Is it time to go back to LPs?

[andyjm]

Like many I've heard rega planar 2, rega planar 3, Linn Sondek ( an amazing representation of the music I think it was through a Nad 3020 and Linn Kans . - Definitely didn't "suck" ( maybe the "distortion " was drifting through the "ether" in conjunction with the earth's electromagnetic field which maid it sound so good (whiff of "herb" in the air too!)

Tonky, a little research will show that LPs have less dynamic range, more distortion, worse frequency response than CDs. They even have a few problems (wow, flutter, rumble) that don't even show up on CDs at all. As I posted above, technically (as in 'from a technical perspective") LPs suck more than CDs.

I do not dispute that people like the sound, and that is just fine.

 

[tonky]

Digital watches - anologue watches. I think it's music reproduction we are interested in. Not what's on people's wrist.

Like many I've heard rega planar 2, rega planar 3, Linn Sondek ( an amazing representation of the music I think it was through a Nad 3020 and Linn Kans . - Definitely didn't "suck" ( maybe the "distortion " was drifting through the "ether" in conjunction with the earth's electromagnetic field which made it sound so good (whiff of "herb" in the air too!)

Btw brokenflame - v interesting post - can't disagree with much

Despite all this I now stream,internet radio, spotify and cds- Naim Unitilite and epos es14. Thinking of solid state drives too.

cheers tonky

 

[tonky]

Sigh - " a little research " - somewhat condescending -just you I suppose.

I think we all know the theories/ science behind it all (to or greater or lesser degree). I've made my choice It isn't a turntable based system. I've heard plenty of differences (total night and day) between digital sources/dacs.so the digital signal can be altered to some musical effect. I just wouldn't say turntables suck per se.

tonky

 

[tino]

No sure if you are having a mid-life hi-fi crisis but if you have the disposable income and curiosity then just buy a turntable and see where it takes you. If you get one of those latest turntables that are also able to rip music on vinyl and transmit over Bluetooth then that could be a good compromise between your analogue LP v digital hifi dilemma e.g. http://www.whathifi.com/news/teac-adds-bluetooth-capability-to-its-turntables

 

[tonky]

No sure if you are having a mid-life hi-fi crisis but if you have the disposable income and curiosity then just buy a turntable and see where it takes you. If you get one of those latest (Sony, Denon, Technics) turntables that are also able to rip music on vinyl and transmit over Bluetooth then that could be a good compromise between your analogue LP v digital hifi dilemma.

Hi there - no mid- life crisis here (not as far as hifi is concerned ) . Plenty of crisis in my life otherwise!!!. Had a decent turntable rega planar two - excellent it was. Now long gone. I am in the digital camp for good now - no going back! The Naim unitilite is the nearest thing I've heard that reminds of very good analogue ( without the drawbacks). - I enjoy internet radio - spotify - lossless streaming off hard drive or solid state drive. - no going back now ( unless I win an awful lot off money.

I may attempt a good kit speaker at a later date (IPL typeS2TLK I think) - no rush

cheers tonky

 

[nopiano]

Digital watches - anologue watches. I think it's music reproduction we are interested in. Not what's on people's wrist.

Like many I've heard rega planar 2, rega planar 3, Linn Sondek ( an amazing representation of the music I think it was through a Nad 3020 and Linn Kans . - Definitely didn't "suck" ( maybe the "distortion " was drifting through the "ether" in conjunction with the earth's electromagnetic field which made it sound so good (whiff of "herb" in the air too!)

Funnily enough, I thought it was a great analogy. Something that does the job less accurately but more pleasurably.

Now, Linn Kans, they did suck. Pretend LS3/5as that sounded like shouting through cupped hands. Fun, maybe, but horribly coloured.

 

[tonky]

Most analogue watches have a vibrating piece of quartz and so are extremely reliable time wise (as well as being far more stylish etc) - still a lousy analogy as regards hifi tho.

Linn Kans with a Nad 3020 and Linn LP12 - system synergy at its best. Got great reviews from many people - though not by all I'll admit. fwiw I liked them. . Seemed to excel in Naim linn set ups.

The BBC speakers (as good as they are ) would "suck" in this set up - far too inefficient.

regards tonky

 

[LongliveCD]

For me the advantages of subscription and CDs wins over LPs. I can listen and select what I want to buy in spotify. Then I can enjoy my CD colection (most classical and jazz) without the disadvantages of vinyl. After changing my residence several times during last years I finished sick and tired of low-quality music listening and bought a streamer amp. It sounds quite nice but I prefer to choose the CD than stream from USB/NAS. Just select the CD and play it, even in my system it sounds better. Not worries about reliable HDD/SSD or NAS quality. In addition it seems to me that you need to expend an important amount to have a decent turntable system. The CD player way looks to me easier and, also important, cheaper than the others options. For the price of a decent turntable system and LPs I can buy a good CD player and lots of CDs. And no worries about LP cares, playing duration, cleaning and other inconvenients. That's my personal deal for the moment. Maybe when I will have a permanent position I will try with LPs. It depends on the quality of digital recordings on vinyl.

