inside the amp might benefit from a bit of "cooking" to reach a stable state, but the solid state componenets not so much. It may be true that it's our ears actually doing the tuning in, I know that's a fact with my eyes and new glasses, for example. I think it's probably more true that speakers with dynamic mechancial components need to run in: the rubber to relax a little, for example.

 

[andyjm]

Are you suggesting in your comment above that this is different to just leaving the amp on with every other source off. i.e. no signal going to the amp. Surely this wouldn't give the poweramps a work out/ bedding in?

An amplifier isn't the same as a Ford Escort gearbox, and doesn't need 'bedding in'

Did you find your PC ran better after you had used it for a day or so?

 

[CnoEvil]

Thanks for the alternative suggestions CNO.

I have two further questions:

1) Does anyone think an amp such as the M6 would be too powerful for a small room? Would the volume needed for the amp to be in full stride (rather than ticking over) be too much and overpower a small space?

(I know less power would be fine in a small room but the M6 appeals as I like MF stuff and the effortless authority and grip it would assert over my KEFs appeals to me)

2) Would a powerful amp like the M6 with huge power supplies take ages to run in.? If so, what would that running in period sound like?

DDC gave you the answer I would have...No, and No. The amp should sound better once it has warmed up, it doesn't need much else (IMO).

 

[Edbo2]

More Watts don't necessary mean better sound.

 

[paulkebab]

You should always turn the volume right down before switching your amp off. This avoids the risk of sparking occurring across the volume knob when you turn it back on, which can over time lead to bad spots on the dial.

Older, transistor and valve based amps benefitted from being left on all the time due to the reduced thermal cycling from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold etc. Modern chip based amps don't benefit as much but it's not a bad thing to do so long as you're prepared to pay for the electricity. Like most TVs these days, some have a standby setting where they stay "warm" without drawing full power and without drawing zero power as if they were unplugged from the wall.

As for amps "running in" I can see that old valve amps might have, and I can see that things like capacitors inside the amp might benefit from a bit of "cooking" to reach a stable state, but the solid state componenets not so much. It may be true that it's our ears actually doing the tuning in, I know that's a fact with my eyes and new glasses, for example. I think it's probably more true that speakers with dynamic mechancial components need to run in: the rubber to relax a little, for example.

So.. where does that leave hybrid me? New glasses are instantly good, I'm a -8.5 in one eye, -6.5 in the other and they do not need running in to new lenses. Anything mechanical will have a 'newness' to it by its very nature.

More watts gives more headroom on difficult loads or OK loads at higher volume, been there done that.

 

[TrevC]

You should always turn the volume right down before switching your amp off. This avoids the risk of sparking occurring across the volume knob when you turn it back on, which can over time lead to bad spots on the dial.

Older, transistor and valve based amps benefitted from being left on all the time due to the reduced thermal cycling from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold etc. Modern chip based amps don't benefit as much but it's not a bad thing to do

More nonsense. No amplifier ever benefitted from being left on permanently, valves wear out FFS, and the sparking volume control thing is utter twaddle.

 

[paulkebab]

We could substitute twaddle for something else but I don't think it'd go down well.

 

[Infiniteloop]

You should always turn the volume right down before switching your amp off. This avoids the risk of sparking occurring across the volume knob when you turn it back on, which can over time lead to bad spots on the dial.

Older, transistor and valve based amps benefitted from being left on all the time due to the reduced thermal cycling from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold etc. Modern chip based amps don't benefit as much but it's not a bad thing to do so long as you're prepared to pay for the electricity. Like most TVs these days, some have a standby setting where they stay "warm" without drawing full power and without drawing zero power as if they were unplugged from the wall.

As for amps "running in" I can see that old valve amps might have, and I can see that things like capacitors inside the amp might benefit from a bit of "cooking" to reach a stable state, but the solid state componenets not so much. It may be true that it's our ears actually doing the tuning in, I know that's a fact with my eyes and new glasses, for example. I think it's probably more true that speakers with dynamic mechancial components need to run in: the rubber to relax a little, for example.

