Help with a pair of Focal Aria 948 please

[aahonari]

Hi there, and welcome.

Coming from the warm cosy sound of yesteryear, Devialet + Focal would indeed be a bit of a shock. You are combining two components that have a very clean, detailed and "hear-through" sound.

If you like the Devialet, then you might look at speakers from Sonus Faber, Harbeth and Spendor Classic range. If you want to stick with the Focals, look at SS amps like Sugden, Electrocomaniet and Arcam; or Valve amps from Unison Research and Icon Audio.

Hybrid amps from Croft or Pathos could also work for you.

I used to own a pair of Chorus 836, but I upgraded to Electra 1038. From my experience I can tell you Focal speakers definitely produce brighter highs in comparison to a vareity of other speakers within the same price range. I can also tell you with confidence that the Focals do not lack in producing taut punchy bass. However, matching a complementing amp is essential for your Focals. CnoEvil in particular, Matt49, and Iceman16 helped me in my quest for pairing a great amp with my speakers. Seek their adivce. IMHO, based on what you have provided. you're experiencing an amp-speaker mismatch.

In addition to a matching amp, you definitely need proper cables (speaker cables, interconnects, and power cords) in your setup, in order to smooth out the highs and generate an even more punchy bass. I do realize that all of these creates more costs, but in the end it is absolutely worth it.

 

[hifikrazy]

Yup the Source, sorry guys forgot about the source ....

This is the source, (my dealer let me have it as a test) Its a Krell (dont know the model) that is directly feed to the Devialet by an optical cable, its reproducing regular sound comercial CD´s. Never thought that the problem could be there *dash1* It looks like quality equipment, but as a newbie I can´t tell:

I hope is a quality source *pardon*

You certainly have a lot of quality gear for a newbie, with apparently more to come with SF Olympica being auditioned as well.*good*

I did recently listen to the Athom with the Devialet with SAM, and wasn't all that impressed. I think the Olympica should be better.

 

[CnoEvil]

I hope this is a quality source *pardon*

It most certainly is.

Given how much you are prepared to spend, do not go with anything that doesn't leave you truly delighted. The dealer is obviously prepared to help (and so he should), so use his knowledge and expertise (and brands that he stocks) to the full....ask plenty of questions.

Make sure you have a very varied range of your best loved music to listen to, both good and bad recordings....especially ones that are too bright with your existing equipment.

 

[CnoEvil]

I used to own a pair of Chorus 836, but I upgraded to Electra 1038. From my experience I can tell you Focal speakers definitely produce brighter highs in comparison to a vareity of other speakers within the same price range.

I hope you are still delighted....the system should be settling in nicely.

 

[aahonari]

I used to own a pair of Chorus 836, but I upgraded to Electra 1038. From my experience I can tell you Focal speakers definitely produce brighter highs in comparison to a vareity of other speakers within the same price range.

I hope you are still delighted....the system should be settling in nicely.

Very !!! ... The sound keeps getting more and more pleasant. I think I still need another 50 hrs for a complete run-in! I'm a happy man! lol!

 

[Krorghar]

Many thanks guys, today is the day, and the dealer is coming here as I am writing this ... Hope I could finally get the sound I´m looking for. Will keep you updated. *biggrin*

Btw aahonary, what amp did you finally got for your electras pls?

 

[CnoEvil]

Btw aahonary, what amp did you finally got for your electras pls?

He uses a Musical Fidelity AMS 35i (Full Class A).

 

[Infiniteloop]

The one thing not mentioned is your source. - Could this be the start of your problem?

I recently heard the Devialet 200 with some Focal 1008Be's and Focal Diablo Utopia's.

(The 1008Be's and the Utopia's are well regarded for bass response!)

These combinations were superb, with certainly no lack of Bass. Clean, clear and musical.

The source was a MacBook Pro running Audirvana+.

Maybe some bookshelf speakers might suit your room better?

You kept that under your hat....how about a more detailed write-up?

It's this new website. I find it really difficult to come to terms with.....

Anyway, since you asked, I was very impressed with the Devialet. Very detailed and smooth, so not fatiguing at all. During the audition I found myself really enjoying the music, rather than trying to be critical about what I was listening to. I found the Devialet 200/Focal 1008Be combination very satisfying even though it's different to the type of sound I'm familiar with (a big, warm, romantic sounding 845 valve Amp). I asked the dealer to swap the 1008Be's for the Diablo's. Big mistake. Now I'm totally ruined.... I listened for a while with a big smile and then he SAM'ed them up. They were a completely different speaker. Still very detailed and transparent, but the soundstage became much wider and the music far richer and much more organic. To say SAM makes an enormous difference is a gross understatement. The dealer said he'd just got back from Focal where they had about 70 pairs of speakers awaiting the SAM process. The 1008Be's are amongst them. I guess that, on reflection, the Devialet with SAM makes the speakers disappear.