 

[Al ears]

Most analogue watches have a vibrating piece of quartz and so are extremely reliable time wise (as well as being far more stylish etc) - still a lousy analogy as regards hifi tho.

Linn Kans with a Nad 3020 and Linn LP12 - system synergy at its best. Got great reviews from many people - though not by all I'll admit. fwiw I liked them. . Seemed to excel in Naim linn set ups.

The BBC speakers (as good as they are ) would "suck" in this set up - far too inefficient.

regards tonky

How do you mean Tonky?

Although nominally 83 dB they have very high impedence (15ohm normally) and are quite happy being driven by low output valve amps.

Not that i'd want them though because I don't live in a caravan.

 

[tonky]

I've heard low efficiency speakers and they have required quite powerful amps to drive them to decent sound pressure levels. Not heard them driven by low powered valve amps so I can't comment.

Linn Kans 87db/W Rogers LS35a 82db/W - quite a difference in efficiency

One website I looked at discussing the differences ( soundwise) summed it up humourously (I thought)

Rogers LS35a - pipe and slippers brigade - Linn Kans - crack pipe brigade

tonky

 

[davedotco]

I've heard low efficiency speakers and they have required quite powerful amps to drive them to decent sound pressure levels. Not heard them driven by low powered valve amps so I can't comment.

Linn Kans 87db/W Rogers LS35a 82db/W - quite a difference in efficiency

One website I looked at discussing the differences ( soundwise) summed it up humourously (I thought)

Rogers LS35a - pipe and slippers brigade - Linn Kans - crack pipe brigade

tonky

Could be made to sound very good, in the sense that they were enjoyable and communicative.

Very good stands were required and they had to go tight to a wall, so tight that we even made up speaker cables with right angle connectors, the later Kans with the flush mounted sockets could be within half an inch of the wall.

Nobody in their right mind considered them accurate, but for a lot of people, speakers that were small, could go tight to the wall and sounded that much fun, were a godsend.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I understand the benefits of subscription services, no storage cost, a massive library of content etc. But it’s not mine, if I want to listen to the same couple of songs until I’m old and grey, I will have to continually pay for them. It is kind of like saying “please take x amount of money from my account every month until I die”. On the other hand you have iTune, which allow you to lease the song for a one off payment.

Exactly my issue with online streaming services.

Also, am I the only one that likes having a physical music collection, and seeing all the different art work? Yes I rip my CDs so I can listen to them on my phone, but when I’m at home I like to see them all stacked up nice and neat, and I enjoy the physical activity of changing the disk/record every now and again.

I also like to "own" my music collection. Once I own it, I can (rightly or wrongly) do what I want with it. As it is, I rip the CDs I buy to my Innuos, so I can stream them directly into my system when I want to. This cuts down on shelf space.

I do use streaming services and internet radio, but mainly to find new music. Any new music I deem good enough, I'll purchase and add to my hard drive. In this sense, streaming services have their uses,

By no means do I like the hissing, popping and so one of old LPs. But they do sound different.

With good care and attention, and a good quality turntable, these issues are hardly noticeable. Not enough people have heard what a good turntable is capable of.

But on the other hand more and more LPs are pressed from digital sources, which defeats the purpose of LPs analogue sound anyway.

That depends. What you like about vinyl could be the effects of the mechanical replay system, in which case, it doesn't matter if the record is recorded, mixed, and mastered in digital - the turntable will add its own character to the end result.

Now you may think the answer to my question is simple, buy Hi-Res audio discs. While I have a player, I have found it difficult to obtain DVD-audio or Blu-Ray audio discs. The selection seem very limited, and usually of artist before my time. Amazon, HMV, and even HD Tracks don’t really hit the main stream with their collection of 192khz/24bit music.

Multi-channel audio is something I've only gotten into relatively recently (the past few years), and yes, it can be quite expensive, even more so than vinyl. That's if you find a decent amount of titles from a genre you like.

 

[paulkebab]

Why not buy the CD's, rip to FLAC and add DSP to your system? That way you own it and you can tune to the sound as you age and your HF hearing begins to fall away. Records are NOT the way to go in the pursuit of audio Nirvana.

Purchased one a week ago, still playing with it but in my case it's the answer.

 

[tonky]

Hi there paulkebab - how's donna btw?

Anyway - how does the dsp become incorporated into the system ( who makes it? - price?) over what part(s) of the frequency range is it effective and how much "lift" or or depression does it offer+ or - Db.

Hope you can follow all of that.

thanks tonky

 

[Frank Harvey]

Speaking of streaming services disappearing, Aupeo is going to cease to be. Not a vastly popular one granted, but it goes to show that if you're going to rely on these streaming services long term (building a library of favourites etc), you really have to go with the most popular to be in with less of a chance of suddenly losing everything.

