From AV receiver to pure AMP

[record_spot]

there are good musical recievers out there but won't touch a good stereo amp...

Beg to differ. Matched some good time ago.

 

[Native_bon]

Like cno said this can be done up to a price point. Yes majority of 2 channels amps are still better, but some Av amps up to a price point are just as good. With advance tech these days unlike days gone by, Av amps are much better at playing two channel music.

The question is how many have had a listen to an Av amp with 2 channel music for the last year or so. The likes of Arcam, Marantz, Anthem or Onkyo.

 

[Sorreltiger]

Going all the way back to what NS496 said, even if you're not interested in taking advantage of surround sound, I believe that the addition of a properly set up sub could be transformative.

 

[Covenanter]

I ditched my (Sony) AV setup when i refurbished my apartment and now run film sound through the DAC in my SA8005. It sounds brilliant. Without the sub you do lose some of the visceral effects but you could get those back. I don't miss the surround sound as my speakers provide a really nice soundstage.

Chris

 

[Leeps]

I use my system 70/30 in favour of music.

I love my AVR's way it makes music (despite it not being among the AVR's considered to be more musical) and in particular its tweakability that I'd really miss if I went back to a stereo amp (which is what I had before). When playing most music I use extended stereo through all speakers and the soundstage is palbably lifelike. Close your eyes and you're right there in the jazz club. Piano in particular is spot-on.

If I want thumping bass, my sub can willingly oblige, but I can use other settings for late night listening.

I use the built-in Airplay to stream Tidal. It has all the HDMI and digital connections I need.

And when playing movies, it's much much better (and again far more tweakable) than my former stereo set-up. It also sounds marvellous playing multi-channel SACD and Bluray, which I'm gradually collecting.

So for me, I'm well pleased with my all rounder. The other benefit of AVR's is the way their value depreciates very quickly. Buy a year or 2 old model and you can save a great deal. My £800 RRP AVR cost me £500. And IMO, it sounds like an £800 machine. But I would say that the difference between a budget and midrange AVR is quite noticeable.

 

[drummerman]

So for me, I'm well pleased with my all rounder. The other benefit of AVR's is the way their value depreciates very quickly. Buy a year or 2 old model and you can save a great deal.

A very good point. You can buy a top model which is a few years old for next to nothing. If choosing carefully, some have immensly powerful and sophisticated power amplfier section whilst still offering more facilities than most even very well endowed stereo amps.

For value I don't think you can better a good AV a few years old. For sound you probably can but it will cost.

I use both a cyrus system and one thats based on a Sony STR DB930, a long discontinued model and arguably one of Sony's finest (Receivers). - I love both and the Sony has been quoted as bettering a multi thousand pound Conrad Johnson system. Indeed, there is something valve like about its playback.

 

[Vladimir]

Stereo amps being better than AVR for music is somewhat of an audiophile myth. I reckon there are good amps and bad amps, regardless in which form they come. And Yamaha can really build good AVRs, for movies and music.

"I'm not sure at all what to do next with my system..." this usually means you have an itch ($) but no actual need. What in particular with your current setup you find lacking? We can't offer a solution to a nonexisting problem.

What's missing?

 

[Balloonatic]

Wow, thanks for all the inputs *good*

Ok so I think I'll look for a subwoofer but doesn't know a lot about it. I would automatically look for the Q Acoustics 3070s sub to match my system, but is it possible/worth looking elsewhere?

Vladimir: It might be a lot of itching but I think it also might be the lower frequencies (it's lacking some punch I think).

As for the receiver I don't know where to look. Maybe I should start with the sub *biggrin*

 

[Native_bon]

It has Pre-outs, or the amp can be disabled so it can be used as a Source. If you have a Linn dealer near by, get them to go through it with you.

There is also info on the Linn website.

Thanks for the info.. Will check it out. I think Graham HIFI in london are dealers for Linn will give them a ring. *good*

 

[Balloonatic]

Ok, I've been looking at some new AVR's instead. As it's not possible to audition these here in Denmark apparently I'll try to ask for your help here - don't know if it's possible for you to answer though.

I've found a Yamaha RX-V679 and a Onkyo TX-NR646 at around 500 pounds, which is around my price. Do you know anything about these and how they will perform music wise with my Q Acoustics 3050? The Onkyo has a AK4458 Asahi Kasei DAC while the Yammy has a Burr-Brown. Currently i stream from Spotify but will change to Tidal in the near future.

 

[Mihai]

The integrated amp will outperform the AV receivers in the same price bucket. From the connectivity point of view, you could connect all your HDMI devices to your TV and use the optical output from your TV to feed the DAC incorporated in Marantz PM6005 or any other standalone DAC. This way your TV will become the source switcher (commander).

I recommend you go to your local dealer and make a comparison between an AV receiver and an integrated stereo amp in the same price bucket, and report back your conclusions .

 

[record_spot]

Just get a decent current amp, bypass the stone age integrated. Just my 2c.