Whilst I was there, I had a very quick listen to a Burmester set up with Olympica III's. These were very rich, but sounded 'thick' too. The sound was very definitely coming out of (very attractive) boxes, and didn't do the disappearing act anywhere near like the Devialet 200/SAM/Utopia combination.

I'm overseas on business right now, but when I'm back, I will be placing my order.

(Apologies to the OP if I have Hijacked the thread somewhat.)

 

[Tzutzu]

"The dealer said he'd just got back from Focal where they had about 70 pairs of speakers awaiting the SAM process. The 1008Be's are amongst them."

Excuse my ignorance, but what is SAM?

Thanks

 

[CnoEvil]

Excuse my ignorance, but what is SAM?

Thanks

http://en.devialet.com/technology/devialet-sam-en/

 

[matt49]

Anyway, since you asked, I was very impressed with the Devialet. Very detailed and smooth, so not fatiguing at all. During the audition I found myself really enjoying the music, rather than trying to be critical about what I was listening to. I found the Devialet 200/Focal 1008Be combination very satisfying even though it's different to the type of sound I'm familiar with (a big, warm, romantic sounding 845 valve Amp). I asked the dealer to swap the 1008Be's for the Diablo's. Big mistake. Now I'm totally ruined.... I listened for a while with a big smile and then he SAM'ed them up. They were a completely different speaker. Still very detailed and transparent, but the soundstage became much wider and the music far richer and much more organic. To say SAM makes an enormous difference is a gross understatement. The dealer said he'd just got back from Focal where they had about 70 pairs of speakers awaiting the SAM process. The 1008Be's are amongst them. I guess that, on reflection, the Devialet with SAM makes the speakers disappear.

Whilst I was there, I had a very quick listen to a Burmester set up with Olympica III's. These were very rich, but sounded 'thick' too. The sound was very definitely coming out of (very attractive) boxes, and didn't do the disappearing act anywhere near like the Devialet 200/SAM/Utopia combination.

I'm overseas on business right now, but when I'm back, I will be placing my order.

(Apologies to the OP if I have Hijacked the thread somewhat.)

Good to hear about your experiences with Devialet/Focal and SAM. It's becoming clear that SAM is much more beneficial with some speaker designs than with others. From what I've heard myself and from reports by other Devialet owners, it seems two-way speakers (like the Diablo Utopias) benefit most. Your positive report fits into the emerging pattern.

:cheers:

Matt

 

[CnoEvil]

Anyway, since you asked, I was very impressed with the Devialet. Very detailed and smooth, so not fatiguing at all. During the audition I found myself really enjoying the music, rather than trying to be critical about what I was listening to. I found the Devialet 200/Focal 1008Be combination very satisfying even though it's different to the type of sound I'm familiar with (a big, warm, romantic sounding 845 valve Amp). I asked the dealer to swap the 1008Be's for the Diablo's. Big mistake. Now I'm totally ruined.... I listened for a while with a big smile and then he SAM'ed them up. They were a completely different speaker. Still very detailed and transparent, but the soundstage became much wider and the music far richer and much more organic. To say SAM makes an enormous difference is a gross understatement. The dealer said he'd just got back from Focal where they had about 70 pairs of speakers awaiting the SAM process. The 1008Be's are amongst them. I guess that, on reflection, the Devialet with SAM makes the speakers disappear.

Whilst I was there, I had a very quick listen to a Burmester set up with Olympica III's. These were very rich, but sounded 'thick' too. The sound was very definitely coming out of (very attractive) boxes, and didn't do the disappearing act anywhere near like the Devialet 200/SAM/Utopia combination.

I'm overseas on business right now, but when I'm back, I will be placing my order.

(Apologies to the OP if I have Hijacked the thread somewhat.)

That all sounds brilliant.

One thought before you plunge for the Diablos....would you consider giving the New Kef Reference Three a dem when they come out (end of July), as I think they will also be a great match with the Devialet (the Blade is certainly supposed to be)?

Nb. The Ref Three are are £1800 cheaper than Diablos + Stands; and having the same drive units as the Baby Blades, they will give a very clean, detailed, articulate but not clinical sound, while having more scale/authority than a Standmount.

If you are spending this sort of money, you have nothing to lose but a little time. *biggrin*

 

[CnoEvil]

Many thanks guys, today is the day, and the dealer is coming here as I am writing this ...