 

[paulkebab]

Thanks for asking . I got a Behringer Ultracurve Pro 2496 with the matching microphone to carry out room correction which cost exactly £250 for both. I found quite a few articles on the net and in general the people using it as part of a hi-fi system don't use it as a DAC, just as an equaliser so the recommended way to connect it is before the DAC. Briefly it has 31 1/3 octave bands over 20Hz - 20kHz with +15 -15 dB adjustment. Have a look at the online manual for more comprehensive details, I hope I haven't distracted from the OP! Think I might have to start a new thread?

 

[tonky]

Thanks for asking . I got a Behringer Ultracurve Pro 2496 with the matching microphone to carry out room correction which cost exactly £250 for both. I found quite a few articles on the net and in general the people using it as part of a hi-fi system don't use it as a DAC, just as an equaliser so the recommended way to connect it is before the DAC. Briefly it has 31 1/3 octave bands over 20Hz - 20kHz with +15 -15 dB adjustment. Have a look at the online manual for more comprehensive details, I hope I haven't distracted from the OP! Think I might have to start a new thread?

Thanks for all of that - very helpful.

cheers tonky

 

[manicm]

There are two sides to vinyl. One is the sound yes. This will be refuted again, but there is something about the sound, on a good deck, that digital lacks. Vinyl has a wonderful fluidity in its sound that I don't get in digital. Not to say I don't thoroughly enjoy my cds though, but vinyl has that innate euphonic trait.

And two is the aesthetic, don't believe me? Some blu-rays will be released in 12" gatefold packaging and I will be getting The Force Awakens!

 

[Infiniteloop]

There are two sides to vinyl. One is the sound yes. This will be refuted again, but there is something about the sound, on a good deck, that digital lacks. Vinyl has a wonderful fluidity in its sound that I don't get in digital. Not to say I don't thoroughly enjoy my cds though, but vinyl has that innate euphonic trait.

And two is the aesthetic, don't believe me? Some blu-rays will be released in 12" gatefold packaging and I will be getting The Force Awakens!

There are indeed two sides to Vinyl: Side A and Side B.

Sorry, couldn't resist......*biggrin*

 

[Al ears]

There are two sides to vinyl. One is the sound yes. This will be refuted again, but there is something about the sound, on a good deck, that digital lacks. Vinyl has a wonderful fluidity in its sound that I don't get in digital. Not to say I don't thoroughly enjoy my cds though, but vinyl has that innate euphonic trait.

And two is the aesthetic, don't believe me? Some blu-rays will be released in 12" gatefold packaging and I will be getting The Force Awakens!

There are indeed two sides to Vinyl: Side A and Side B.

Sorry, couldn't resist......*biggrin*

Sometimes there are four.... ;-)

 

[Freddy58]

There are two sides to vinyl. One is the sound yes. This will be refuted again, but there is something about the sound, on a good deck, that digital lacks. Vinyl has a wonderful fluidity in its sound that I don't get in digital. Not to say I don't thoroughly enjoy my cds though, but vinyl has that innate euphonic trait.

And two is the aesthetic, don't believe me? Some blu-rays will be released in 12" gatefold packaging and I will be getting The Force Awakens!

There are indeed two sides to Vinyl: Side A and Side B.

Sorry, couldn't resist......*biggrin*

Sometimes there are four.... ;-)

Or even six *smile*

 

[Al ears]

There are two sides to vinyl. One is the sound yes. This will be refuted again, but there is something about the sound, on a good deck, that digital lacks. Vinyl has a wonderful fluidity in its sound that I don't get in digital. Not to say I don't thoroughly enjoy my cds though, but vinyl has that innate euphonic trait.

And two is the aesthetic, don't believe me? Some blu-rays will be released in 12" gatefold packaging and I will be getting The Force Awakens!

There are indeed two sides to Vinyl: Side A and Side B.

Sorry, couldn't resist......*biggrin*

Sometimes there are four.... ;-)

Or even six *smile*

However none of mine have sides 'cos they're circular...

 

[Alantiggger]

ERM, No..... and why would you even given that CD 'S were the way forward ?

Blu-Ray are now better.

Some Music 'snobs' love this move backward, but it IS backward.

 

[tonky]

If some people want to play LPs on a record deck - that's their choice - nothing "snobby" about enjoying music is there? . Digital can and does make playing and accessing music simpler - that's a fact and many people embrace that.

None of that makes anyone a "snob"

tonky

 

[Issitwurfit]

Going back to LPs can be an expensive business. I knew that- What i didn't know was just how expensive it could be.

Recently went to a Hi Fi outlet near me to enquire about the DAC /player route for flac files. I there saw a turntable which looked the business. Took me back to my LP era, many years ago. ( Never did own a Linn ).

I asked the owner about this turntable, said how nice it was .

He said how much do you think it is?

Haven't a clue, i replied.

£132000.00 he said - thats right 132 thousand. Oh, and you'll need an amp and some speakers!.

Geez