#mischiefmaker

 

[Andrewjvt]

Ive owned 3 Av amps from yamaha, nad and denon and none of them came close to any of my dedicated stereo amps for music playback.

Now they sounded good but something was missing to me. The emotion or something just was not there.
They go loud enough but to me not a comparison to my old sansui, my nad c270 and roksan kandy k2 and by miles nowhere near what the hegel can do.

 

[record_spot]

I think people just buy into the perceived wisdom that infects hifi as a hobby.

I owned a Sansui AU-217 and a 717, a NAD 3020A, a range of Marantz amps and God knows what else. Nothing missing with my AV amp picking up the duties. Nothing.

Andrew Everard's review of the Onkyo amp I own helps put those audiophile myths right where they belong:-

http://www.gramophone.co.uk/editorial/onkyo-tx-nr818

And you should see what the Anthems can do....

 

[Vladimir]

If this wasn't the case, only people with technical (engineering) background would practice it. The anecdotal paradigm helps lawyers, bankers, dentists etc. join in. The market bends towards the ones with most disposable income and as a result we have lack of standards and lots of snake oil being sold by reputable manufacturers, stores and media. Basically anything goes. The technically ignorant dentist will gladly pay 400 quid for cables if this is generally endorsed, but the engineer will object and growl. Now put those two types with anonymous avatars on a forum and see what happens. *biggrin*

 

[Native_bon]

If this wasn't the case, only people with technical (engineering) background would practice it. The anecdotal paradigm helps lawyers, bankers, dentists etc. join in. The market bends towards the ones with most disposable income and as a result we have lack of standards and lots of snake oil being sold by reputable manufacturers, stores and media. Basically anything goes. The technically ignorant dentist will gladly pay 400 quid for cables if this is generally endorsed, but the engineer will object and growl. Now put those two types with anonymous avatars on a forum and see what happens. *biggrin*

Very well said. Be it an AV amp or 2 Channel will boil dwn to good or bad design. My av amp has buckets of emotion and power to spare. Also will drive just about any speaker load, yet some stereo amps cannot, yet does it clean.

 

[CnoEvil]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I haven't bought into perceived wisdom, or Audiophile myths.....I just tried a variety of AV amps from Yamaha, Pioneer, Anthem and Arcam and compared them to a whole variety of 2 channel amps.

Saying that, my AVR600 is exceedingly good for music....but it was expensive (even if I did get it at the original pricing). It's replacement, the AVR750 is better again, but is itself beaten by the A49 (IMO).

 

[record_spot]

Perceived wisdom? In Audio?

The hobby is ridden with it. And not for the better either.

 

[record_spot]

Nothing wrong with buying blind. Works best that way I think. Get it in your room and switch it on. The DSR regs cover the consumer adequately.

Reviews? Sure. But from a wide array of sources.

Where I differ is some of the tripe that gets passed off as fact: AVR amps don't "do" music, the bilge around cables when people can achieve a bigger sound change by moving their speakers a little, and so on.

 

[Vaprak001]

...Record-spot. There's enormous amount of cobblers spouted off by the industry, but you shouldn't let that blinker you against possible elements of truth either.

Case in point is my Onkyo TX-NR1010 of which (like you) I'm a huge fan. It's massively capable in terms of sound and functionality, in multi-chanel or Stereo, but use it as a pre with a M5000R power amp and the gap is instantly apparent (in stereo at least). The combination used as a 2 +3.1 set-up really improves the whole overall sound - fronts digging out more detail and the rears being brought joltingly back to life. Substituing Pre duties with the P3000R opens the gap even further.

I know the M5000 is a comparitively expensive machine, but this scenario has highlighted to me that given two good amps from the same brand (and usually playing very loud like I do) I'd expect, even demand, that the dedicated stereo amp showed a clear pair of heels to the generalist amp. Not all makes might show similar principles to Onkyo however.

 

[CnoEvil]

Perceived wisdom? In Audio?

The hobby is ridden with it.  And not for the better either.  

I don't disagree, which is why people buy on star ratings or blind from the net based on other people's impressions or advertising spin.

I have been in this game (like you) , for a very long time. I have arrived at different conclusions (based on personal experience, like you). C'est la vie.

 

[CnoEvil]

Nothing wrong with buying blind. Works best that way I think. Get it in your room and switch it on. The DSR regs cover the consumer adequately.

That's OK if you are experienced and know what you're doing / looking for.....otherwise I think it's better hearing a variety of kit, preferably in one place. Its much easier to compare this way, especially if one is fairly new at this.

 

[Balloonatic]

So just a little update.

I ended up buying the Denon AVR-X2200W and using it for bi-amping my Q Acoustic 3050's. I think I'm at that place now where I'm quite pleased. I've got all the features that I need and the sound is warm, rythmic and controlled *dance4*

Thanks for all the inputs.

 

[rainsoothe]

congrats, enjoy