matt49
Well-known member
steve_1979 said:
Of course, you're right about the absence of room interactions with headphones; but the presence of room interactions -- assuming the room is acoustically tame -- is precisely why I prefer speakers! It's having some distance between the source and my ears that makes listening through speakers feel so much more realistic to me.
When you talk about drivers and crossovers, it's worth bearing in mind that not all speaker technologies work like that. My Martin Logans have one driver down to 340Hz, and down at that frequency the crossover is much less audible than in the 'presence zone'. Also there are DSP systems that can significantly mitigate the audible artefacts of crossovers. Meridian have been doing that for years.
EDIT Oh and the Devialet SAM system does it too. *smile*
matt49 said:
I know what you mean. I prefer the 'presence' of speakers to headphones but the clarity of headphones makes up for that IMO. All just personal preference though.
I've never heard any electrostatic type speakers or the DSP Meridian speakers. But I have heard several £10,000+ systems and none of them come anywhere close to the clarity of the HD700's.
matt49 said:
For classical music I prefer speakers to headphones because the stereo image works much better with this genre. With headphones I like them with pop and electronic music.
The DM5's get much more use than the Sennheisers because of the concenience factor of using speakers. With the DM5's they mostly get used for background music and when watching other media like TV and gaming. The Sennheisers stay packed away all week while I'm busy doing other stuff and only come out for an hour or two at the weekend for 'serious' music listening sessions (and recently with Audiosurf too). Only having the opportunity to use them occasionally makes it feel like a special occasion too which probably adds to the enjoyment when using them.
While headphones lack the stereo image and bass feel that speakers provide they more than make up for it by having a level of clarity that even the best speakers in the world could only dream of. Speakers, with their need to use multiple drivers and crossovers to cover the full frequency range and all the added noise that the room interaction adds to the sound could never come close to the sound quality that a really good set of headphones gives you.
gasolin
Well-known member
Infiniteloop
Well-known member
gasolin
Well-known member
gasolin said:
It's only being used as a DAC and pre-amp. The power amp section and all of the other features are unused.
There are plenty of dedicated 2 channel DAC/pre-amps available which are ideal for use with active speakers but I wanted a 2.1 pre-amp with an adjustable subwoofer output. If you want a 2.1 DAC/pre then they're as rare as hens teeth unless you're willling to consider AV equipment.
The Yamaha was a second hand bargain for only £110. Being a budget receiver it's obviously been built to a price and as a result the power amp section isn't going to be the greatest available. But that's of no issue to me as I don't have any passive speakers so the power amps aren't being used.
The only part that I'm interested in using is the digital front end. I've done some instantaneous A/B comparisons with several other high quality DAC/pre-amps* and the analogue output from the Yamaha is totally transparent sounding. When used with a pair of active speakers the sound quality from the Yamaha's analogue outputs is up to the same standard as the best hifi/pro-audio DAC/pre available .
Any correctly implemented DAC/pre will have distortion levels that are vanishingly low and are well below the level of what's audible. It's possible to do this very cheaply too. Any DAC/pre costing more than a few hundred pounds is just an unnecessary audiophool ripoff.
* I've compared the Yamaha to the DAC/pre in my old AVI Neutron system, the DAC/pre in the O2 headphone amp, the DAC/pre in a Teuful DecoderStation and a few years ago I took one to a pro-audio shop and compared it to some of the equipment they had there. They all sounded identical. When done properly all DAC's and pre-amps will sound identical.
gasolin
Well-known member
steve_1979 said:
When done properly ALL of hi-fi will sound the same. But people want choice and voice in the matter.
Vladimir said:
Nothing wrong with that. If some people like HiFi sources that are 'voiced' to sound different then all the better. It good to have different sounding options.
Personally I prefer an audably transparent source. I think they sound best in more situations and you always have the option to digitally alter and 'voice' the sound depending on what media is being used or what mood you're in.
Imagine drinking only strawberry flavored water for 20 years. No wine, no clean water, no juice, no beer. Strawberry flavored water each and every time.
The first bottle is tasty, the second one satisfying, the third one OK, the next few borring, the next annoying and if you havent switched to lemon flavor by now you will stop tasting the strawberry flavor in the next 19.5 years. It will be like tastless regular water.
Flavor, or should I say voicing, exist solely to keep you changing gear, buying, upgrading, riding the carousel, consuming. Everytime your flavor tolerance peaks on the verge of borring and annoying, there should be a ready catering aisle with new flavors and tempting new colours and promises, happy smiling customers just like you grabbing and shoving in their baskets.
BTW people with tube and vinyl based gear are drinking 10 litres of Coke per day. For them you make lemon flavored Coke etc. because good luck taking the black jugs from their cold diabetic hands and giving them nasty Ashley James mineral water.
*ROFL*
The first bottle is tasty, the second one satisfying, the third one OK, the next few borring, the next annoying and if you havent switched to lemon flavor by now you will stop tasting the strawberry flavor in the next 19.5 years. It will be like tastless regular water.
Flavor, or should I say voicing, exist solely to keep you changing gear, buying, upgrading, riding the carousel, consuming. Everytime your flavor tolerance peaks on the verge of borring and annoying, there should be a ready catering aisle with new flavors and tempting new colours and promises, happy smiling customers just like you grabbing and shoving in their baskets.
BTW people with tube and vinyl based gear are drinking 10 litres of Coke per day. For them you make lemon flavored Coke etc. because good luck taking the black jugs from their cold diabetic hands and giving them nasty Ashley James mineral water.
*ROFL*
Vladimir said:
Give me distilled 100% pure H2O any day. That way I have the choice to digitally add strawberry or lemon 'flavor' as and when I want.
Although I've never tried it I believe there's even software that adds vinyl or valve flavors (read that as pleasent sounding distortion) to your digital water if that's what you want.
I used to be a serial upgrader. Now I don't, I just listen to the music. Different tunes provide the flavour.
steve_1979 said:
He uses a Ouija board to tune his black magic actives... because he is demonic and evil... *unknw*
JoelSim said:
Exactly right.
As to nearfield -v- room presented music, give me room sized every time. I just don't feel involved and it is nothing like the live performance with nearfield. When I auditioned the ADM 40s, the first listen was from about 2 metres away and I didn't like them at all. Moved to a decent sized space, they came alive and I was sold.
relocated said:
I think that is the speakers though.
I imagine a floorstander will almost always sound better with room.
I love my ADM9RS nearfield.
In many ways I prefer my old Dalis from 3m.
My next speakers for the "listening area" will be floorstanders.
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