I would never, ever, advocate leaving a Valve Amp on all the time. A short (maybe 15 minute), warm-up time after switch on is all that's usually required anyway.

 

[Infiniteloop]

More Watts don't necessary mean better sound.

+1 - as my 24 Watter will attest.

 

[Al ears]

You should always turn the volume right down before switching your amp off. This avoids the risk of sparking occurring across the volume knob when you turn it back on, which can over time lead to bad spots on the dial.

Older, transistor and valve based amps benefitted from being left on all the time due to the reduced thermal cycling from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold etc. Modern chip based amps don't benefit as much but it's not a bad thing to do so long as you're prepared to pay for the electricity. Like most TVs these days, some have a standby setting where they stay "warm" without drawing full power and without drawing zero power as if they were unplugged from the wall.

As for amps "running in" I can see that old valve amps might have, and I can see that things like capacitors inside the amp might benefit from a bit of "cooking" to reach a stable state, but the solid state componenets not so much. It may be true that it's our ears actually doing the tuning in, I know that's a fact with my eyes and new glasses, for example. I think it's probably more true that speakers with dynamic mechancial components need to run in: the rubber to relax a little, for example.

I would never, ever, advocate leaving a Valve Amp on all the time. A short (maybe 15 minute), warm-up time after switch on is all that's usually required anyway.

+1 Mine generates too much heat to be left on all the time, a potential fire hazard, and the electric bill would be horrendous. Mine doesn't take anywhere near 15 minutes to stabilise.

 

[Infiniteloop]

You should always turn the volume right down before switching your amp off. This avoids the risk of sparking occurring across the volume knob when you turn it back on, which can over time lead to bad spots on the dial.

Older, transistor and valve based amps benefitted from being left on all the time due to the reduced thermal cycling from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold etc. Modern chip based amps don't benefit as much but it's not a bad thing to do so long as you're prepared to pay for the electricity. Like most TVs these days, some have a standby setting where they stay "warm" without drawing full power and without drawing zero power as if they were unplugged from the wall.

As for amps "running in" I can see that old valve amps might have, and I can see that things like capacitors inside the amp might benefit from a bit of "cooking" to reach a stable state, but the solid state componenets not so much. It may be true that it's our ears actually doing the tuning in, I know that's a fact with my eyes and new glasses, for example. I think it's probably more true that speakers with dynamic mechancial components need to run in: the rubber to relax a little, for example.

I would never, ever, advocate leaving a Valve Amp on all the time. A short (maybe 15 minute), warm-up time after switch on is all that's usually required anyway.

+1 Mine generates too much heat to be left on all the time, a potential fire hazard, and the electric bill would be horrendous. Mine doesn't take anywhere near 15 minutes to stabilise.

Mine is fine from the first few minutes, however it really comes on song after about 15....

 

[Al ears]

You should always turn the volume right down before switching your amp off. This avoids the risk of sparking occurring across the volume knob when you turn it back on, which can over time lead to bad spots on the dial.

Older, transistor and valve based amps benefitted from being left on all the time due to the reduced thermal cycling from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold etc. Modern chip based amps don't benefit as much but it's not a bad thing to do so long as you're prepared to pay for the electricity. Like most TVs these days, some have a standby setting where they stay "warm" without drawing full power and without drawing zero power as if they were unplugged from the wall.

As for amps "running in" I can see that old valve amps might have, and I can see that things like capacitors inside the amp might benefit from a bit of "cooking" to reach a stable state, but the solid state componenets not so much. It may be true that it's our ears actually doing the tuning in, I know that's a fact with my eyes and new glasses, for example. I think it's probably more true that speakers with dynamic mechancial components need to run in: the rubber to relax a little, for example.

I would never, ever, advocate leaving a Valve Amp on all the time. A short (maybe 15 minute), warm-up time after switch on is all that's usually required anyway.

+1 Mine generates too much heat to be left on all the time, a potential fire hazard, and the electric bill would be horrendous. Mine doesn't take anywhere near 15 minutes to stabilise.

Mine is fine from the first few minutes, however it really comes on song after about 15....

I guess those big 845's take a while to warm....