how important is clean power...really ?!?

[BenLaw]

Briefly ignoring the unnecessary thread resurrection, it cost you £30,000?!

 

[MajorFubar]

Think the list price is about £2500. So basically we've established that he has money to burn and can't add up lol.

No wonder I feel I got dealt a cr-p set of cards in life.

 

[ellisdj]

Never short of a joke type comment this forum - I dont see why people bother, its add nothing - not even humour in this instance!

Sorry added an extra 0 by mistake - at even a hundred times the cost its still a lot more to pay.

I felt this thread was worth reviving because of comments I had posted previously and there was consensus with my comments.

Sometimes awareness helps others imrpove their systems

 

[duaplex]

I remember asking Panasonic about Clean Power with regards to my TV, they emphatically asked me "What the hell is that?!"

This area is a little hit and miss, there are some instances where clean power or certain conditions actually proivides a negative impact.

This is a good video below explaining what I mean.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyI85XOKzZ4

 

[ellisdj]

There are different products obviously - bryston clearly state in.the manual no.power conditiong is needed

In my house after listening with £27 tacima plugging directly into the wall is hazy smeared and to me unlistenable.

The positive was a more dynamic sound.

The titan retains that dynamic sound but with better clarity, better treble, better timing etc

 

[ellisdj]

I remember asking Panasonic about Clean Power with regards to my TV, they emphatically asked me "What the hell is that?!"

This area is a little hit and miss, there are some instances where clean power or certain conditions actually proivides a negative impact.

This is a good video below explaining what I mean.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyI85XOKzZ4

I have watched this vid - why I agree to a certian extent what he is saying he is missing the point of the corruption/ noise created within the electrical circuit in a home. Even after you have a dedicated mains line put in there is still noise going to get into the circuit that will be audible.

Its not in the form of a hum - its audible in the playback - to the extent of this is is obviously based on each indivisdual circumstance - however there will be very few cases where its not applicable / benefits cant be made.

To say its not in the high end that power conditioning is used is completely false - Wilson Benesch are associated with Clearer Audio mains products.

The Titan I have was part of 4 units used on a system powering 2 B&W Nautilus - it doesnt get much more high end than that.

Watch this video - forget the sales aspect but take on board / consider what he is saying in terms of things

 

[davidvann]

hi ellisdj,im right with with the mains ,i really thought your pickys of your tv ,do you use a better grade of mains cable for your tv,also is your tv plug in to your titan block.i also think that mains cables work for some systems and not for others,not sure why that is though .cheers david

 

[ellisdj]

Hi David

On the TV I use a clearer audio copper line alpha - the cheapest one with 2 supressors going into a Tacima CS929

If you watch the Isotek video he mentions cross contamination in products like the Tacima - I have alwasy found the least products thats powered off a tacima the better so this goes hand in hand with what he is saying I feel. Hence I have bought 4 tacimas up to now to limit the amount olugged into them

I was 100% happy with them - but my Bryston has not been 100% happy running off one, I dont think my Meridian G55 was before either.

So i looked at trying an alternative option as I couldnt stand to listen to my system with the amp straight off the wall - The Titan came up at a good price used so I am trying it out.

I have only had it since yesterday but my initial impressions have been very good - its not the full cost better than a tacima, but its better enough to warrant it I think.

This has made me want to try more isotek products on the rest of my system and see how it fares compares to the tacima? Is the tacima holding my system back? ATM I have 5 things powered off 1 tacima TV, Processor, HDMI Swticher, Virgin Box, Blu ray Player - all have switching power supplies so def be polluting each other.

I have a spare tacima now to try on the processor alone - that is the dac stage so is the most likely culprit to the effects of any noise.

 

[davidvann]

hi ellisdj,thanks for the reply ,in my system i have a clearer audio 6way block ,in which i have a locus design neculus power cable for my tv,clearer audio siver line optimus running my arcam bdp 300,a clearer audio running siver line my tivo box,another neculus running my pre amp,and a xlo limited edition power chord for my amp also i have 3 quantam syphony rfi emf reducers on my system,i found that they have improved my system,i haven't tryed isotec as of yet but heard they have good reputation with there mains products,let us know how goes eith the titan.cheers david

 

[ellisdj]

Silverline optimus on a blu ray player mate fair play!!

 

[davidvann]

hi ellisdj yep thats one of my favorite cables,my xlo is the best one that i have bought to date,also i bought a furotec wall plug which are really made well a worthy upgrade.

 

[RobinKidderminster]

My freezer engineer tells of a washing machine upset when mains voltage crept up to 240 + ish. Out in the sticks particularly common. Got me thinkin maybe a stable power source could be of value in some situations. No idea if my PureAV regulates or just protects but I guess there is substance to these opinions. Mind you - my washing machine never sounded great.

 

[ellisdj]

My cousin has recommended one of these http://www.airlinktransformers.com/balanced_power_supply/

 

[Native_bon]

Balanced mains conditioners are the best at doing justice to your system. As far as cables go no real benefit. But mains conditioners do the job well, but this can become very expensive & also will depend if you have a problem with your mains in the first place. As far as mains conditioning is concerned always try before you buy if not you may waste your money.