How are you getting on?

Have you arrived at your destination......or is your journey continuing again? *scratch_one-s_head*

 

[Krorghar]

Sorry for the delay Guys, yesterday was a crazy day. Well my dealer could only bring the Olimpicas, since the tube amp, DIED in the shop when he tried to make a test before bringing em *wacko*.

Anyway first of all, here are the pics:

It seems that these two small and crazy expensive pieces of italian art, work by reflecting the bass wave on the wall behind them, so we cleared that area of all the stuff we could. These two little monsters sounded in my room noticeable better than the focals (Aria 948), I got more bass, and the sound seemed warmer and to fill the room more.

BUT I think that the improvement is small for a pair of speakers that cost allmost the double than the Arias (2700€ vs 4700€). Problem here is that I am entering in a zone, where the equipment starts to cost a fortune. The devialet alone is very expensive (for me) and with the Olympicas, is allmost 12000€ Much more than the sum I was planing to waste in the begining. There must be something cheaper that sounds like I want, or maybe I´m asking for the impossible here.

Tomorrow I will go to the dealer´s shop and listen to more Stuff, I´m not buying blind again for sure. My dealer told me that he can get the Olympicas II (those are like the Olympicas I but with an extra bass cone):

He sais that I can test them, and return them without problem If I dont like them. They are Floorstanders but reduced in size, these may be the ones, BUT again expensive as hell (7500€) I dont feel like wasting so much money in the amp, and the Speaker´s, and with a Rega RP10/Apheta Turntable on its way (that allready exausted my economical reserves) it would be crazy to go for them.

What do you think guys? Should I jump into them? Maybe Another options?

P.D Cno, Answering your question my friend, the trip is near to its end, I see the light at the end of the tunnel, but the train ticket is getting ridiculously expensive *dash1*

Again many many thanks guys.

 

[Krorghar]

Sorry, double post

 

[unsleepable]

Taking into account the arrangement in your room, I would avoid back-ported speakers. You just don't have much free space there, even without accounting for the glass.

I understand that you can only exchange the Focals by other gear from the same dealer, right? What vendors do they carry? Anyways, I myself wouldn't be comfortable having the dealer constantly pushing more expensive stuff.

Why I don't get is why wouldn't you prefer some speakers that you can also enjoy while seating at the computer. Good enough speakers would also work well at your listening position. I think you'd just maybe need to give some space between your desk and the back wall to place them nicely. For the sort of money you seem to be willing to spend, you'd have many and great options.

 

[matt49]

Does your dealer have any of the older Sonus faber models? e.g. the Cremona M (floorstander) or Cremona Auditor M (standmount)? These would be quite a bit cheaper than the Olympica models.

It does sound as if your dealer is encouraging you to spend money that you don't want to spend.

Would it be possible to return the Focals to the dealer and take the Devialet in part-exchange? You could then look for some speakers elsewhere.

Or if there's no other dealer near you, could you (as unsleepable suggested) tell us what other brands of speaker your dealer has?

Matt

 

[hifikrazy]

To be quite blunt (without any offense intended), I would just get a decent system at maybe a 1/4 of the budget that you are now starting to stretch to. Given your room layout, you'll never going to get first rate sound and the Krell, Devialet and Olympica is just going to be a massive overkill and waste of money. Firstly, as mentioned by others here, those glass cabinets aren't doing the room acoustics any good at all, and then you also have a big table with computer gear right smack in the middle of the two speakers so you'll also never going to get decent imaging, and to top it off, at least one of the speakers is being pushed into the room corner which is also bad news.

I would just get sealed box bookshelf speakers like the ATC SCM19. You could get a powerful hybrid amp to drive them (something like the Unison Research Unico Secondo or 50), and a network player like the new Marantz NA8005. That should give you a nicely weighted sound with warmth, that would not be any less satisfying than the Krell, Devialet, Olympica combo.

 

[hifikrazy]

I know I have a real problem here with the room. My dealer has also told me, that he can install a wall picture, that is made of some anti-reflective stuff, in the wall where the bed is (the opposite from the speakers), to help improve the room a little. But i dont know what could be done with the cristal expositors.

I wouldn't bother with that. With the bed behind your listening position, that means there's about 7 feet to the wall and plenty of absorption (the mattress, pillows, etc) so that's not where the problem is. The bigger problem is the TV on the wall behind the speakers. Like I said in my previous post, lots of acoustic problems that I understand cannot be fixed as you explained earlier, so don't bother spending so much money.