 

[andyjm]

Mains in the UK is generally very clean and well regulated. Messing around with mains filters/conditioners/cables will lighten your wallet, but do little esle.

It is very cheap and easy for an amp manufacturer to include very effective filtering on the mains input to an amp, and therefore they do. So before you go and spend hard earned cash, a simple test will see if you have a problem.

Select an unused input, turn the volume way up, put your ear close to the tweeter. Snap crackle, pop and buzz is RFI, a steady hiss is background noise from the amp. You wont be able to fix the hiss (thermal effects in the amp) but if you have snap crackle and pop then a mains filter MAY improve things.

If you don't have audible RFI noise, then you don't have audible RFI noise, and no amount of filters/conditioners/cables will improve it.

Just as an observation, having lived in the US for a few years in a relatively rural location where the house was fed by overhead cables and a transformer on a pole outside, the mains was all over the place. Having some form of conditioner in these circumstances may make sense. IMO the fad for conditioners is driven by products designed for markets where the mains is very different to the situation in the UK.

 

[davidvann]

hi ellisdj how are getting with your titan,is just the block or is the big mains filter with it,as i beleieve you can hook the two together.wil intrested of your thoughts.chheers david

 

[ellisdj]

Hi David

Its just the titan.powering the power amp and sub at the.mo.

I have been offered a block to try for a fair price, however finances are a bit squeezed. Not a isotek a clearer audio with a lead to link to it.

I have only tested for a short period of time so far but the benefits are there, its one of those youll take for granted until its gone.

There is the delemna - do you use the Titan to power the whole system even.though its designed for high current items

Or look to buy a different product to power the low current items?? Something like a Sirius with dedicated sockets for source components???

 

[davidvann]

hi ellisdj,good luck keep me posted on your findings,have you ever tryed stillpoint at all i found they make a huge inprovement under my arcam player i know it's not mains stuff but have found to bring great effects to the sound,i think when we spoke before you are an essex man have you been to any of the rayleigh hifi group at all. david

 

[Glacialpath]

I had a comment previously that a tacima cs929 was all you needed.

This is false

I have a isotek titan powering my power amp and its significantly better. Its cost about a 1000 times as much but its doing a much better job in this role.

I would say a tacima is not ideal for high current high power scenario. Its better than nothing but not ideal

I plan to try more isotek products to see if they better the tacima as.well

Kieth from Isotek told me that due to the construction of the Tacima it stifles the dinamics of the audio. I have 2 and a TCI Constrictor 6 way and must confess I haven't done a comparison. Of course Keith could just be saying it to put people off Tacima.

A mate of mine has An Isotek Sirius EVO3 so I might ask him to bring it over so I can compare. I have not plugged my AVR or BD player into my Tacima because I figured Keith know's what he's talking about especially if his company sells products £200- 20.000 (or there abouts) These components at plugged straight into my mains using Isotek Premium mains cables and them alone do a pretty good job on there own. Obviousley I would rather them in a conditioner. I've said it elsewhere but I put my mates Isotek Sirius on my old CRT. I had no idea and SD picture could look so good. I was annoyed I had been watching such dirty picture all these years, almost all of us have.

So yeah in my mind mains conditioners make quite a big difference, in sound and picture.

The Cable Madman (Glacialpath) :rockout:

 

[mr malarky]

because I figured Keith know's what he's talking about especially if his company sells products £200- 20.000 (or there abouts)

[/quote]

Obviously there's no conflict of interest here on Keith's part...

 

[ellisdj]

Keith may have vested interests but he is also right.

Tacima are good but not for all duties.and not.compared to better products

 

[bubobubo]

interesting it seems some amps sound better without power conditioners, it should be better if it was a conditioner inside the amp?

or why not run music with a big battery? i realise music sometimes sound so great when listen with car battery or when listen portable with a battery *biggrin*

 

[FunkyMonkey]

interesting it seems some amps sound better without power conditioners, it should be better if it was a conditioner inside the amp?

or why not run music with a big battery? i realise music sometimes sound so great when listen with car battery or when listen portable with a battery *biggrin*

Precisely. If clean, constant power weer that important, like computers or cars, hifi equipment would run off DC power.

It's all boolsheet.

 

[bubobubo]

ok hihihihi *scratch_one-s_head*

 

[Benedict_Arnold]

 

interesting it seems some amps sound better without power conditioners, it should be better if it was a conditioner inside the amp?

 

or why not run music with a big battery? i realise music sometimes sound so great when listen with car battery or when listen portable with a battery *biggrin*

 

Precisely. If clean, constant power weer that important, like computers or cars, hifi equipment would run off DC power. 

 

It's all boolsheet.

They all do. Internally anyway.

It's a question of how constant the DC output from the rectifiers are, and thus how good the rectifiers and smoothing circuits in the DC section are.

If the AC supply voltage isn't constant then the DC output of the rectifier won't be either, so smoothing circuitry is added to try to keep the DC output of the power supplies at a constant (5?) Volts.