Since the Focal 948 have been purchased, keep them first. Return the Devialet and Krell and Olympica. Get a Unison Research Unico (the best model you can afford) or a valve amp as suggested above, a Marantz NA8005 and the turntable and I dare say you'll be much happier with the sound and your bank balance will be happier too. Don't bother buying a CD player anymore. Even if you have a big CD collection, all of them can be ripped onto a NAS (I see you're into your computer equipment so all that should be easy for you).

 

[CnoEvil]

FWIW. Here would be my advice:

- Don't get rushed/pushed into spending money. Take your time, and listen to everything suitable within budget.

- If you do not think you are getting value for the extra cash, look at something else. When you hear the right combination of Value vs Performance, you will know it.

- I think you could easily find that Valves are for you, especially given the sound you are chasing. So make sure you listen to any Valve amps he may have that are in budget.

- Keep an eye out for Amp brands like Jadis and Unison Research, which have a lovely rich, romantic presentation. Acoustic Research, Audio Note and Pathos (Hybrid), are also wonderful, but a little less "rose tinted".

- I don't know what speakers he has, but if he sells Valve amps, he must have suitable speakers....check for brands like JM Reynaud, Audio Note, Proac and Harbeth.

- Check to see if dealer has any Cremonas, which have the more "old school" SF sound ie. richer and smoother....you might even like the Toy Towers.

- I think you can achieve what you are looking for on a smaller budget, but I think it could well be around Valves; for example something like the Unision Research "Simply Italy" with some Audio Note speakers (AN-J or AN-E or AZ-2), might do the trick.

- If going Solid State, look at Class A eg. Sugden, Luxman, Accuphase.

 

[Krorghar]

Hi again guys, many thanks for the advices.

Dont get me wrong guys, Theres one thing that I understand as clear as water, and that is that I have the last word when dealing with my Dealer, he may offer many products, but in the end its me who decides what to buy. *good*

The focals are allready returned, and my dealer is informed that I won´t be keeping them, I am in my perfect right to return a product if Im not happy with it, I know that. There are other product allready bought, like the Rega TT and a5.1 sound system, so no obligations of any kind. On the other hand, I feel morally predisposed to get my speakers from him, since he has shown his willingness to Help, and he will be keeping the Focals in the shop, to resell em (at his loss), I think that deserves some kindness. Also the krell is just there as a sound source, Im not keeping it, since I Dont have CDs and will only play vinyls when the TT arrives *biggrin*

That said, is ovbious that the guy wants to sell, and since I´m willing to buy, He is just offering me their "Delicatessens" thats Why I am coming tomorrow to the Shop to check other posibilities. To be Honest I really like the devialet, and I would love to find some speaker partners for it, preferably that are in the Sam list, and that can give me the bass im looking for. The devialet 120 is 5000€ and the 200 is 7000€ and I will happily pay for them, but first, I want to hear some tube amp to decide which one will give me what I am looking for.

That I dont want is having to spend another 7000€ to get speakers suitable for the Devialet (or the amp I finally choose), I was looking in the 2000-3000€ range for my speakers, in this field I´m lost to be Honest. Tomorrow I´ll ask him, and see what brands he got available, so you guys could help me decide please.

Again many many thanks to everyone in this awesome forum *good*

 

[matt49]

If your main source is going to be vinyl, the Devialet is an excellent choice. It contains a superb configurable phono stage.

Matt

 

[CnoEvil]

One member on here (DocG) has a Devialet with Kef LS50s (£800), which are SAMable. They are a truly awesome speaker for the money, so maybe worth a listen on the off chance your dealer has them.

It will be easier to advise when we know what brands your dealer sells....can you give a link to his website (if he has one).

Nb. Venere and Olympica are the new (more modern sounding) breed of SF, which is why you should see if something like the Toy Towers (£1400) would give you a lot of what you are after (in your difficult room).

I still think you are a "Valve Man" at heart. *wink*

 

[Krorghar]

Yup CnoDevil sorry, Didnt think about the web, *dash1*:

Here is my dealer, web is a bit clunky, but it hope it helps, here you can see the brands he got. It´s in spanish but i think u can choose English in the options.

http://www.danielsonido.com/

@| Matt, Yup, thats one of the reasons I am considering the Devialet, a high quality Phono stage, sofware configurable, that should adapt perfectly to the Apheta MC capsule that comes with the Rega RP10, (the 200 model has a slightly better MC phono stage) that should allow me to pass on the phono Stage that I had ordered (a Rega Aria) and connect the TT directly to the Phono Analog entrance of the Devialet.

 

[unsleepable]

So you live in Sevilla. I'm also from there, and know the shop. They carry B&W—and since you seem to be set on keeping the Devialet, maybe something like the PM-1 is worth a listen too.